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12.1.0
PTR
12.0.7
Beta
BFA Artifact Power Grind is worse than Legion without anywhere close to as much rewards
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Messaggio di
Blahblahwhatever
And hardly anyone is talking about this.
In BFA you will grind AP to unlock Azerite traits in your Heart of Azeroth and to level up the necklace itself, but there's a catch to it that honestly has not been clearly presented ANYWHERE: You will have to grind even MORE AP to unlock traits in a higher I lvl versions of the same gear. It is so bad, you won't even be able to get use out of Azerite gear from normal dungeons until you are max level.
Thankfully there is rep gear and world quests to get you ready for heroics, but you won't be able to queue for them without 305 average I lvl
Blizzard has tried to sell this off as a mere side activity in their Q and As but it is absolutely not.
I'm on Beta and I understand that the system is in constant flux and get's little twinks every build, but as of right now the amount of grinding needed to unlock traits in Azerite gear from NORMAL dungeons is substantially more than you will have when you reach level 120. The first trait from normal dungeon gear now requires Heart of Azeroth lvl 10...when you get to 10 or past you won't even be getting a trait every day. You might be able to handle a trait every 2 days of non-stop grinding if that.
Beside all of this, absolutely none of the traits warrant the grinding in the first place because they're all relatively lackluster. I did not ever feel like I was being punished in Legion for having higher level gear than most players, BFA totally feels like a god damn chore every bit past lvl 110.
I understand the full experience isn't quite there on beta yet, but it's pretty close to complete. My prediction? If this build is basically representative of what the game is going to be on live, a soul sucking grind fest with really *!@#ty rewards, than we really do have a WOD type of situation on our hands again and people are going to quit the @#$% out of this game because there will be virtually nothing to do in the game except grind for rewards which are far fewer and further apart in between. And it has nothing to do with the stat squish, that's all good and well. It's just that the Azerite traits are all pretty plain vanilla garbage that you could leave or take really, trinkets are pretty much completely undertuned trash and completely uninventive across the board, and itemization on the whole is the worst since vanilla wow.
Imagine if in Legion you could never get more interest rewards than you can get from leveling quests/world quests? That's BFA.
Azerite system is the most stupid grindy !@#$ I've ever heard of in this game. At least with artifact weapons we were actually getting near constant upgrades, with this system you are going to spend most of the game with Azerite gear sitting in your bags that you can't even use because you haven't grinded enough AP, or you'll just wear it anyways and ignore the traits.
What a total cluster%^&*. I was really rooting for this xpac since day 1 but honestly I think this expansion is going to be a colossal failure.
Messaggio di
Adamsm
1. It's Beta, so things can change.
2. You couldn't unlock the good stuff in Legion till max level either; the low level quests/rare mobs did not provide very good AP amounts either.
3. It's technically the 'first' patch as well; early Legion was just as crappy when it came to gear and grinding, since you had to start your AP research at 110 so you had items giving 100-500 at the most AP.
Messaggio di
Blahblahwhatever
1. Sure things will change, but at this point outside of bug fixes and polish (i.e. finishing cut scenes and such) things are not going to change very much before they go live.
2. I'm talking about Max Level and my point is that there will be a much larger grind before you can get into the "good stuff" than is necessary, in a game that is about obtaining more and more power we don't need a system on rails that punishes some players just for playing the game more, that's in essence my issue with what BFA end game content is going to be. Down to 110's having a very easy time ganking high level players. It's a lot of ridiculousness that punishes players for just not being casual noobs.
3. No, Legion was not like this at all. None of the early game content was tuned around having more than 2 gold traits on your artifact anyways, which was easy enough to obtain. Early Legion also demonstrated how Lucrative M+ could be, not just in terms of AP but in terms of outright being a better way to gear your characters early on. People got better geared on their own time with less drama and nonsense than any previous expansion than they could from raiding very quickly in Legion with the sole exception of Legendaries. In BFA you won't be able to just jump right into the highest end game content upon leveling up. and the reason is because Blizzard has made AP grinding mandatory in BFA, which really wasn't a thing in early Legion. I mean, myself and plenty of other players were doing mythic dungeons as soon as we leveled up.
In BFA you just won't really be able to do that.
What's going on with BFA is Blizzard as they have been telling us in Q and A's about they really didn't like how people grinded to max artifact traits in early Legion and such, the thing is the intense early grinding of AP was a thing guilds made you do it was not about what the game was actually balanced around. So when Blizzard is saying that AP is just a bonus thing you passively get they are feeding you corporate bull!@#$. What Blizzard is actually doing in BFA to "avoid that happening again" is making endless nonstop ap grinding essential to the game but actually maxing out your ap impossible.
A whole lot of people, including a lot of top ranked raiding guilds quit Legion early on because the grind was super intense, I see no reason to expect anything but a lot more of that in BFA.
And I see absolutely no reason to expect the PVP scene to improve a lot either.
It's not all looking bad, but it doesn't have to be it just needs to be bad enough in a few areas and it's not looking incredibly promising in the ones I'm talking about here.
Messaggio di
lankybrit
Blah Blah. Whatever.
Messaggio di
Jkpman
Blah Blah. Whatever.
This.
By all means unsub if it bothers you so much, but seriously all this crying over an expansion in BETA.
Also you are dribbling out your opinion on a sparsely populated fan forum, if you really want to be heard/ignored/ridiculed by a larger audience then maybe post on the official forums.
Messaggio di
Blahblahwhatever
Really? That's your response? JKpman I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume you do not even have Beta, and that you do not even remotely have the sense to realize that a Beta this far in development is extremely close to the product you are going to get when the game launches.
And at any rate I really couldn't care less what you, some random jerk on the internet, has to say about me. But pretty sad that you immediately get personal over a discussion about a video game where you have nothing to add except petty, poorly thought-out insults. Also very keen to notice how none of you are denying the truth of what I'm saying you're just essentially saying "So what?" with a dash of "quit if you don't like it." How yawn inducing.
With people like you I don't even have to spend time thinking about why Brexit and President Trump are things that actually happened because it's obvious, it's becusae people like you exist.
Let's try this one: If you can't be civil and add something of value to the conversation, just don't post.
Messaggio di
Adamsm
I have Beta and I'm with them; you don't like it, don't buy the expansion and find something else, then come back fo the expac after that.
Messaggio di
Jkpman
And at any rate I really couldn't care less what you, some random jerk on the internet, has to say about me.
You clearly do care.
Also I have the beta and have been enjoying it for several weeks now, The mewlings of a random internet jerk isn't going to change that.
I've had access to several betas over the years, and yes even this far into development things can drastically change when the product actually goes live.
But hey feel free to throw as many hissy fits over something that might never happen as you feel comfortable with.
Messaggio di
Rankkor
/glare
Lets avoid the insult-flinging please.
On-topic: I have to groan whenever someone tries to be an internet farseer, all of whom seem to possess magical crystal balls that let them see the future.
BfA may be a failure, or it may not. Its too early to say. Yet you're making all of these wild speculations and presenting them as hard-coded facts.
Numbers can be tweaked, AP gains can be adjusted, effectiveness of traits can be changed. This is not only true for betas, but even when the game goes live.(##RESPBREAK##)8##DELIM##Rankkor##DELIM##
Messaggio di
Jkpman
You seem to have a fundamental misunderstanding of what a Beta test client is for.
You are playing it as if it's the live product, coming here and complaining about things you feel is wrong, you DO know what a Beta test is right? The report icon you seem oblivious to is there for exactly this type of situation as are the official forums.
Blizzard want and need feedback, complaints, gripes about the product, we don't
Messaggio di
druidrygalore
On-topic: I have to groan whenever someone tries to be an internet farseer, all of whom seem to possess magical crystal balls that let them see the future.
BfA may be a failure, or it may not. Its too early to say. Yet you're making all of these wild speculations and presenting them as hard-coded facts.
Numbers can be tweaked, AP gains can be adjusted, effectiveness of traits can be changed. This is not only true for betas, but even when the game goes live.
I seem to remember since the beginning that every expansion was going to be "the end of WoW". Here we are years later and still going strong. While I disagree with some of the changes that have been made, it is as you so elegantly point out, still in BETA. The final product may not even be recognizable from the BETA we are in...I doubt that will happen, but it could.
Messaggio di
Jkpman
Yeah they always pop up now and again, You just deal them a reality card and they go and cry in a corner somewhere until the next beta.
Messaggio di
lankybrit
Blah Blah. Whatever.
This.
By all means unsub if it bothers you so much, but seriously all this crying over an expansion in BETA.
Also you are dribbling out your opinion on a sparsely populated fan forum, if you really want to be heard/ignored/ridiculed by a larger audience then maybe post on the official forums.
It was a joke about his username :)
Messaggio di
Jkpman
Blah Blah. Whatever.
This.
By all means unsub if it bothers you so much, but seriously all this crying over an expansion in BETA.
Also you are dribbling out your opinion on a sparsely populated fan forum, if you really want to be heard/ignored/ridiculed by a larger audience then maybe post on the official forums.
It was a joke about his username :)
At this point I'm more interested in what happened to Fotheringham's last post, I really wanted to see Rankor's reply.
But I suppose either words were had, or he just realized how ridiculous the point he was trying to make was.
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