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Lvl 80 Ele shammy
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Publication par
capncrunch
Hi ! I am an ele shammy at lvl 80 with descent gear . i am hit capped , got about 400 haste and 2060 sp. still i only get up in 3.5k dps. think thats a little low but i dont know.
my rotation is FS-LvB-CL-LB-LB-LB-CL-LvB (something like that , using cl and LvB as soon as the cd is down) aand then i refresh fs right before the third LvB.
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Trollbane&n=Shamzz
my talents and so on.
Publication par
capncrunch
Hitcapped when going with sp or boomking witch is almost always.
Publication par
capncrunch
and 2k spellpower witch flamtounge weapon on ! (i forget a lots of stuff xD)
Publication par
Behrooz
Well it seems your doing everything right. When you do your 3.5k, are all your totems out? Can't think of anything else but maybe lag between casting.
Publication par
Riot5
I'm having a similar dilemma; I can almost hit 4k on dummies, self buffed + totems out.
But no higher, which is sad considering that the enh shaman in my guild regularly goes over that, but he's got worse gear than I.
Oh, and during raiding my dps drops to around 2.5-3k, but that's due to lag and gimmick fights I think.
Publication par
Haxzor
RNG WARRIORS!
Publication par
Alitruae
there was a thread about this previously, the debate was over the use of CL vs Fs>Lvb>Lbx4-5>lvb spam
apparently CL loses horribly vs 1 target dps, sure it hits the first target hard, but Im going to attempt to not use it this week in raid and see where i land dps wise.
Publication par
Alitruae
Hi ! I am an ele shammy at lvl 80 with descent gear . i am hit capped , got about 400 haste and 2060 sp. still i only get up in 3.5k dps. think thats a little low but i dont know.
my rotation is FS-LvB-CL-LB-LB-LB-CL-LvB (something like that , using cl and LvB as soon as the cd is down) aand then i refresh fs right before the third LvB.
http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Trollbane&n=Shamzz
my talents and so on.
theres your issue...your glyphs
Major glyphs
Glyph of Totem of Wrath
Glyph of Lightning bolt
Glyph of Flame Shock
Glyph of Lava
Minor Glyphs
Glyph of Water Mastery this comes out to about 30% more mp5 then without so its good
Glyph of Water Walk
Glyph of Renewed life
Reason for removing the gylph of lava, is that its not very good if you have less then 1900 sp unbuffed, or the T9 4pc set bonus
Publication par
Alitruae
I know im nagging, but Also might wanna drop the 2 points from Reverb and get the 2 points for elemental reach instead? more range is always good. Elitist Jerks has a debate saying that the 5 points in convection is better placed in elemental warding dmg reduction talen tier 2. Id say convection is better especially if you find yourself oom alot of times
Publication par
lucius
there was a thread about this previously, the debate was over the use of CL vs Fs>Lvb>Lbx4-5>lvb spam
apparently CL loses horribly vs 1 target dps, sure it hits the first target hard, but Im going to attempt to not use it this week in raid and see where i land dps wise.
CL works fine (and does more damage) if you are able to include it. Using a rotation with only LB is cheaper on mana and easier to perform, which is good enough reason.
Glyph of Lava remains inferior to totem of wrath until you manage to collect 4xT9 (from the unreleased colosseum raid). Not sure why this 1900 spellpower keeps coming up as reasons for all sorts of elemental shaman choices.
Publication par
Mesoforte
CL loses over the four spell rotation in between lava bursts. Just normalize chain lightning damage into a rotation where you have eight seconds available. CL, LB, LB, CL or CL, LB, LB, LB vs. LB, LB, LB, LB.
LB, LB, LB, LB, LB would do more damage than CL, LB, LB, LB, CL if you could fit the extra bolt into the rotation. And CL, LB, LB, LB, LB will do more damage overall than CL, LB, LB, LB, CL. The only reason to use chain lightning is to stagger your casts onto the lava burst cooldown.
Publication par
127407
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Publication par
lucius
CL loses over the four spell rotation in between lava bursts. Just normalize chain lightning damage into a rotation where you have eight seconds available. CL, LB, LB, CL or CL, LB, LB, LB vs. LB, LB, LB, LB.
LB, LB, LB, LB, LB would do more damage than CL, LB, LB, LB, CL if you could fit the extra bolt into the rotation. And CL, LB, LB, LB, LB will do more damage overall than CL, LB, LB, LB, CL. The only reason to use chain lightning is to stagger your casts onto the lava burst cooldown.
You're still doing it wrong. LBx5 also takes 1 second longer to cast than CL, LBx3, CL. If anything, the Lava Burst cooldown would let you argue the increased utility of using Chain Lightning in your rotation.
KK i just feel i need to clarify something here. Chain Lighting DOES NOT DO MORE DMG THAN Lighting Bolt so never ever use chain lighting on single targets or bosses it is a loss in dps.
If you are thinking that the base dmg of CL is more than LB then check your talents again and you will see that LB gets increased dmg but CL does not, so LB hits for more.
If you check the math (and the talents) you'll find CL offers more dps. Only T8x4 makes chain lightning less attractive.
Publication par
127407
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Publication par
lucius
Cast time is critical, and
Lightning Mastery
gives a larger boost to CL than LB.
We'll use 1042 as the average CL damage, and 765 for LB.
Base cast time of 2.5 seconds means LB gets a coefficient of 2.5 / 3.5 + 0.1 (shamanism) = 0.8143
CL's coefficient is 2 / 3.5 = 0.5714.
The most common pitfall is comparing the spells as if they had the same cast time. Normalising them both to 1 second, we have:
CL == 695 + 0.3809 * SP
LB == 383 + 0.4071 * SP
LB( w/glyph ) == 398 + 0.4234 * SP
As you can see, they actually scale pretty similarly and chainlightning actually has a pretty big head start with its base damage.
Publication par
127407
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Publication par
Mesoforte
CL loses over the four spell rotation in between lava bursts. Just normalize chain lightning damage into a rotation where you have eight seconds available. CL, LB, LB, CL or CL, LB, LB, LB vs. LB, LB, LB, LB.
LB, LB, LB, LB, LB would do more damage than CL, LB, LB, LB, CL if you could fit the extra bolt into the rotation. And CL, LB, LB, LB, LB will do more damage overall than CL, LB, LB, LB, CL. The only reason to use chain lightning is to stagger your casts onto the lava burst cooldown.
You're still doing it wrong. LBx5 also takes 1 second longer to cast than CL, LBx3, CL. If anything, the Lava Burst cooldown would let you argue the increased utility of using Chain Lightning in your rotation.
If I'm still doing it wrong, then test out the rotations on your shaman and post the difference. And stop normalizing the damage to 1 second. Normalize all the damage possible in an eight second window. That's the only damage you should be concerned about when dealing LB v CL damage.
Elemental dps is dependent upon the amount of spells you can squeeze in between Lava Bursts and the damage caused by those spells.
If you can fit 5 lightning bolts into the 8 second cooldown, it will do higher damage than doing 3 LB and 2 CL.
Take this scaling into account-
2000 on LB
1900 on CL
2000*4=8000/8=1000 0 seconds of no damage
1900*2+2000*2=7800/8=975 1 second of
no
damage.
1900+2000*3=7900/8=987.5 .5 seconds of no damage
That's what the damage looks like when you normalize to 8 seconds.
Publication par
lucius
kk agree on the base dmg my mistake in my calculations but still the LB has more dmg per cast then CL and CL has a cooldown, so spamming LB will do more on a single target
....
So my Question is am i wrong that LB does more Dmg that CL on a single target? If not then i my post is correct :)
You said that using chain lightning on one target is a drop in dps. The math says otherwise. Feel free to check my math and correct me.
Cast times are very important and you can't gloss over them.
Publication par
Mesoforte
Cooldowns are very important and you can't gloss over them.
Fix'd
Publication par
lucius
Elemental dps is dependent upon the amount of spells you can squeeze in between Lava Bursts and the damage caused by those spells.
If you can fit 5 lightning bolts into the 8 second cooldown, it will do higher damage than doing 3 LB and 2 CL.
I'm aware of how elemental dps works. The claim you all make when this arguement starts is that CL is better to cast before 1900 SP, but once you hit 1900 you should drop CL.
In your previous post, you mentioned your LB were 1.75s cast, and your CL at 1.31(?). Obviously, you can cast 4 LB, and have 1 second left over before LvB comes back up. So you're suggesting you cast nothing for 1 second rather than cast the shorter CL? With your haste, you'd be casting a flame shock every other rotation to fill that hole, and should be casting CL in the rounds where you don't have to refresh Flame shock.
At that point CL is both worth more DPS than LB AND delays LvB less. Obviously, there are haste values where you end up with lesser amounts of dead space in your rotation, and some of those cases it is probably fine to delay casting. But a one second delay seems too much.
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