DOTD - Debate of The Day #52

Squishalot의 게시글

Detention = A time set aside where you are forced to silently do school work/read.

Perhaps we went to completely different styles of schools, but our lunch time detention involved us walking around with a rubbish bag picking up garbage, in front of our peers, and enduring any mocking that might arise as a result. Similar impact to the high-profile cases where drink drivers had to stand on the roadside with a placard saying "I drove while drunk and killed a person here". I think that's incredibly demeaning and belittling, not to mention the fact that you're taking away the socially productive element of schooling that comes with being in a group environment by denying them the opportunity to mix with their peers at lunch.(##RESPBREAK##)8##DELIM##Squishalot##DELIM##

FatalHeaven의 게시글

Squishalot의 게시글

I'd still say I'd rather my daughter go through your version of detention than be smacked or paddled by a teacher.

Definitely, but would you agree that demeaning a child (I think you used "unjust and degrading" originally) is not a full argument in and of itself?

yukonjack의 게시글

We had it when I was in school, and I survived.

Perhaps all that abuse might have in some small way lead you down the road to escapism through artificial joy.

The I had it and survived position only perpetuates the core issues related to the problem. Saying corporal punishment for children is ok is essentially admitting that after 100 000 years of human evolution we havent been able to come up with anything better.

Speaking as a parent of 2 considerate, respectful and compassionate young adults I can assure you the old ways of negative reinforcement are not nesaccary. Open your minds, learn new ways and always most importantly put yourself in their shoes. However trivial it may seem to you is irrelavant because until you learn to recognize how dire their issues seem to them and take them as such you will remain stunted, isolated, frustrated and angry.

Magician22773의 게시글

Perhaps all that abuse might have in some small way lead you down the road to escapism through artificial joy.

FWIW, I got paddled 1 time, in second grade. I don't think that led to my addiction in any way.

I do think it led to me not getting paddled for the remaining 6 years that it was an option. (High school did not have corporal punishment, as far as I know.)

Speaking as a parent of 2 considerate, respectful and compassionate young adults I can assure you the old ways of negative reinforcement are not nesaccary

Speaking as a parent of 2 typical boys, I respectfully disagree.

My kids are great 99% of the time. Between the 2, I have maybe resorted to spanking them a total of 3 or 4 times between them. Its not like I turn to a belt for every infraction......thats unecessary, ineffective, and borderline abuse if you do.

But, they both know that its an option, and my oldest son has told me, that the possibility of getting a belt on the butt made him think twice before making bad decisions. One of the biggest was when it came to smoking. He was told that if he was ever caught smoking, it would be delt with in a corporal manner. When his friend started to smoke, he stayed away from it because he did not want the punishment. I will gladly trade whatever psycological effect you may think his 2 spankings may have done for the lifelong effects of smoking...anyday.

FatalHeaven의 게시글

#29: Should courses regarding the world's religions be allowed in public schools?

I personally, believe they should. Not as a required class of course since that would be requiring a student to go against ones beliefs, but as an elective course. That way those who want to learn about them can and those who don't, can just take a different elective. I also think that a lot of kids would opt to take the course; since it wouldn't be a Christian course or an Athiest course, but would cover everything. It might serve to open up perceptions and acceptance if the kids in class were able to have their religion, and have it be respected but also get to learn about others beliefs.

Squishalot의 게시글

Not as a required class of course since that would be requiring a student to go against ones beliefs, but as an elective course.

If a Christian believes that the world began 6000 years ago, should they be required to attend science classes dealing with events occurring prior to their believed start of the world?

I don't think that requiring students to attend a course that discusses (as opposed to instructs) a religion goes against anyone's beliefs, nor should a person's beliefs allow them some sort of 'get out of school' card.

Edit: I'm not adverse to it being an elective, but I don't like the idea that it HAS to be an elective because it somehow forces students to go against their beliefs.(##RESPBREAK##)8##DELIM##Squishalot##DELIM##

MyTie의 게시글

Should parents be allowed to send their children to schools that teach kids to believe certain religions?
Should schools be allowed to teach kids what to believe, with the consent of parents?

392412의 게시글

This post was from a user who has deleted their account.

Squishalot의 게시글

Should parents be allowed to send their children to schools that teach kids to believe certain religions?
Should schools be allowed to teach kids what to believe, with the consent of parents?

Not what to believe, but how to understand religion.

The syllabus is designed for students in all schools and ensures students study more than one religious tradition. The course enables students to come to an understanding that each religious tradition has its own integrity and contributes to a well-ordered society.

Atik의 게시글

As long as they are taught from a neutral standpoint in order to educate the student on certain aspects of each one.

We have religious schools for more biased views.

KingdomKnight의 게시글

Yes. Ignorance breeds prejudice. Education is the best way to combat that. The better we can understand each other the less likely we are to have misunderstandings. Not that those already made prejudice by their environment are likely to change because of school. Hatred is a learned thing, and teachers can only babysit so much.

As far as learning the religious philosophies itself goes, I don't see how that wouldn't help youth to be more well rounded. At the very least they'd be shown a world of beliefs beyond those of their own families.

FatalHeaven의 게시글

Should parents be allowed to send their children to schools that teach kids to believe certain religions?
Should schools be allowed to teach kids what to believe, with the consent of parents?

I don't think it would be about teaching they what to believe as opposed to teaching them the differences and letting the individual come to a decision on what they wish to believe.

Edit: I'm not adverse to it being an elective, but I don't like the idea that it HAS to be an elective because it somehow forces students to go against their beliefs.

As an elective, a student may choose to take the course if it interests them. As a required class, I think it could have far more negative effects. You will have much more disorder and snide comments from kids if they are forced to be there.

I do not believe the studies of world religion should be a required class. But I do believe it should be there for those interested. I don't feel like it's giving them a "get out of class free" card since they will still be required to take an elective to obtain credit.

If a Christian believes that the world began 6000 years ago, should they be required to attend science classes dealing with events occurring prior to their believed start of the world?

When I was in high school I believed the Christian faith. It didn't affect my study of science. I took it with a grain of salt when things pre-dated my "believed start of the world." And since science doesn't focus on religion, it was never a big deal to me. Not to mention, generally speaking, teachers are very careful with that stuff. Any teacher I've ever had the privilege of studying under, was sure to state that they weren't promoting or demoting any religious view but were simply teaching the course and to please keep that in mind. Heck, at least two of my science teachers attended my church.

I think the line is such that, with science, a small part of the semester syllabus will deal with anything like that while a course on world religions is exactly that. Religion. Period. Which shouldn't be required; rather optional.

Adamsm의 게시글

#29: Should courses regarding the world's religions be allowed in public schools?Yes; and since there are multiple high schools, universities and colleges that provide a World Religion Course, the school boards agree(heck even some of the Catholic schools have them).

gamerunknown의 게시글

On the other side is the thought that since Corporal Punishment was banned from schools, kids no longer have respect for the authority of their teachers, because they know that there is nothing really that the teachers can do to punish/discipline them anyway, and it then is flowing over into the rest of their lives, and they have no respect for any kind of authority when they get out of school.

I don't think this is true, because crime rates are at a historic low worldwide.

You will have much more disorder and snide comments from kids if they are forced to be there.

Kids aren't purposefully offensive to their peers most of the time. I did debate in religious studies class, but it helped my understanding and I was able to fill other people in too. The only issue is if public funds are being used to "respect an establishment of religion".

Azazel의 게시글

Definitely yes. It just needs to be about how to believe and not what to believe.

asakawa의 게시글

Definitely yes. It just needs to be about how to believe and not what to believe.

A few people are saying similar things and I don't get it. Don't get me wrong I'm all for keeping religious instruction out of curricula (though I attended a religious school and my religious education lessons from 4 to 16 were quite definitely instruction, not education) but the only good things I can think to teach kids in terms of "how to believe" would involve teaching sceptical thinking and evidence-based conclusions which aren't topics for religious studies classes.

I can't think of anything appropriate that could be taught in a religious studies class regarding "how to believe".

Personally I think religion is an interesting topic with a rich and deep history. The role it has played in history all over the world is staggering. Schooling would be remiss to ignore it.

ElhonnaDS의 게시글

I think there should be courses about the history of different religions, and about how they're practiced today in terms of an overview of beliefs, customs that people might not be aware of, etc. I don't think it should touch on the validity of religion at all, unless the parents are sending them to a private religious school for instruction. But I think if people have a familiarity with the facts about different groups of people, it leaves a lot less room for them to fill in with the uninformed misinformation of bigots.

I definitely DO NOT think that they should at all touch on whether or not you should take things on faith. Telling someone what not to believe is as intrusive as telling someone what to believe, in religion, and the government and the school system shouldn't do it.

Granted, I don't think that they should shy away from teaching scientific theories and showing evidence of such, just because a religion doesn't believe it, if the class is about science. I don't think historical accounts that are supported by evidence should be shied away from because some people don't believe they happened. But in a religion class, there should be no agenda other than informing people and granting familiarity to help bridge cultural divides.

DOTD - Debate of The Day #52

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