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The relationship between defense rating and resilience
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Post by
136596
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Post by
Salali
No, you are not. Defense Skill increases Avoidance, Block Rating, chance to be missed, and reduces chance to be critically hit by 0.04%. It has nothing to do with Crushing Blows. For a brief explanation of this, please check the Warrior FAQs (use the Table of Contents).
Yes, you should socket almost all sockets to blue stamina gems. An exception can only be made to certain items, for certain reasons. An example would be using a +hit gem for
Gyro-balanced Khorium Destroyer
.
I didn't look at your Armory, so basically if the sword can be easily replaced or will be replaced within two weeks, don't bother putting Mongoose on it.
Save the epic gem for PVP gear, in my opinion. See above statement about "The Gun."
Boar's Speed on boots is a great enchant, but optional. Pure stamina is also a great enchant. The bracers are an exceptional place to obtain a +defense enchant without sacrificing much Stamina. I recommend it, as it sounds you are missing +defense (490 is absolutely required for any raid).
Please understand, hit rating (and thusly expertise) are invaluable for threat gear. Having or maintaining some amount of hit rating/expertise is important for all suits of armor, but it is not a top priority for survival tanking suits. Bottom line: you should have at least two suits of tanking armor at 70 (survival & threat generation, which can be interchanged for a mediocre combination).
From what I understand, resilience effectively drops the defense uncrushable cap. So as I geared up, I found myself expertise and hit rating deficient. And I removed a yellow defense gem for a hit gem.
Resilience does nothing for crushing blows.
I recommend reading this as a reference, as you are in dire need of more concise explanations on some topics. Here's the link:
http://www.tankspot.com/forums/tankspot-library/31941-fortifications-warrior-reference-guide.html
I highly recommend the above link.
Post by
136596
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
cms2k
Resilience is a damage reduction attribute used to mitigate physical & spell critical strikes and damage over time spells. It does not (in a raw sense) lower the defense, it does however lower the perception of that 490 mark, giving one the impression (perhaps effectiveness) that 472 for example would be cap needed to mitigate the damage. Simply put, resilience helps damage reduction in a way that you might get away with having a lower defense. Damage reduction regarding resilience is currently capped at 25% unless Blizz has changed it though not current cap exists for damage over time or critical strike chances. In short, resilience is more linear in application.
In general, the law of diminishing returns caps the defense at 490 to keep from being crushed by bosses. Any defense rating above 490 will not keep you from taking less damage from a given boss, outside of avoidance of course. Avoidance will go up for every point above 490 by 0.0167% on average at level 70. So while you won't necessarily take less damage from a blow with raw defense, you might dodge or parry the blow (resulting in zero damage) or block which DOES result in reduced damage. The graph is more based on a curve hence the diminishing returns. As it passes 490, the "crushable" possibility goes away and avoidance starts to pick up.
I now its confusing yet keep two or three sets of gear to try it different ways. You'll see what I mean. Our guild does a post mortum after each battle (successful or not) to determine what happened and where we can improve. When I gear tanks initially to run kara, I focus on defense, armor, stamina, avoidance (DASA). Once in kara and get a three or four good drops, I focus more on avoidance and stamina all the while giving up a little defense here and there.
Now, all that being said, every player, tank or otherwise, will find what works best for their playing style. Somehow I'm sure this will cause another firestorm.
Dodge & Parry: Don't get hit at all
Block: Taking in the arm and let the shield take the brunt.
Resilience: Taking it on the chin and get it reduced.
Post by
Salali
Can you explain this statement then in the highly-respected Berg's Tank Gear Ratings. I want to make sure I understand:
Resilience will count as 0 tankpoints in all items that have it in this guide since
the baseline is always over the 490 defense mark
, but it does have a useful benefit.
If you are trading off some tanking gear for aggro generating gear, you usually try to remain crit-immune.
If some of your gear has resilience, the defense cap is actually lowered. For example, if you have the Gladiator's Shield Wall, then your defense cap is actually 472.
I believe the author, presumably Berg, is trying to show you that, as long as you have 490 Defense rating, it is possible to replace some "tanking" items (that would be the item with defense on it), with a more DPS-oriented item to help clear trash faster, etc. The DPS-oriented item would need resilience to compensate for the missing defense rating. Why do you need to compensate? Because if the missing defense rating causes you to be critically hit, well it could be very bad. By compensating with resilience, you "bridge the gap" while using DPS-oriented items.
I don't really believe in this philosphy; I suggest stacking large amounts of expertise & shield block value if you want to deal more damage clearing trash. Honestly, who calculates the lost defense & additional resilience mid-combat? This is the problem with theorycrafting, it can only be done pre- & post-combat, =P
Also, do not put a great deal of faith into the "tankpoints" rating system. When it comes to tanking, there are other ways of finding out which item is optimal. The optimal way, for progression as an example, would be the Theory of Effective Health. I'm sure you know what that is, and can read the entire article at
www.tankspot.com
-- in the Forums, under the Library (guides & articles) section.
Post by
Salali
Also, the author Berg, as well as majority of players, refer to these things as a "cap" when in fact they are merely a minimum. 490 defense rating is a minimum, it's not a set-in-stone cap. The same error frequently occurs in discussion of hit rating, which also does not have a practical "cap."
Fast fact!
It takes 39.4 Resilience rating to equal 60 defense rating, they are both 1% critical hit reduction.
Berg's statement is quite confusing & semantically incorrect. Allow me to dissect a statement.
Instead of this:
If some of your gear has resilience, the defense cap is actually lowered.
Try this:
If some of your gear has resilience, the minimum required defense is actually lowered.
It is lowered because, and only because, it has been compensated for by resilience. The minimum of 490 has not technically lowered, but partially replaced. Understand?
Now, one last note to touch on. Someone above was fumbling around the topic of Uncrushability & Uncritable concerning 490 defense. Allow me to state it clearly:
490 defense rating successfully pushes critical strikes off the combat table.
490 defense rating translates to 24.87% avoidance which, when combined with Shield Block & Deflection, automatically push Crushing Blows off the table (490 defense + 75% chance to block + 5% chance to parry = 104.87%).
102.4% is the minimum required total of avoidance, block, and chance to be missed necessary to be Uncrushable.
Post by
95776
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Post by
blademeld
490 defense rating translates to 24.87% avoidance which, when combined with Shield Block & Deflection, automatically push Crushing Blows off the table (490 defense + 75% chance to block + 5% chance to parry = 104.87%).
102.4% is the minimum required total of avoidance, block, and chance to be missed necessary to be Uncrushable.
no, prot warriors have a base of 33% avoidance (including parry from arms tree)
Defense Skill 370
Dodge Rating 0
Dodge Chance % 5.92
Parry Rating 0
Parry Chance % 10.8
Block 0
Block Rating 0
Block Chance % 10.8
Avoidance % 33.32
Post by
136596
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Post by
136596
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Post by
106896
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Post by
Salali
Lusk, you are uncrittable. With 52 resilience rating (1.32% reduced crit), one only needs 457 defense rating total (to be crit immune). You have 473 defense rating, which is 17 short of 490. Work on replacing the resilience, but for crit reducing purposes: you are uncrittable.
Also, be extremely careful when using the Be Imba! website. The character audit may tell you it is safe to remove
x
amount of defense rating, but always, and I stress this,
ALWAYS
maintain 491 in practice. The Character Sheet rounds these figures up (489.6 would be 490 on tooltip), but the actual game in-play will use 489.6 in the calculations. Murphy's Law says, "You are critically hit for 16,000 damage. You die." Don't wanna have to explain this topic to the guildmates^_^
Defense Skill 370
Dodge Rating 0
Dodge Chance % 5.92
Parry Rating 0
Parry Chance % 10.8
Block 0
Block Rating 0
Block Chance % 10.8
Avoidance % 33.32
Chance to block is not technically avoidance, but I did indeed count it. The discrepancy you picked up on is because I did not consider the 20 Defense Skill from Anticipation, as you did. I only included Deflection (+5 parry).
Post by
136596
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Post by
Salali
I highly recommend reading Yakra's sticky at the top of the forums (after looking at your gear, which I know you are working on very hardly!). In the table of contents, you will find which page, and post, contains a gear list for Pre-Karazhan. These items will be fairly easy to obtain, and I highly recommend them.
Also, replace your helmet with Felsteel Helm (and 3 Solid Stars of Elune). It's the best non-epic, pre-Karazhan helmet for tanking. Yes, it is better than Myrmidon's Headdress.
Post by
blademeld
Chance to block is not technically avoidance, but I did indeed count it. The discrepancy you picked up on is because I did not consider the 20 Defense Skill from Anticipation, as you did. I only included Deflection (+5 parry).
Defense
Stealth Skill 0
Defense Rating 0
Defense Skill 350
Dodge Rating 0
Dodge Chance % 5.12
Parry Rating 0
Parry Chance % 5
Block 0
Block Rating 0
Block Chance % 5
Avoidance % 20.12
Resilience Rating 0
Resilience % 0
how about now?
Post by
Salali
I don't know. I did the math & it added up. We simply aren't adding the same things, in one place or another.
In either case, it doesn't matter. The 5% parry from talents & 490 defense rating gives enough avoidance to, with Shield Block, be uncrushable. A warrior could be naked given said criteria, and still be uncrushable.
Post by
94430
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Post by
136596
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