New warrior tank, as bad as everyone says?

Сообщение от Xepp

Hi!
I have a tendency to be a sort of a fotm class roller or maybe you can say I get easily boored. The thing is that I cant really find any class (so far) interesting enough in all aspects of the game.
Atm I got 9x lvl 80s, one of each class except hunter. (I played since vanilla beta so dont think I leveled all these 1-80 since wotlk).
My recent toon is a 80 warrior and I must say I really like playing arms warrior. It takes me back to tbc when I loved running around in bgs and smashing ppls faces.

Anyway as much as I like pvping I like to tank and I have tanked most raids as druid, paladin and dk and I must say paladin/druid tanking is so easy. I never had to worry about threat or anything.
But while I was leveling my warrior I tried tank HoL at 78 as warrior and I must say it was pretty stressful. Sure, on bosses it was no problem but on trash I wasnt really sure that I got aggro on all mobs and nowdays dps are soooo triggerhappy. So this lead me to a few questions I erally cant find a good answear for in the stickies or in any thread (if I missed any pls spank em around a bit and show me where).

1. Are warriors alot worse then the other tanks (wich I think are all very good for aoe threat) in multiple tanking and how should I do it when tanking lets say 4-5+ mobs? What more then shockwave and thunderstomp (or what it is called) do warriors got for aoe tanking?

2. Overall I hear that warriors are waaay worse then paladins (fotm tanks) overall but I also hear that all tanks are capable of tanking all bosses in all raids, wich is it? Is it that tanks are pretty close but warrior tanking require a little bit more mind into it then lets say druid-one-macro-spamming-tanking?

Thanks in forehand!

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Сообщение от Porcell

I use two main buttons to tank as a warrior, it's really not complicated, even for aoe pulls. I tank mostly heroics, which is where this works best. For larger raids, you'd probably want a different set up.

Meh, it pains me to see anyone suggesting poor, lazy play like this.

Сообщение от 237581

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Сообщение от Porcell

If you have more than 4 mobs a pally will tank it better but all hope isnt lost, use tclap every cooldown and save shockwave for when someone pulls aggro.

I can't really say I agree with holding off on Shockwave. The best way to manage rage is to make sure you float rage between pulls so you aren't so dependent on getting hit. Shockwave puts a solid 4-5k threat into each target, which I find hard to give up.

Сообщение от twitch77

1. Are warriors alot worse then the other tanks (wich I think are all very good for aoe threat) in multiple tanking and how should I do it when tanking lets say 4-5+ mobs? What more then shockwave and thunderstomp (or what it is called) do warriors got for aoe tanking?

2. Overall I hear that warriors are waaay worse then paladins (fotm tanks) overall but I also hear that all tanks are capable of tanking all bosses in all raids, wich is it? Is it that tanks are pretty close but warrior tanking require a little bit more mind into it then lets say druid-one-macro-spamming-tanking?

Thanks in forehand!

hey glad you're enjoying your warrior :D i find my warrior to be a blast to play (prot main spec, fury off).

first off i'm in no way an expert at warriors or at tanking just getting that out there.
also i've never tanked as any other class. . .so this is comming straight from the perspective of a life time warrior.

1.) warriors aren't the greatest at aoe tanking. i really wish we were a bit better at it and i can't tell you how many times i've gotten extremely frustrated (to the point of wanting to completely quit tanking) in 5 man heroics as i was learning my warrior because i'd lose a 4th or 5th add and it'd cause a wipe.
but i do want to say that our aoe tanking seems to get much better as you start to learn wtf you're doing, learn how to pay attention to things (where you are, where the next group of mobs are, where your healer's at, etc. etc.), become better at pulling intelligently, learn your warrior's abilities and when to and NOT to use them, and just in general start becomming a better tank.
also it gets better with better gear.
i use to have a hard time holding 3 or 4 mobs at a time, now unless dps is just nuking the heck out of everything in sight i don't have much of an issue anymore.
you can also mark your targets before hand. have dps focus on skull, x, square in that order. this in itself should make it alot easier on you as you're gearing up and learning your warrior.

pretty much just thunderclap, shockwave and cleave are our main aoe abilities. glyph of cleaving will help alot in 5 mans (hit's 3 targets instead of just 2).

2.) i've never heard warriors are waaaaay worse then paladins at tanking (5 mans or raids).
from what i've seen all tanking classes seem to be just about even right now. pretty close to it.
we all have our strong points, and our weak points.
i've been raiding with my warrior a lot in 10 mans (ony, totc, os with drakes up, etc) and 25 mans (mainly just ony and totc) lately.
my other guildy tanks on his druid. we switch between ot'ing and mt'ing on a boss by boss basis. knowing that my aoe tanking is a bit weak (and according to him even weaker then a druid's) i usually have my guildy ot on bosses with tons of adds that need to be handled.
but when it comes to tanking bosses themselves. we both seem to be just about even. neither of us have any agro issues when it comes to single target bosses, and we both have enough survivability (and good enough heals lol) to survive through any boss i've encountered so far (i've yet to do any hard modes in uld or totc. . .so who knows about those haha).
i will admit as a side note that my guildy is a better tank then i am. he's been tanking alot longer then i have, and is better at movement intensive fights, as well as he's better at reacting quicker to unexpected situations (dps accidentally pulls more mobs for example) as well as he's just over all more situationaly aware (of where things are, where he can pull things, etc.)
but i'm constantly working on improving. . .
and that's pretty much just it.
in my opinion warriors take quite a bit of effort to really start getting decent at tanking with.
but the more effort you put into them, the better they seem to get.
i myself really enjoy the difficulty in tanking with a warrior. . .i enjoy the effort you need to put into it. makes the game just so much more rewarding for me after i've put alot of effort into tanking something, and see his dead corpse drop in front of me.

anyhow lol i'm hyper tonight. sorry for the 20k word essay xP

Сообщение от 138583

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Сообщение от Xepp

Wall of text!

Hello!
First I must thank you all for good answers. I like when ppl right alot because then you get some more info then just "warriors are fine l2p".
So to conclude this, warriors are fine to tank with but maybe needs a little bit more skill to do good and therefor maybe not get booring as fast as some of the others tanks get. Sweet.. =)

I got another question also that I forgot to ask. When I read about warrior tank gearing on forums there are alot of talking about block set and stuff like that. As I am a casual player I dont got time to raid or collect a specifik set of gear. If i wanna do good overall should I just stack stamina as I have done on my paladin tank and druid tank in 3.2? or do a warrior tank need to stack block in order to do good in tanking?

A comment on the thing about marking mobs with skull, cross and so on. I always do that on my other tanks but the problem then is that there are always some dps that dont wanna dps the skull because it will die fast and then he cant (due to ramping up his dps) top the dps meters in that heroic instance... !

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Сообщение от Rubendesmet619

Сообщение от Xepp

I don't get how people can have fun when they have no "soul" in one of their characters.

I have my main warrior and every alt I level is to help that guy progres. I don't waste crusader orrbs on alts, instead I sell them to make money for my main to level JC'ing atm in this case. I have alts at 80 who are enchanter, alchemist, miner and herbalist and it makes thing so easy.

I can see what you mean but thats individually I think. You like it, I have a harder time to. =) As long as you have fun, then it doesnt matter wich one you play with.

Сообщение от twitch77

about blocking sets.

i find my block value to be good in 5 man heroics. . .but from my experience, and from what i've read here on the forums block just doesn't prevent enough damage in raids to make a significant impact (the large majority of times).

if i were you and you were mainly just doing 5 mans for emblems to gear your warrior up, i'd just stick to stamina stacking like you do with your pally and bear.
if you're having threat issues, you might want to get some expertise as well (the soft cap is 26). . .i'm not sure i'd gem or enchant for it over stamina, but i do think it'd help you hold mobs better.

if you get some gear with block value, great :) it'll help you a bit in 5 mans, but you don't need to focus on block much.

and when you hear about people talking about "block sets". . .they're usually end game raiders who will have pieces of armor with a ton of block value that they'll use on very specific bosses (bosses that deal a lot of melee damage, and very little if any at all spell damage). . .over the course of a fight it can provide more survival then straight stamina.
but at this stage you really don't need to worry about having different gear sets for different fights. just work on keeping your defense cap, then start stacking stamina. . .as you start gearing up and getting better gear, all your other stats will start increasing, and tanking with your warrior should start getting easier and more enjoyable.

also about dps nuking off marks. haha that annoys me to no end. and when i lose a mob to that dps and they die, i always feel like it's my fault.
but when something like that happens, you just got to remind yourself that it wasn't your fault. it was the idiot dps who wasn't doing his job.
not sure what i can tell you about this :(. it happens.
hopefully you've got a group of friends you've made over the years that will be willing to help you run 5 mans to gear up, that aren't such idiots. . .or who don't care about anything but gear scores and recount.

after i started to get better gear and get a better understanding of my warrior, i actualy had a friend start always attacking off mark. it actually helped me a lot, but it's only because i was asking him too.

but yeah, if you can get a group of people you trust and who you know wont do stupid things like attack off mark, then wonder why they're lying on the floor dead, you should try to run with those people as often as you can. (i got really lucky and made a few friends early, who were always willing to run with me no matter how bad i was at tanking at the time. they were very patient with me as i was learning how things worked. you've played wow for a long time, hopefully you've made some good friends as well :) ).

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Сообщение от Porcell

It's both. Warriors are worse and they are capable of tanking all bosses. The block mechanic whereby we sometimes block for double damage, but for a lot less often, just makes our damage intake spikier than Paladins who have a much higher chance to block. We also have lower stamina and strength scaling, mitigate less damage (with Glyph of Divine Plea, a Paladin takes 12% reduced damage, compared to a Warrior's 10%), and we've got no effect like Ardent Defender (not taking into account the death-avoidance) where we take less damage below 35%. Warriors just take more damage compared to Paladins.

Essentially, it's like Zakkhar said, healers need to be on the ball a lot more when healing a Warrior, damage intake is a little more unpredictable. So yes, Warriors can tank everything, but a Paladin is just a smoother ride you might say.

I think you are overstating things a bit here. You make it sound like Warriors are falling down and Paladins are rocks. The situation is not that disparate.

Сообщение от 245261

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Сообщение от Porcell

A lot of this relates to healers needing to pay a little extra attention to Warriors, but it's really not a huge difference.

Yeah, warriors get only 33% overhealing instead of 38% overhealing.

New warrior tank, as bad as everyone says?

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