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Common problems with looting rules
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Post by
425483
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Post by
350062
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Post by
anywherenotes
Well, for whatever reason, whenever I /roll on my main (doesn't work on alts), which we do for offset, I win.
Many guildies are now QQing about it, calling me loot !@#$%. It's not pleasant, but I'm trying to spin it to say that they are noobs and game wants me to have all the loot.
For main set we use dkp, which rewards players who come more often.
New members, feel they are being left out of the loot distribution.
Amm, in BC I switched from paladin healing to tanking. And during a raid found out that we have a policy of gearing up warrior tanks over any other.... That made me very @#$%ed off, had I at least known in advance, I'd be fine, or not as $%^&ed off. So communication is key with any kind of loot-priority.
Amm, well in BC also when we were battling kara, an alt healer won tier /roll over my warrior tank. Next day we went to Grull, and of course that alt wasn't there :( So I'd say do: main > alt during guild runs, we don't really have that policy, though that's the policy for getting into a run, it's not for loot once in the run.
Post by
Dralas
Well, if you are in a raiding guild, you should probaly use DKP system. Its the only logical way I see it.
Why give BiS gear to a new guy rather not the veteran raider whose been loyal to the guild? Easy fix, the veteran raider will have spare dkp, and he can get it. The new guy will have to work and earn his points and show his loyalty.
Rolling just is not that good most of the time. Because if the new guy shows up, and the loot he wants drops along with the veteran, they roll, veteran loses, how does the guy whose worked for his kills feel?
And if your guild is biased and they just won't let you loot something you actually need, then obviously you need a new guild.
Post by
Booterang
Looting Problems
are
the reason why guilds disband.
WoW raiding guilds are generally run in the form of a meritocracy. The ones that have been active since the game came out generally have a rigid and fair loot system, usually based on DKP or some other items/hours system.
There are really only two reasons why a guild will be disbanded:
Loot drama or quitting the game.
One of the best cross-faction raiding guilds on my server recently disbanded because all the leadership quit the game, but 95% of the time guilds disband over loot drama.
GL on your report.
Post by
134043
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Post by
cosmicguen
In the interest of variation in replies, I'll go ahead.
I'm in a very small guild of RL friends, not all of whom are even interested in raiding. Mostly we're just altoholics and use WoW as more of a way to get together and have a giggle. Anyway, with WotLK giving more accessible endgame content to the masses, we've gotten into raiding. We have to run with another small guild (who we used to hit Kara with in BC) just to get enough people (even for 10 man), so we've set up a website to keep everything coherent across the two guilds.
When we first started raiding Naxx 10 we found that there were so many of us rolling on everything that dropped that loot got distributed fairly evenly without any extra effort on our parts. Then we got to the point of most loot getting melted and nobody minding that the 'latecomer' managed to pick up 4 upgrades in that run when the 'veteran' didn't get anything - because the veteran had what he wanted, the latecomer needed the stuff that dropped.
Once we got into 25 man Naxx (and now into 10 man Ulduar) we decided it would be horribly unfair to have any Johnny-come-lately getting more upgrades than the guys who'd slogged through countless 10 man and heroic runs they didn't need just to help get people geared up.
We've always run with main > off for rolling priority, ofc, so we just expanded this (via discussion on the website) to "two upgrades per run" - offspec rolls are included in this. It takes a loot master with some sense (and a handy chart by his writing hand) to keep track of everything, and it's not for everyone, but it works perfectly well for us.
I can win two rolls in a night and just keep on rolling - the loot master will discount my rolls
unless
I am the only person to roll, in which case clearly no one else wants it, so I can take it. Or, I might win one and then not roll on the next thing I want just in case the boss after that drops my shoulder token (or whatever).
We've got one guildie who's a bit...irrational about loot. But that's a personal thing with him being a bit of an ass, and not anything to do with the way we've set up our looting rules.
Bit of a sidenote: what's this paper about? I'm intrigued - long time since I was at school but I'd have been given detention for a week to re-write if I handed in an essay on anything related to a computer game. Good luck with it anyway :D
Edit
: wall of text, sorry. My pen runneth over >.>
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425483
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312967
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Post by
cosmicguen
Maybe more information that most people needed or wanted to know, but hey - you asked :)
I did indeed, and now I know :P Curiosity sated, thank you. Sounds to me like you're right on both counts; lucked out on your marker and made a good case for the topic.
Best of luck again.
... the one drop i'd been waiting for came and because i was tank i couldn't roll for it. So a guy who had pugged the raid got the item i'd been waiting for for 2 months. This was just because i was nice enough to deul spec Prot\Ret.
This just reminded me. I was also kind enough to dual spec fury/prot to help out (spending a lot of gold and time learning how to tank, I might add).
Because of dual spec we decided that we would all 'choose' a main spec and that would decide the gear we rolled on, regardless of what role we were actually playing in a raid on any given night. Since I've always been fury that was my mainspec.
One night I tanked the whole way through a Naxx 10 run. There were a couple of things that dropped that I could have used for dps but I held off rolling since I knew I'd be in 25 man again soon and could get better stuff there. I was saving my rolls for tank gear. I was beaten on every roll for the
NINE
tank upgrades that dropped. Frustrating and a bit unlucky, but the people who won those rolls
never
offered to tank and were running around with better tanking gear than me. It was infuriating.
Since then we've agreed that we can 'swap' main specs. So I now roll prot mainspec in Naxx 10 and dps mainspec in everything else, for example. This currently really only applies to the people who are there for (almost) every run and do the work of going back to runs we don't really need just to help out the people who do need them. Everyone is welcome to 'swap' their mainspec when they feel ready to do so, there are only a few of us who currently do.
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146010
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Post by
Celdhyrean
Officer in a raiding guild which exists since Vanilla and raiding MC days. Raiding type = non-hardcore.
To give an idea of our performances, we did :
- MC and half of BWL in Vanilla
- killed Vash but not Kael, after attunement patch Archimonde but not RoS (big lag problems on the server didn't help), and then after the nerf patch before wotlk came out killed Illidan and Brutallus in BC.
- killed everything (including Sarth3D) up to Vezax in wotlk.
The loot system used is mostly loot council. There have been a few crisis and a few improvements brought to the system, but overall we've been pretty solid on that specific point. There has been drama (would be surprising else over 4 years) but those mostly led to 1-2 persons leaving which is still a good result.
Loot council is composed of the class leaders and guild officiers (usually 5-6 persons in each raid), and attributions are done depending on rarity of drops, number of loots already recieved, big or small upgrade, and implication in the guild (ie old raider vs new/applicant, comes to each raid or is only here the minimum, performs well or doesn't). Nonce of those criterias are absolute, ie if the "old and reliable" guy has 4-5 more loots than the newer member, the newer member might still get it (unless it's a BiS item that drops for the first time or whatever).
Mainspec before offspec obviously, an applicant mainspec comes before a long time raider's offspec. Second specs also have priority over offspec, and there we tend to favor those who show that they are ready to help with their 2nd spec.
There have been a few problems with members of the loot council not necessarily knowing what someone recieved in previous raids resulting in 2 persons getting a ton of loots in a few raid nights, which led to some complaints from raiders (though not drama thankfully). We then implemented public loot lists, ie lists by class with what main spec loots someone did recieve as a reference sheet to not favorise someone too much due to wrong perceptions.
It works well because we do listen and are able to justify our choices, and because we did take into account the problems that were relayed to us and took action to try to solve them.
Edit : there have also been a few impatient guys (trialist who wants the same right on all loot than old raiders) and such, but those usually leave the guild rapidly, and without causing drama inside the guild (even though they might try to smear our guild on /1), ie very small impact.
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