The Official Wowhead Book-Club

Ответить

Вернуться на главную страницу форума

Сообщение от 149406

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

Сообщение от Monday

Just got Watchmen <3

Сообщение от 149406

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

Сообщение от OverZealous

Just got Watchmen <3

That's a good one!

Сообщение от Monday

So I'm about halfway through, and so far I've decided:

Dr. Manhattan is a lameass.
Nite Owl is annoying.
Jupiter is REALLY annoying.
Ozymandias is alright.
The Comedian, even though I didn't like him, was interesting.
Rorschach is amazing.

Сообщение от 238331

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

Сообщение от Hyperspacerebel

I certainly don't argue that Pullman is Atheist or that he has said any of those things, but I still stand that the book itself is not so blatantly anti-religious above all else that it would put someone off from reading it. The book simply doesn't at any point acknowledge or hint that there is / are omniscient deity/deities. That's really the extent of it. The existence of a Catholic church in the world and their teaching being wrong in a fiction book still doesn't account for much. I mean, what fantasy books really do acknowledge the Christian God (unless you want to count the Bible)? I've really gotta remember to get the ebooks so I can re-read them, it's definitely been awhile.

The entire books is premised on the faults of "Christianity" (that is, Christianity as portrayed in the book).

"I'm trying to undermine the basis of Christian belief."

Are you going to deny a meaning he intentionally put into the books?

The book simply doesn't at any point acknowledge or hint that there is / are omniscient deity/deities.
Uh...you seriously need to re-read the books if you think that's the extent of the religious discussion in the book.

Сообщение от 238331

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

Сообщение от Monday

Besides at the end they go to what is basically Christian heaven in a setting where the Church is real and kill God?

Сообщение от 238331

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

Сообщение от Monday

Besides at the end they go to what is basically Christian heaven in a setting where the Church is real and kill God?

At the end of what? The entire trilogy? I seem to recall them getting back to one of the worlds and kissing or something being the ending of the last book...

Yes. At the end of the entire trilogy (iirc) somebody kills God. It was slightly before the actual ending. I'm thinking it was the climax.

Сообщение от Hyperspacerebel

I'm speaking purely of the subject matter and the quotes of characters in the books. I could care less what Pullman wanted it to be. From my memory of the books, which is still fairly vivid, he did a poor job of making it completely about religion. I didn't get that vibe at all. I still say people are just easily offended and read too much into stuff.

Wait, so even though the author stated that it was his intention, and the vast majority of critics who have read the books see it, you're claiming that it's not true?

I honestly don't care how you read the book. I care about what's in the book, and what's in the book is a clear push against 1) organized religion, 2) Christianity, and 3) God.

Сообщение от 238331

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

Сообщение от Monday

I don't deny that it is a pretty good book, I enjoyed it when I first read it, but it is definitely anti-Catholic/Christian. If you can't stand that stuff, don't read it.

Otherwise, go read it. It's pretty good.

Сообщение от Hyperspacerebel

This was an insanely well written book, yet it is one the most anti-Catholic books in existence.

Сообщение от Monday

So, I finished Watchmen, and frankly I was a little disappointed at Rorschach's ending )=

Сообщение от Pwntiff

Eh, he's the epitome of an anti-hero.

Сообщение от Orranis

I think it was brilliant. I literally cannot overstate how much I love that comic. The hero was the insane twisted and abused, and the villain but not actually was the publicly adored lovable warm hero, who was only doing not what even thought was right, but necessary. I think the death of Rorschach was completely necessary, think about how much it would've undermined all three characters (Ozzy, Manhattan and Rorschach) if they'd just let him go. My personal greatest disappointment is that we're never going to see what happens after the journal is published (fan fic idea much?)

Сообщение от Monday

I know. I just... I don't know. I'm not sure if I liked the way he died. Dr. Manhattan laserbeaming him was just kinda meh to me. Otherwise, I highly enjoyed it. Ozymandias is now my favorite villain, ever.

Сообщение от Orranis

Well, how would you have killed him? (Or preferred him killed, or none of the above)? It showed that neither side compromised in their ideals. Rorschach didn't back down even though he saw it was between preventing the apocalypse or giving the people the truth, and he chose the latter. Dr. Manhattan (and I think it's wrong to assume he was completely on Veidt's side, because he knew it wouldn't last forever, but understood that Veidt's sacrifice of others must not have been made in vain by Rorschach) and kills him.