Warlock 3.1 Tanking Guide

Messaggio di Blightman

Here is the armor damage reduction formula:
DR% = Armor / (Armor + (467.5 * AttackerLevel - 22167.5))

Starting heroics,
plate wearing classes will have between 20k and 25k armor.
20K vs raid boss is 56% DR
25K vs raid boss is 60% DR
cloth wearing class will have roughly 2k armor, with Demon Armor 4k. Meta will increase armor by 600% but is only available part of the time(30%)
2K vs raid boss is 10% DR
4K vs raid boss is 19% DR
12k vs raid boss is 41% DR
24k vs raid boss is 59% DR

So we need to pick up roughly 43% more physical damage reduction.
6% from Molten Skin + 20% from Soul Link + 5% from Glyph of Soul Link+10% from using VW with Master Demonologist http://ptr.wowhead.com/?spell=23825 = 41%

Add that to the base armor and you get 60%.

Even better our non-physical DR is 31%. We can even switch to a felhound if the boss has mostly magicial attacks and have 50% physical DR and 41% magic DR.

Not how it works, actually. Imp.Soul Link reduces damage by 25%, then Master Demonologist reduces the REMAINING damage by 10%, and molten skin the REMAINING damage by 6%.

0.75*0.94*0.9 = 0.6345
1 - 0.6345 = 0.3655
= 36.55%

We get 36.55% DR from those, not 41. This gets even worse when we compute in the fact that our armor actually reduces the REMAINING damage by n%.

0.75*0.94*0.9*0.81 = 0.513945
1 - 0.513945 = 0.486055
= 48.6055%

So, our physical dmg reduction will be a whopping 48.6055%, almost 12% lower than your supposed 60%

You are right I simplified it a lot. Your calculation is not correct either. All damage reduction stacks multiplicatively. And soul link reduces damage taken by transferring it. Therefore, it happens after all other DR are factored in.

The correct calculation:
Hit
Damage taken = (Base Damage *Armor DR*each talent DR*)
or
Blocked Hit
Damage taken = (Base Damage *Armor DR*each talent DR*) - Block Value

Pally with 25k armor takes a hit that is not blocked for base damage of 10k:
(10k * .4* *.97 *.97*.94) = 3537 damage taken (~65% total DR)
Pally with 25k armor takes a hit that is blocked(BV 1.5k) for base damage of 10k:
(10k * .4* *.97 *.97*.94) - 1.5 k = 2037 damage taken (~80%DR)
Lock with 4k armor takes the same hit:
(10k*.81*.9*.94)*.75 = 5139 (~50% DR)
Lock with 6.6k armor takes the same hit:
(10k*.72*.9*.94) *.75= 4568 (~55% DR)
Lock with 8.6k armor takes the same hit:
(10k*.66*.9*.94) *.75= 4187 (~59% DR)
Lock with 4k armor during meta takes the same hit:
(10k*.41*.9*.94) *.75= 2601 (~74% DR)
Lock with 8.6k armor during meta takes the same hit:
(10k*.24*.9*.94) *.75= 1522 (~85% DR)

and add to that the fact that we don't have any avoidance, and that 'real' tanks have more armor than what you claimed them to have

Sorry, but tanks starting heroics have between 20k and 25k unbuffed.

I actually may have underestimated how much armor locks can get.
With full hateful/titan pvp gear, ring of earthen might and Signet of Arachnathid Command, the +240 glove enchant and the +225 cloak enchant and a elixir of protection a lock can hit 6.6k with demon armor + Demonic Aegis. That is 28% DR from armor not 19%. DR from armor increases faster at the low end than at the high end. If we get a pally and a druid in the group we pick up another 2k boosting armor DR to 34%

Also funny thing about demon armor + Demonic Aegis it boosts the healing we get by 26%

Messaggio di Blightman

You went into much more detail a while back on a topic about which shield was better for heroics: the merc shield or the SSO shield.

Never said you didn't recomend defense. Block cap in heroics is what? And since locks can't block irrelevant.

True, we do have a few other tricks:

http://ptr.wowhead.com/?spell=50511 for physical bosses
http://ptr.wowhead.com/?spell=11719 for spell casting bosses

Um, wow, I never expected you to take me seriously the first time around, never mind the second time when I answered with caps lock.

Block capped means that you have 102.4% mitigation on a warrior/ paladin, it also implies that ~50% of that mitigation is pure avoidance. Druids at BC end game started off with ~30% dodge.

I phrased my question poorly. I know what block cap is. I did not remember if the number was different for heroic bosses and didn't want to go look it up.

This whole post is not:
should locks tank(they shouldn't).
It's why can they tank. A lock has tanked 1/2 dozen heroics and pathcwerk in level 70 pvp gear. And blizz is increasing our DR by a bit over 11% in 3.1 This is just so sad it's funny.

Messaggio di megamags

(^ ^ ^ look, numbers in the name! i see a pattern forming.)

This made me spit coffee on my keyboard..
LOL

Messaggio di 328142

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Messaggio di Blightman

You: "(10k*.81*.9*.94*.75) = 5139 (~50% DR)"
Me: "0.75*0.94*0.9*0.81 = 0.513945"
You: "Your calculation is not correct either."

So, either you made the same mistake and we both fail, or then I was, indeed, correct. :)

. And soul link reduces damage taken by transferring it. Therefore, it happens after all other DR are factored in.

The answer came out the same in the given example. If we add in a common spell such as: Power word: shield or Sacred Shield then your formula gives an incorrect answer since it has SL being taken out the same way as every other DR. SL only transfer the damage you would take after ALL other DR/absoportion etc. occurs. Simply put if anything else would have kept you from being damaged then it is taken out before applying SL.

For non-locks:
(Base Damage *Armor DR*each talent DR*) - damage absorbed
For locks:
((Base Damage *Armor DR*each talent DR except Soul link*) - damage absorbed ) * Soul Link

basically we get less benefit from being shielded:
((10k*.81*.9*.94) -2300)*.75 = 3414 (~66% DR)
instead of
(10k*.81*.9*.94*.75) -2300 = 2839(~72% DR)

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Messaggio di Infleto

Just lock tanked ramp and BF on my 62 lock, I stacked stam. with scrolls and potions.

Threat gen was not too much of a problem. I would tank all the mobs I could and keep my VW on passive. when something went for the healer or if dps pulled agro I would send him in to OT. I saved Met for when I need more aoe TPS.

The Felguard may be better for personal TPS (master demo) and, he may also be better for saving the healer or a Dps that pulls aggro do to his charge (reaction time) The VW's aoe threat is grate to pick up mobs that you can't. as it was my first time tanking the VW's safety net helped. as I get better gear and better skilled, I may switch to the FG for more personal TPS.

Credit mostly goes to the priest. she was L63 and done grate. and to the rogue with his saps. CCing is what really made it work!

Decimation helps a lot too. I would SB a mob at 15%-ish health then use the shard free SF on the next mob. Doing this is works well for geting high threat on a new target. Yet, It is rather fast pace and is not so good for the healer.

I had to HoT once when things got out of hand. my VW went dancing with one mob right down the middle of the room. Every thing was pulled and went for the healer, HoT gave me time to get met off CD, when the mobs broke HoT, We used the healer's aoe agrro as bait to get the mobs groped back up,
she had thrown a big heal on me and pulled all the mob back to us so I could pop met > Shadow Cleve > IA > Demon howl. (not the best ideal, she dropped to 50%-ish health before I could pull off her)

The hard part was mana, I could not really LT mid-pull, luckily I am a BE and have arcane torrent.

Lock tanking is not the best way to go but it can work with a good healer and smart manipulation of game mechanic . Or at least it can be done in the lower 60s.

It was a good change of pace and when I get dual spec. I will have a 5 man Lock tanking spec

Messaggio di abulurd

as was pointed out with this stuff you would have a harder time keeping aggro on more than single targets, what if you made a lock into a tank like this, and then used the lock as an off tank for raids and such like, as an off tank it is almost feasible, if there aren't any competant druids, warriors, dks, etc

Messaggio di Oragth

Yay, this gives me a reason to level my Warlock, and use Demonololgy! :D

Well, I can see a Warlock being a "last ditch" Tank, say if the MT dies, OT is failing, the boss is around.. idk, 20-30% health left? Edit: 20-30% isnt exactly a place where meta would be a sure thing, 10-15%, 20% tops. If the lock can Meta, and your dps can can nuke his 30% in the 30 seconds he has Meta (depends on what kind of pew pew you have with you) I can see it working. Sorry to those of you who are thinking "If you are failing that bad, L2P and get better gear/Tank/Healer/Dps" cant a dwarf dream? :D

(Side note, I need to learn how to post spells and items, w/out the url showing, can someone message me so I can figure out how to do that? Danke.)

Messaggio di Kangi

(Side note, I need to learn how to post spells and items, w/out the url showing, can someone message me so I can figure out how to do that? Danke.)\<Wording>\. As an example: \Metamorphosis\ = Metamorphosis.

Messaggio di Oragth

Danke! Now I can look like I know what I'm doing! You have earned the never-ending gratitude, and service of a Dwarf, my friend. *bows*

Messaggio di Blightman

Hah, fun idea. Outside of meta though you would have difficulty controlling multi-mob pulls, but then again every class and their mother now has a cc (except warriors of course). I'd love to see you try it on a serious heroic....

Also reminds me of shaman tanking.....

Have I tried this in a serious heroic? No but this guy has

Messaggio di 39492

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Messaggio di Migis

As a former Sarth 3d tank (10's and 25's tyvm), hence I have the gear and accustomed to the concept I have one issue that makes this completely awesome idea completely impossible

With all the cloth gear that stacks stam and res (ie: pvp Hateful/Deadly) and geming and chanting for stam and res and now def this leads one very important stat left out to the wind: HIT

As a caster you will still need to get hit capped to casue your threat and the gear that makes tanking necessary lacks it completely. While it is a great concept on paper we just do not have the gear to facilitate it. We simply aren't ment to be tanks.

However neither were Ninjas in FF11 when they first came around and look what happened there...

Messaggio di Blightman

With all the cloth gear that stacks stam and res (ie: pvp Hateful/Deadly) and geming and chanting for stam and res and now def this leads one very important stat left out to the wind: HIT

You don't need any defense. Resilience is what is used to get crit immune. Defense is horrible for the lock "tank". Locks can't parry or block. And they can't dodge while casting.

Yes hit stays in the mix. But hey all tanks have multipe stats to juggle. They all need crit immunity(def/res), stam, and threat stats(usually str and hit, Sp and hit for locks)

completely awesome idea completely impossible
Nope, it's been linked several times in this thread, the youtube of a lock tanking patchwerk in naxx. In fact it was linked two responses before yours.

Warlock 3.1 Tanking Guide

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