Comments

Comment by 39530

Pally finally get a HoT.... I will be definitely be going for this!

Comment by hntd

An all around excellent trinket. Gives paladins something they fundamentally lack in a Heal over time. As well it gives them something that will help them combat rogues with a damage over time, so if a rogue decides they don't want to play anymore it makes it a little harder for them to get away. I wonder if the trinket benefits from +healing and +spell damage.

Comment by greengoo

This trinket is superior in ways to all other classes' trinkets due to the fact we gain two fully viable abilities from it, most other classes gain one. However the benefit comes in that we can use both of our abilities on the trinket without needing to rework gear or "forms", like druids for example.

Overall this makes this the trinket that every paladin everywhere should have.

Comment by Thyder

where do i buy this? a vendor? a quest? quatermaster?

Comment by 49410

hi.. its a nice trinket.. but im wanna know if the DoT that have a chance to procc is holy dmg or some other kind of dmg ..

Comment by 43826

/Rabbid (sp?) Paladin

WHERE WHERE WHERE?!?!?!
HOW HOW HOW?!!?

/Rabbid (sp?) Paladin

Comment by Yoshura

i just short circuited my PC with drool

i hope there is a way to get their rep other than black temple... or else 1% of all paladins will have one

anyone able to confirm a soloable, or even 5 manable way to get the rep?

Comment by 54630

This will be a very nice addition to Healadins and Tankadins but I wouldn't use this as retri simply because it will break repentance.

Comment by 60910

Not that good for healing imo.. since there's no passive +healing or anything. Just an uncontrollable proc, that isn't very useful.

The judgement part of the trinkets seems pretty promising though, for PVE tanking/dps or non-retri PvP.. since, well, having a DoT on your enemy target isn't very nice if you plan to cast repentence on him.

So imo, it's a great tool for paladin PVE dpsers, maybe tanks?, and spelldamage PvP paladins.

Comment by Jurus

The proc on this really doesn't do much via protection paladins, although our threat is generated by our holy damage, there are far better trinkets to go for that keep us alive, rather than cause more threat. As it stands paladin threat is well above that of other classes even before calculating in +spell damage or extra damaging procs. Altogether the proc is just a fancy way to deal a little extra, non-required damage for tanking. Far less useful than trinkets that compliment your ability to tank in the sense of overall defensive abilities.

Comment by 33836

Horrible trinket.

I've had it for a while, and used it on various occasions to check it out (Black Temple + Mount Hyjal), and I really don't find it useful at all, trinkets such as Essence of the Martyr (https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=29376) + Ribbon of Sacrifice (https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=28590) are a much better combo to use.

To further ridicule this trinket, the proc is even canceled out by renew, not sure on vice versa. Either way, it's a waste of money. (I wonder if it break Repentance to).
Plus, to be honest, it hardly proc 15%, more like 2/5%.

Big thumbs down.

Paladins could really use a HoT, I agree , but this trinket is by far NOT the answer.

Blizzard should rework this trinket, and have it give a passive +healing buff, plus removing the collision with Renew. Then it'd be worth using at least.
Can't complain to much though, exalted with Ashtongue Faction takes about 2 weeks of Black Temple.
Still doesn't justify the crappyness of this trinket - Not to mention, all the other classes get amazing trinkets, why can't we?

Comment by 10334

This trinket screams arena, although the renew conflict sucks. Hopefully that will be fixed soon.

Comment by frmorrison

As of patch 2.2, this will proc and refresh its duration every time you refresh a debuff judgment -- so it's basically up 100% of the time. Assuming RF affects the holy damage it deals, the trinket is worth a passive 80 TPS with 1h spec.

In addition, the HoT you get from healing nows stacks with renew.

Comment by Slummish

The first tick procs immediately when the heal lands. So, if you have the numeric healing display on, you see 8500 (+190) eg. Which is nice for those as obsessive as myself.

Comment by zomg123

Simply put, this gives Paladins something they don't have; HoTs and DoTs.

Comment by 87010

For the HoT what would sell this item for me is if instead a 15% chance on spell cast, It was a use, Put that guy on my Action bar, I'd find a use for it.

Hey Draenei get Gift of the naruu, The blood elves Gotta find some HoT love somewhere =(

Comment by Ysaiel

Since the 2.3, it seems that the judgement DoT effect procs a lot more rarely.

Before, it has a 50% chance to proc after a judgement, or a refresh of a judgement from a melee hit. Now it seems that it does only has a chance to proc after a judgement is cast.

Can someone confirm ?

If it's true, then it makes this trinket a lot less attractive. The healing proc is already not really worth it in my opinion, and the judgement (i.e. retribution use) DoT was really interesting before 2.3, but is it still now if what I've noticed is true ? I doubt it

Comment by 41033

I fail to understand why so many people think the retribution component of this trinket isn't good. Considering the proc is up about half the time, its basically a flat 30dps making it probably the second best ret paladin trinket next to Darkmoon Card: Crusade.

Unless there's something I'm missing?

EDIT: Got my hands on the trinket and it turns it out its affected by vengeance. By itself the trinket ticks for 120 damage 4 times, with 3 stacks of vengeance it ticks for 172-173 damage 4 times, bringing this trinket up to 43 flat dps. This is by FAR the best ret paladin trinket in the game to date. Period.

I also suspect it has a small spell damage coeffecient, even with 3 stacks of vengeance the ticks vary depending on how many times the spell damage buff from my crusade trinket has stacked up. I can't see any benefit from judging crusader though. Will report back. ^^

Comment by Slummish

Although this may be a bug or a broken aspect of the trinket, I can confirm, once the dot has been applied, it randomly refreshes itself like a judgment would when you melee the opponent.

I doubt this is intended... because if it and when it lands (which at 50% chance is virtually guaranteed on the first application) all you have to do is auto-swing to keep the dot going.

Nice. Overpowered. Probably will be changed soon.

Nevertheless, anyone who talks smack about this trinket is either retarded, or... no, just retarded.

Comment by 65062

Can anyone confirm if the damage component is Holy Damage?... that would make this trinket an extra 57 Threat Per Second for a Prot pally looking to maximise threat output.

Comment by 123962

Here are my thoughts about this trinket from a healing point of view.

Let's say you equip this trinket and spam cast FoL: if you cast at general cooldown (unlikely) you get 40 casts per minute. Since the HoT effect procs on a 15% chance and 40 casts per minute is the fastest frequency you can possibly get, you will have a mean of 6 procs per minute off it. The proc heals a total of 760 hit points, so 6 procs mean that you are getting 4560 hit points healed per minute (that is about 266 +healing which sounds quite good, but...).
This ONLY if you spam at general cooldown, if the percentage of procs stays at 15% (on the long run we can assume this as true) and the HoT has 12 seconds to tick off (which is as likely as casting at GCD - rarely a healing target does not get capped in a few seconds after getting damaged, and remember that to have the HoT to proc you have to have healed a target), so I guess the HoT will have time to tick once or twice before going in overhealing (does it fade if the target gets to full health?).

I find this trinket quite bad, frankly.

Comment by 126025

To wrap it up:

Truely awefull for healing, imba for dps...now if only more then 2% of the raiding paladins where specced retri this might have actually been a very good idea.

Its nice enough for soloing tho, but i guess we all rather wanted to see something more usefull.

Comment by bloodvalor

Just did a little math. Another paladin in my raid group uses this quite often, and I took it upon myself to compare this trinket to the one I would think about replacing (Tome of Diabolic Remedy).

On an Illidari Council fight (long fight) this trinket did 2% of his healing. That equals out to 18,430 healing according to WWS. Tome of Diabolic Remedy gives 18/5m (along with the on use effect, but I'm leaving that out). Our Illidari Council kill was 13m25s long (second kill ever). If you break that down into seconds, that is 805seconds / 5 = 161 ticks of 18mana. 161x18 = 2,898 mana.

His average healing for Flash of Light during that attempt was 1,647 (251 casts). He used max rank FoL which costs 180 mana. 2,898 / 180 = 16.1 casts of FoL.

16x1,647 = 26,352 healing or 7,922 more healing than the talisman.

This doesn't include any chances for crits (possibly more healing) with those heals, or any overhealing (waisted mana) that might occur with those heals. I also didn't count in the on use effect of the ToDR.

Final thoughts. This trinket is OK. Great for any fights where you might want a small hot. But I consider ToDR far superior for any skilled and competent healer. Results will vary based on many different circumstances. This is just one example I thought people would like to see.

Comment by Nemil

Unless there's something I'm missing?

There is. Namely on-gear stats that scale with your gear versus the one's that don't. Attack power stat is one of the non-scalable ones. An item with 50 AP remains an item with 50 AP whether your total AP is 2k or 3k, actually contributing much less to your overall dps as your gear improves. On the other hand an item that gives you 20 expertise will "grow" with your gear, giving you ever more actual damage increase as your total AP grows. Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal, unfortunately, falls into the second category, with a certain FLAT DoT effect on the target. It will never scale with your gear. That is why the "scalable" stats, such as haste, armor penetration and expertise are the best ones for any melee dps class.
Back to our trinket now. By using Bellator's DPS spreadsheet (http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t17193-paladin_retribution_dps_theorycraft/ ) with it's default settings (namely best available gear at this point), Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal comes out nowhere near the top trinkets available for a raiding retadin. Actually there are no less than 9 (!) trinkets with better dps output out there, at the mentioned top gear level. The top 3 are:

Shard of Contempt
Darkmoon Card: Crusade and

The first ( https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=34472 ) is a clear winner with 36 extra DPS compared to Ashtongue Talisman (!). The reason, of course, is expertise - prolly the best scalable melee stat so far.

Comment by Chronalis

After getting exhalted with these guys a few days ago, been testing this thing in PvP with the judgement effect. The dot it places on a target does appear to scale with JotC, but only slightly. It procs a fair amount, but as with any proc, it's not always at the best time. I'm prot spec, and as such, don't have many problems with melee. Rogues are easy....until they vanish. I've yet to have one vanish since i got this, and yet to have it apply to them when they try to vanish.

It's 120 damage every 2 seconds. For PvE, it equates to about 110 TPS +/- 5. Personally, i use DMC: Vengeance as the stamina is more what i'm after. However, for TPS, i imagine this would be pretty good and it most certainly procs a lot more. Also, if it's gonna proc, it procs regardless of the judged seal, so even JoW, JoL or JoJustice. JoJustice in particular is nice in PvP as it slows the target to a normal pace and when the proc procs, it adds a DoT, handy for the people who thought they could get away.

Comment by 180278

Why do you have to make your math so complicated? It's really quite simple. For a holy pally, this procs 15% of the time (every 6.66 casts). That means it on average adds 114 points to each heal. That's better than any other +heal trinket I've got.

If you're spamming Flash of Light with 1.5 seconds cast time, it'll proc about once every 10 seconds. If you're got some spell haste too, it would proc even more, about once every 8.6 seconds for me in the spell haste gear.

Casting Holy Light every 2 seconds means it procs once per 13.3 seconds. With my haste, it would proc every 11.5 seconds, which mean the HOT is pretty much always up.

If you're running BT (which you gotta be to get this), then you know pallys are casting pretty much non-stop, and usually on the MT and OTs. We spam FoL & HL (full or down-ranked), depending on how the tank is getting smacked around. Our targets are taking constant damage, so the HOT is very useful. Now, I can see if you're raid-healing, then a lot of those ticks may not get used. But for tank-healing, this is the sex.

Here's another thing -- your +heal is reduced for down-ranked spells. This isn't! So when you're spamming Rank 5 Holy Lights, you get the full +114 average healing per cast. That makes this trinket even better than the flat +healing ones, equivalent to a trinket with +150 or more. It totally does not suck.

So this is an awesome trinket for pallys who main-heal the tanks in high-damage fights -- better than probably any other. Just a couple more BT runs to exalted, and I'm equipping this baby.

Comment by 201836

It's only up 50% of the time, so cut your 110 TPS in half.

Comment by Baranor

As of 11 April 2009, this trinket is bugged.

For a PVP specced retri paladin (0/18/53) this old little diamond has an 100% procc rate for some reason, out of 72 Judgement of Command casts it procced 72 times and out of 59 Judgement of the Martyr casts it procced 59 times. Thus, with simple maths this is 480 / 6 = 60 DPS fixed, and with all the various +damage % modifiers from the retribution tree and all other damage modifying debuffs, this really is a great trinket even at 80.

Comment by Allakhazam

Imba for pvp and pve!

Comment by Thottbot

Absolutely godlike

Comment by Thottbot

omg this owns. a heal over time spell finally. and another dot too.

Comment by Thottbot

Got dammit this trinket almost makes up for the massive nerf!

Gief now!

and finally blizzard realised that palas ned a tick on judgment XD, I've been nagging about that for years

Comment by Thottbot

Requires Ashtongue Deathsworn - Exalted

says enough i think :)

Comment by Thottbot

I just want to know if the damage over time is holy damage or just normal.

Comment by Thottbot

Wait i just need to know something, is the Hot from flash of light and holy light the same?

Comment by Thottbot

the only way to get rep for this trinket is by doing black temple or is there another way?

Comment by Thottbot

giiiiiiiiiiiiiiiieeeeeeeeeeffffffffffffffffff

Comment by Thottbot

Using this trinket together with Fel Reaver's Piston (https://www.wowhead.com/wotlk/item=30619/fel-reavers-piston) would be a sweet combo... 15% chance from Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal to place a 720 HoT over 12 seconds, and another 15% chance from the Piston to place a 500 HoT over 12 seconds.

I atleast, wouldn't like to fight a paladin using those trinkets x)

Comment by Thottbot

I just got this trinket and it's aweful for healing.

I wouldn't ever use that over any of my current trinkets.

Therefore I like the extra damage for PVE ret. I use that over Tome of Fiery Redemption.

Comment by Thottbot

The dot breaks PALADIN repetance
GG blizzard

Comment by Thottbot

jesus h christ dual wielding this and the fel reaver's piston would give paly healers the edge over other all the other healing classes (finally) with HoTs

Comment by Thottbot

Where can I get this awesome Trinket?

Comment by Thottbot

whats the best way to get exalted with these guys?

Comment by Thottbot

Got exalted today and have been testing this trinket, i have to say it's not that great.
As a paladin i prefer Pendant of the Violet Eye combination with Divine Illumination/Spell crit over this.
After using this in a successful Teron Gorefiend down, it shocked me that the trinket was only responsible for 2% of my overall healing especially since i was raid healing.
This trinket is far better for PVP than it is for PVE as the DPS component is far more reliable.

Comment by Thottbot

Compare this to the shaman or rogue trinkets (average 132.5 ap and 72.5 crit rating respectively) and you will realise the whooping 30dps that this trinket gives us (and doesn't scale at all with weapon upgrades) is an absolute piece of %^&* for any decent raiding ret paladin.

Comment by Thottbot

With modifying ret talents, it comes to 40 dps.

Comment by Thottbot

this trinket is a slap in the face for all raiding Paladins! Holy or Retribution this trinket sucks! Compared to the other class trinkets its really just a bad joke!

i'm a Ret Paladin and got exalted 3days ago. Been testing it in Heroics and in ZA these last days. and it just doesnt feel very "epic".
it does scale with +spelldmg tough. but since a Raiding Ret Pala has about 0 Spelldmg its a total waste. It might be fun for a Shockadin. I'm going to test the Healing component the next time i Raid as Holy.

Comment by Thottbot

If the HoT scales with +healing, a primary stat for healadins, then the DoT should scale with attack power, a primary stat for retadins. Even better, change the proccing spell from Judgement in general to Judgment of Righteousness/Vengeance, and add a third proc of increased attack power or crit for Crusader Strikes. That really tailor makes it to be helpful no matter what spec you are, which is what I think all the talismans are trying to accomplish. It doesn't make it OP to have all those abilities because they each rely on a specific spec for their strength.

If the HoT/DoT doesn't scale with gear, then this could be mediocre at best. Given the choice as a holy pally, it'd be tough to choose this trinket over the Fel Reaver's Piston or the Tome of Diabolic Remedy. They at least have mp5.

Comment by Thottbot

O.O Shockadin must have.

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Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal

	Phase 1

Item Level 141
Binds when picked up
Unique

Trinket

Requires Ashtongue Deathsworn - Exalted
Equip: Flash of Light and Holy Light have a 15% chance to grant your target 760 healing over 12 sec, and your Judgements have a 50% chance to inflict 480 damage on their target over 8 sec.

Sell Price: 7 20 39

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This item can be purchased in Black Temple .

Ashtongue Talisman of Zeal

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