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评论来自 Axelon9

does this increase the critical strike chance by 50%? as in 50% plus your normal crit? or does it do exactly as it says (its worded unusually) and increase the chance to crit TO 50%, regardless of your actual crit chance?

评论来自 30515

I guess thats the point for going dual wield, because with 2h this gonna proc about every 8th-10th strike, which is once in around 20-25 seconds(with haste talents), which is *really* rare.

评论来自 34485

Is it worth specing into this is you are going Frost tank? Tanks use 2h so this will proc every 20sec about and than its ONLY the next spell you do.
I can imagine that this is a nice talent if you go duel-wield but most tanks wont do that but for lvling it could come in handy.

评论来自 18074

I find this really helpful in pvp, since it lets you control your burst damage more. A proc from this followed up with Deathchill can do some pretty nasty burst damage.
I would recommend you get some kind of mod to track when it procs though, I use SCT.

Also, even using a slow 2H I feel this procs fairly often, enough that it makes a noticeable difference when you're watching out for it.

评论来自 Zerul

Giving this another chance since I respecced to PVE Frost, I've got to give this much more credit than I have before. With 20% crit, I find this proccing very often. I would recommend this for PVP even if you use a slow 2her because it may be just what you need to set up a 2 Bloodstrikes for Death Runes -> Guaranteed KM Crit -> Guaranteed Deathchill Crit -> Empower Rune -> 3 Howling Blasts/Obliterates, all in a matter of 7 seconds in Unholy Presence.

评论来自 293633

Changed to PPM rate of 1/2/3/4/5 in 3.0.8 (old 10/20/30/4050% crit on auto attack) according to MMO champion. This should be a nerf for DW DPS builds (i doubt it will ruin the spec though), and a buff for frost 2 handed builds.

Ah yes, i forgot it's a nice huge buff for tanks too! Thanks for the correction Fireflower.

评论来自 Bloodsword

Patch 3.0.8

- Killing Machine now gives your melee attacks a chance to make your next Icy Touch, Howling Blast or Frost Strike a critical strike. (Old - 10/20/30/40/50% from critical strike)

评论来自 305358

This ability has changed with the new patch it now does not have a 50% chance to proc on any auto attack crit, it has a higher chance to proc with slower weapons on a auto attack crit and a lower chance to proc with faster weapons. the exact chance I assume would be based on the speed of your weapon.

评论来自 250654

with this spell now being normalised with weapon speed, what the hell is the point in dual wielding...

评论来自 Feralix

You DO NOT have to crit on an auto attack for this to go off. This can proc on ANY auto attack.

评论来自 92164

"Probably a good rule of thumb is that anything that can be silenced is not a melee attack."

Rather, why not look at anything that's melee as a melee attack? X D It says "melee" on the tooltip of the ability.

Also Sexytool, "Solo on a training dummy i saw on average 3 procs per minute." < where you only using AoE here? 3 procs a minute seems very low, the uptime of my KM is close to constant.

评论来自 293302

I have heard several people say, that Killing Machine still procs more on DW, even though it's PPM-based now.
If that is correct, then I would consider that a bug, as it would ruin the idea of a PPM-based Killing Machine.

Can anyone confirm or "bust" this myth? =)

评论来自 angelife

you are covenientely forgotting, or don't know that, as of current patch, killing machine

1) proc from main hand alone if dual wielding

2) can proc from melee abilities( basically: anything that does damage in % of weapon damage).

given that from white damage the PPM is the same, the fact it can proc from melee abilities with the same proc % of the weapon wielding, it will always be better using a 2hander from a PPM point of view.

taking your number. with your 2hand sword your white attack have a 26.9% of proccing it, melee istant abilities have a 26.9% change of proccing it.

with 2 1h sword, your *main hand* have 17% of proccing it, your offhand have 0% of proccing it, your melee istant abilities have a 17% change of proccing it.

given that the amount of special attack we do is the same regardless of weapon speed, a 2hander is better

评论来自 voz808

I was reading one of the blizzard forms on the new KM based on PPM and my understanding is...

Basicly per minute, for 5/5 KM, you will get 5 KM procs.

Even if you have a 2h wep with a 3.0 speed thats 20 melee swings in a minute with a 5 ppm thats 5/20 which is 1/4. (One out of every 4 swings will proc KM)

For DW, a 1h with a 1.0 speed thats 60 melee swings per minute, and with a 5ppm your getting 5/60 = 1/12 (One out of 12 melee swings will proc KM)

The PPM stops duel wielding DK's to gain dubble effectivness out of this talent thats why its pros per minute, no matter how fast or how slow you smack people your still getting only 5 procs per minute. (not sure if it has a ICD to make sure people dont get more then 5 ppms, but if it doesn't DW may be able to sneek in one or two extra procs. Which isn't as bad as getting twice as many procs for DW then 2h DK's)

评论来自 226474

Basicly per minute, for 5/5 KM, you will get 5 KM procs.

Even if you have a 2h wep with a 3.0 speed thats 20 melee swings in a minute with a 5 ppm thats 5/20 which is 1/4. (One out of every 4 swings will proc KM)

For DW, a 1h with a 1.0 speed thats 60 melee swings per minute, and with a 5ppm your getting 5/60 = 1/12 (One out of 12 melee swings will proc KM

More correctly:
. . . for 5/5 KM you average 5 KM procs.

. . . a weapon with 3.0 speed (20 melee swings per min) will have a 1/4 chance to proc KM each hit.

. . . a weapon with 1.0 speed (60 melee swings per mint) will have a 1/12 chance to proc KM each hit.

There's a big difference between getting 5PPM and averaging 5PPM. If there is an official word from Blizz that the former is what they mean this time, by all means post a link. I mean, I'm sure it's possible to create a 5 proc cap. But the latter is what it always means in my experience.

Which isn't as bad as getting twice as many procs for DW then 2h DK's

There is nothing "bad" at all about DW DKs getting more KM PPM. There are other drawbacks to DW:

- increased opportunities for your opp to parry
- smaller PPM percentages on instant attacks (Blood Strike, Frost Strike, et. al.)
- talent point dedication to Nerves of Cold Steel
- much, much, much higher miss chance

extra KM procs is not some exploit DW DKs abuse . . . it compensates for the other drawbacks. It provides a mechanic to build around, to find synergy with.

And though in theory it's possible to get twice as many procs DW, in practice it doesn't happen.

- PPM chances are calculated chances per hit, meaning the higher miss chance works against DW.
- PPM chances are higher for 2H weapons, meaning more procs off instant attacks

Those factors can be taken into account (use a slow MH weapon, stack on hit & expertise if you can do so without damaging other stats), but getting DW hit capped is impractical and you aren't going to find a MH weapon as slow as a 2H weapon. So while DW will end up with more PPM, it won't be twice as many.

评论来自 225109

edit3: I don't mind much about getting downrate, but at least have the courtesy to explain why my post deserves one. :)
Please try not to downrate any post because you think the information of the post is wrong.
I strongly believe what I wrote here to be a fact. It's not a hard core theory crafting and such, but a simple data collecting anybody can do.
I will be surprised if there isn't any data about KM procs in elitistjerks.

side note: people who say they seem to see more KM procs than 5 per minute, I have one word for you, 'Haste'.

------------------------------------
(I used bold letters on 'melee attacks' to distinctly compare the difference between (auto-attacks) and (auto-attacks + special attacks
melee attacks refers to (auto-attacks + special attacks)

I have tested reasonable amount of time desperate to figure out how this thing works.
I did not use any addons that tracks proc effects so there might be a margin of error in my statement but I'll go on for now.

Summarizing what I have read here,

As it says melee attacks, it's safe to conclude KM will proc from special melee attacks.

First, I disagree with the 1st fact everyone seems to agree on.

KM does not proc from special attacks. It only procs from melee auto-attacks.

I used a 3.5 spd weapon which can be calculate into 29.2% chacne to proc KM from so called melee attacks
That's safe to call it 30% chance to proc KM with every auto-attacks + special attacks.

And considering how many melee attacks you can pump up in 60 seconds using every runes, I have not seen KM proc that often.
Now, let's go into statistics. (I used PS and DS for special attacks)

In 60 seconds, with 3.5 spd weapon, you will auto-attack 17 times.
In 10 seconds span, you can use 2 PS and 2 DS. In 60 seconds you will use approx. 24 special attacks. (in 61-62 seconds actually but close enough)
That's total of 41 melee attacks.
You should see approx. 12 KM procs within 60 seconds. But in fact you need about 2 min to get that amount of proc. (got 14 procs in 2 min when I tested it)

Conclusion: The tooltip is another one of Blizz's mistake in wrong phrasing.

And now with the major question, 'Will KM proc off from FS?'
I should have bought the glyph and tested it but oh well.

The answer is 'No, KM does not proc from FS'

Well, I guess, as I have stated in my first argument that KM only procs off from auto-attacks, this question is irrelevent, but this question was the main reason I started testing so I will still explain some detail.

Like I said above, I didn't use any addon that tracks procs. Just expanded combat log and eyed the whole thing and the buff I received.

I have not seen any KM procs when using FS starting from 130 RP.
Game mechanics seems to calculate the KM buff first and apply it IT, HB, FS usage. Thus FS itself will not be count as an attack in KM mechanics but consuming the buff to get an automatic crit.

As far as I know, there was this kind of issue since Vanilla WoW that made some spells extremely overpowered. Proc occurs, and then a spell that benefits from that proc will again proc that proc to get a back-to-back benefit.
I forgot which class it was, but I think it was Paladin, Rogue, Lock or Mage....somethin'......which means....I have no idea what idea I have X-D

Hope this clears everything. Any different results are welcome.

Edit: Oops...I forgot the final conclusion I was going to make seeing this result. I decided to not pick up this talent in my Tank specc. 5-point is a lot of point that can be spent elsewhere. I guess I'll be using Deathchill for the situation that needs auto-crit

edit2: wrong word choice

评论来自 63586

You look really stupid when you spell it wrong twice in the same thread, caps and underlined.

DEFINIIVE ANSWER

The word is "definitive".

评论来自 359519

To Tobindax: this absolutely belongs in a frost tanking build. From Satorii's DK tanking guide at tankspot:

As a final item for threat consideration, I want to talk about the use of Death and Decay as Frost. Death and Decay appears very appealing to tanks in concept because the damage has a bonus threat multiplier. That said, Death and Decay is a poor fit, and not particularly needed for Frost tanks. The answer why is simply that Howling Blast really holds its own, especially when supported with Blood Boil. DnD further cramps a Frost style as it will consume 3 runes, which will interfere with your even pairings for FU abilities. There are places where the spell will be strategically convenient as a utility, but on the whole I do not recommend using it for general threat, and I don’t recommend going out of your way to buff it.

评论来自 darkwarrior42

That is not how a proc per minute system works. Crusader, Mongoose, and many other abilities are based on a proc per minute system identical to this, and all of those abilities can proc off of special attacks.

Note that Blizzard said "procs *based* on autoattack hits", not "procs *only* on autoattack hits". What they mean by this is that the percentage chance of proccing this abilities is based off your auto-attack.

As an example, say you have a weapon with speed 3.0. You will attack 20 times per minute. If you have an ability with an average PPM rate of 5, then you will get, on average, 5 procs out of those 20 attacks... in other words, you would have approximately a 25% proc chance. This is calculated based on your weapon speed. Now, this is the percentage chance used to calculate whether or not you get a proc on ANY qualifying attack.

Crusader, Mongoose, Berserking, Weapon Sepecializations, and numerous other abilities ALL use the wording "chance on melee attack" to refer to both auto-attacks and special abilities. I have personally witnessed many of these abilities proccing off of specials (sinister strike, specifically). All Blizzard was confirming in the post you linked is that this is, in fact, the system that Killing Machine uses.

In other words, Blizzard's post does not in any way prove that KM procs only off of auto attacks. If it did, you could use that same post to prove that Mongoose does not proc off of sinister strike, which is a false statement.

Edit: This does not necessarily mean that Killing Machine isn't the exception to the rule. I don't play a Death Knight myself, so I have no idea. My only point here, really, is that what the last poster claimed is not proven by his supposed 'evidence'. It'd be like me saying I'm a male, and using as proof the fact that I wear glasses. The fact that I wear glasses proves nothing about my gender, yet the claim I'm making (that I am male) still happens to be true... just for reasons other than the one I gave.

评论来自 defektunge

That means nothing. PPM just means that the proc chance is based on weapon speed; it does not say anything about what attacks will proc it. In the words of Ghostcrawler: "It is on a proc per minute system, 1/2/3/4/5 at 5 ranks. It procs based on autoattack hits."

Autoattacks only. The fact that the tooltip is unclear is irrelevant, since Blizzard have clarified the exact meaning.

Blue post.

评论来自 Taraezor

There's a bit of argy bargy here in the comments so I'll cut straight too it. Most posts are pretty much on point with people arguing semantics or whatever.

The tooltip is plain wrong and has always been wrong.

Proc is off your auto attacks only. Proc is not off "melee attacks" which in WoW means auto attacks plus your spells/talents (aka "specials").

Greg Street himself said the ranks are Procs Per Minute. So rank five is 5 ppm. Thus regardless of weapon speed (which you use to calculate auto attack swings: 60 / WS = number of swings per minute) you'll get on average 5 of those swings with KM procs.

Additionally, our spell (aka special/ability) attacks do not affect the frequency at all. We're just going to get about 5 ppm (at max rank) in any sliding one minute window of a fight.

If you are programming then the buff you'll be testing is 杀戮机器

链接

杀戮机器

杀戮机器

天赋

你的近战攻击有一定几率使你获得下一次冰冷触摸、凛风冲击或冰霜打击必定爆击的效果。触发几率比杀戮机器（等级 4）更高。

法术细节

持续时间

n/a

类型

物理

机制

n/a

驱散类型

n/a

GCD目录

n/a

成本

无

范围

0码 (自身)

施法时间

瞬发

冷却

n/a

GCD

0秒

光环触发几率

100%

效果

Apply Aura：Proc Trigger Spell
价值：1
PVP 倍率：1

	杀戮机器

标记

[Is Ability]
被动技能
隐藏光环
隐藏施法时间
[Can Proc From Procs]

杀戮机器

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