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Druids viable tank healers?
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Post by
MegaVolt
I'm wondering if Druids could be good tank healers in serious content. With all the buffs that Nourish got recently our single target hps is through the roof, right?
Currently my unglyphed Nourish hits for a bit more then 7k and crits for almost 11k on a target with a HoT. With the glyph that should become at least 9k and almost 14k for crits. With NG almost always up when spamming Nourish and the easy to get 1s cap with NG this equals around 11k to 12k hp every second on the tank by Nourish spam alone. Additionally LBx3, Regrowth, Rejuv and maybe even WG are ticking. I think the raw numbers look quite promising. And that's not even counting Living Seed.
The only disadvantage I see is that we don't have a proc like Inspiration or Ancestral Healing that will decrease the damage taken. We also don't have a Beacon of Light to allow us to heal 2 tanks at once so we will not be able to catch up to Paladins ;) But might we be a valuable substitute for a Shaman or a disc Priest on the tank? The raw hps suggests it and from my experience that healing style should also be sustainable (at least when slow stacking LB on CC procs and letting it bloom).
I'm talking about serious content here, meaning ToC hard modes. I know that even a holy Priest can tank heal the ToC normal modes and I healed ToC normal mode with only 1 other healer (Shaman) succesfully without even being glyphed for Nourish right now. Normal modes are too easy to be a valid testing ground.
Does anybody know how Druids do on tank healing (compared to Shamans and disc Priests, Paladins are overpowered on tank healing and untouchable anyway) in hard modes?
TL;DR: New Empowered Touch makes Druids able to properly tank heal?
Post by
404185
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
pezz
You couldn't before the new empowered touch?
I've never met a healer who rejected his/her healing assignments saying 'my class can't do that', including myself who would happily and successfully raid heal on my old paladin. Now that I have a newly 80 druid I'm finding I have no trouble keeping tanks up if I roll my HoTs and spam Nourish as necessary, despite my horrible (but slowly improving) spell power.
Post by
MegaVolt
Living Seed
is
our proc that decreases damage taken.
No it's not. Living Seed is our crit effect increase modifier.
All dps classes (afaik ... is there an exception?) have some kind of talent that gives them bonus critical effect, making critical strikes do 200% damage instead of 150% damage.
Healers usually don't have talents like that. However, healers have talents that proc something else for 30% of the critical effect. If you do the math you will find that 1/3 of 150% (the critical healing) is 50% so the 30% Living Seed does in the end almost equal a 200% critical effect (as opposed to the 150% "normal" critical).
Shamans have the same thing with
Ancestral Awakening
and Priests with
Divine Aegis
. It's basically nothing else then giving heals a 200% critical instead of the 150% critical - just in a fancy version.
Living Seed
is nothing special, it's just one of those abilities. But Shamans and Priest get
additional
damage reduction with
Ancestral Healing
or
Inspiration
for which Druids have no equivalent spell. Druids have to counter that missing damage reduction with raw healing power.
@pezz:
I know WoW is mostly very easy. Of course I
could
before the Empowered Touch change. But that doesn't mean it's a good thing to do. If somebody else is better at the job why should I do it?
My question is: With the recent change, are Druid tank healers viable even for the min/maxers? Do they perform any better or worse then Shamans and Priests?
Sure, any healing class can heal tanks through most of the content, at least normal modes. But who is the best at it? ;)
My tank healing preference usually was:
Paladin > Shaman = disc Priest > Druid > holy Priest
Is that still true or could it now be:
Paladin > Shaman = disc Priest = Druid > holy Priest
or even
Paladin > Druid > Shaman = disc Priest > holy Priest
?
Post by
pezz
Every class is viable for raid DPS, yet we still get a ton of threads in general and PVE to the effect of 'wich dsp is gr8?/?' every day. The answer is always bring the player, not the class. Random crit healing skills or whatever doesn't decide who the best tank healer is, it depends how well the player knows their class.
For the record, you have paladins in the number one spot in your tank healing list, and your main complaint about druids is a sub-standard on-crit effect. Paladins haven't got one at all. Also, if we're talking about literally and strictly healing one tank here, Beacon is a completely useless ability.
Post by
hashmel
yes, druids are even better at single target healing with the changes
no, they're not better than disc priests or holy pallies at single target healing
we're easily an option for the job instead of one of the above 2 being a must have
shaman are great at raid or tank healing depending on gear/spec, pallies raid heal just by glypghing their main nuke and keeping bacon up, priests have a spec for MT and a spec for raid healing, it's only natural blizzard wants the trees to have a part in it and getting a bit more variety in their spec choice
i'd imagine we'd have faster heals on 1 target than any other healer due to the insanely quick nourish spam with NG, living seed going off like crazy, and hots up to 4 hots (WG, RJ, RG, LB) rolling there's bound to be something being healed every second to help compensate for the lack of a damage reduction (as that is largely due to the other healers having more time between heals
Post by
MegaVolt
For the record, you have paladins in the number one spot in your tank healing list, and your main complaint about druids is a sub-standard on-crit effect. Paladins haven't got one at all. Also, if we're talking about literally and strictly healing one tank here, Beacon is a completely useless ability.
There is always an off tank. Assuming Druids and Paladins are equally strong on the MT (which it seems they actually are) why would I ever want to put a Druid there when min/maxing my raid composition if the Paladin can deliver the same healing on the MT and heal the OT for free at the same time?
And my main complaint was not the sub-standard on-crit effect. Living Seed is comparable to the Priests Divine Aegis, they are very similar. It's not sub-standard.
It's just that we lack a buff like Inspiration. Yes, Paladins lack that too - but they can more then compensate by simply having BoL on the off tank. Something Druids can not do. If it wasn't for the beacon I wouldn't put Paladins at the top.
Post by
Animer
I have played resto druid, holy/disc priest, holy paladin and resto shammy. Yes some classes are better in some situations than others but in the end it depends on the player. Druids can MT heal, it has been done allot. All classes have different playing/healing styles and having played them all ( some on a friends account ) all I can say it that saying one healer class is better than the others is BS(no not Blacksmith). I have seen resto shammy out heal priests that had way better gear and the other way around.
Yes pally can effective heal 2 tanks at once, but there are things pally's cannot do that other classes can. (AoE instant heal and AoE big heal, HoT like mad, Rebirth hehe, CC (entangling roots, shackle undead, Hex))
Personally I prefer shammy over all the other heal classes just because I have the most fun healing with him.
I guess what I'm trying to say is rather judge if the player can heal MT or raid than if the class can heal it. It's a healing class so yes they can heal it, if the player can is a different story....
Post by
Bearclaws
I have played resto druid, holy/disc priest, holy paladin and resto shammy. Yes some classes are better in some situations than others but in the end it depends on the player. Druids can MT heal, it has been done allot. All classes have different playing/healing styles and having played them all ( some on a friends account ) all I can say it that saying one healer class is better than the others is BS(no not Blacksmith). I have seen resto shammy out heal priests that had way better gear and the other way around.
Yes pally can effective heal 2 tanks at once, but there are things pally's cannot do that other classes can. (AoE instant heal and AoE big heal, HoT like mad, Rebirth hehe, CC (entangling roots, shackle undead, Hex))
Personally I prefer shammy over all the other heal classes just because I have the most fun healing with him.
I guess what I'm trying to say is rather judge if the player can heal MT or raid than if the class can heal it. It's a healing class so yes they can heal it, if the player can is a different story....
Well said! And I totaly agree. Its the same with all classes and their "weekneses" I would say. It depends on the player to do the right things, to know what to do at the right time. A good geared DPS perfect for the job can do less DPS than a lesser geared one not "fitted" for the job.
Post by
Celdhyrean
I think the only problem we have with tank healing is the slight interuption when you need to refresh hots, especially LB. That being said, yes i have done it quite often on our 10-mans (Hodir MT healing at the beginning of Ulduar, Mimiron p1, ...) and while we aren't the best choice we can hold our ground.
Post by
samarium
No it's not. Living Seed is our crit effect increase modifier.
Actually it's a hybrid of the two. If a target is constantly receiving attacks (i.e. the main tank, or anybody with a rogue on them) then it serves as a simple crit bonus modifier, and if they are taking occasional large swings (bosses with a cleave tank, like those in ZA) then it serves the same function as PW:S, to reduce the effective damage of the next attack. Of course if the next attack is a -1 from a critter then the effect is wasted, so it isn't a 1:1 comparison, but it's in the same ballpark.
I love that its hybrid nature reflects our own Druish ( :D ) hybrid-ness.
We can MT heal just fine - glyph Nourish and keep those hots rolling!
Here:
watch this
and never worry about Druid healing again XD
Post by
138584
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
hashmel
Hey I have an idea, why don't you nerf holy paladins capacity to tank heal since they are OP. ANd then nerf Druids capacity to raid heal to that which a paladin can do. Then we can all get the same spells and all wear plate armor!
Imagine how much fun having 4 classes of the exact same healer would be!
my exact same healer is better than your exact same healer =P
Post by
karlusdavius
No it's not. Living Seed is our crit effect increase modifier.
Actually it's a hybrid of the two. If a target is constantly receiving attacks (i.e. the main tank, or anybody with a rogue on them) then it serves as a simple crit bonus modifier, and if they are taking occasional large swings (bosses with a cleave tank, like those in ZA) then it serves the same function as PW:S, to reduce the effective damage of the next attack. Of course if the next attack is a -1 from a critter then the effect is wasted, so it isn't a 1:1 comparison, but it's in the same ballpark.
Wrong. Living Seed is nothing like PW:S .
Living Seed works exactly like
Prayer of Mending
in it's effect. Power Word: Shield decreases the
next incoming attack
by an amount.
Living Seed and Prayer of Mending heal the target
after the subsequent attack
. Therefore, if you have 1000 Health, and you hit for 1000 damage, Living Seed nor prayer of mending will save your tank. Power Word: Shield will.
Post by
5200
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
404185
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
sunwukung
A restodruids advantage over the other healing classes, is the number of instant cast or low cast times. A druid can tank and raid heal at the same time.
I am never assigned an assignment. I roll hots on tanks while throwing out raid heals. I am not the only tank or raid healer but more often than not I am the only one tank and raid healing.
Post by
OscarDivine
A druid can tank and raid heal at the same time.
So
can
a
priest
and
many
other
classes
too
.
Post by
sunwukung
A druid can tank and raid heal at the same time.
So
can
a
priest
and
many
other
classes
too
.
Yes, other healers can tank/raid heal but druids can do it at a constant, sustained HPS on tanks/raid for less mana while other healers do a burst style healing, some with high mana costs.
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