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PTR
10.2.5
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10.2.6
Avatar (animated TV show) ~potential spoilers~
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Post by
Rankkor
And there is a girl in the Promise who is a firebender, and her dad is one as well and her mom is an earthbender.
Actually dude, you got it wrong.
If you're talking about the daughter of the governor of that fire nation colony, she's actually an earthbender, and also a loyal fire nation citizen. Her dad is from the fire nation, but not a bender himself, and her mom is an earthbender, and a citizen of the earth kingdom.
As to how is bending passed along, I vaguely seem to recall an interview to Bryan where he said that the original benders were blessed by the spirits with the bending arts, but eventually some of them lost touch with the spiritual world, engaging in other activities.
The Air Nomads, were very spiritual, and detached from the world, so in their case (And their alone) ALL OF THEM were benders. The other nations though, their spirituality decreased over the years, and this is why some are benders and some are not.
As to how it is passed down, I'd guess only descendants of people who are in touch with the spirituality can inherit it. Its certainly something you need to be BORN with, you can't just teach non-benders to do it.
Edit:
Now here is something that's biting my head off.
Yue, specifically PRINCESS Yue.
Why is she a princess? I get that the Earth Kingdom is ruled by (duh) kings, and thus their children would be princes and princesses, and the fire nation is ruled also by a monarchy (analog to an emperor) so their kids are royalty as well. But the Water Tribe is that, a tribe, not a monarchy. Their leader is specifically addressed as "Chief".
Having this in mind, why is it then, that the daughter of the "Chief" of the northern water tribe is addressed as a princess, yet the son and daughter of the "Chief" of the southern water tribe (That's Katara and Sokka BTW) aren't?
Ain't that somewhat discriminatory?
Sokka even hangs a lampshade on it on episode 17, by saying he's more or less the prince of the southern water tribe. All he gets for his troubles is a mocking remark by Katara.
Why is the chief of the north tribe more important than the chief of the south tribe? At the very least the Chief of the south tribe FRIKKING FIGHTS FOR HIS TRIBE. The chief of the north just sits on his ass and throws feasts and performances.
Post by
Adamsm
Different tribes count their children differently?
Post by
Rankkor
Different tribes count their children differently?
but that goes against what we've seen elsewhere.
Despite their physical separations, all the different "branches" of all the 4 main cultures have the same customs. All 4 Air Nomad temples had the same traditions, all of the Earth Kingdoms (both Ba Sing Se and Omashu among others) have more or less the same customs, all the fire nation colonies too.
So why would the 2 only water cities in the world have such a blatant discrimination with regards to their leadership. North Chief gets treated as a king, his kids as royalty. South Chief gets treated like a slob, his kids as nobodies.
Considering how similar they are in almost everything else (blatant sexism regarding the bending arts non-withstanding) its a little baffling why this is there. I mean, why was Yue named princess in the first place, they could had just called her Yue and lose nothing in the process. Did they wanted to make her somewhat more "noble" and "higher" than slobs katara and sokka from the yokel tribe?
Post by
Adamsm
Because it means more when a Princess gives up her life to save the world duh...and everything's better with Princesses.
Post by
Nathanyal
Different tribes count their children differently?
This. The Northern and Southern tribes are completely different groups. The Southern are more of a small tribe. Whereas the Northern tribe is huge, 10 times as big as the Southern tribe. If the Southern tribe was as big as the Northern, then they would probably need someone to help rule them. But it is like those Earth Kingdom cities you see the group travel through. They have no real leaders, but there are people they ask for advice. Like the small village Haru is from.
Edit: It may also be in part that the two tribes have became quite distant over the years. It wasn't until the group went to the Northern tribe that they actually thought about going back to their sister tribe and help make things right. Even though they are both Water Tribes, they are completely different groups. Which is also why they have separate seats on the council in the Republic City.
Post by
Rankkor
Different tribes count their children differently?
This. The Northern and Southern tribes are completely different groups. The Southern are more of a small tribe. Whereas the Northern tribe is huge, 10 times as big as the Southern tribe. If the Southern tribe was as big as the Northern, then they would probably need someone to help rule them. But it is like those Earth Kingdom cities you see the group travel through. They have no real leaders, but there are people they ask for advice. Like the small village Haru is from.
Edit: It may also be in part that the two tribes have became quite distant over the years. It wasn't until the group went to the Northern tribe that they actually thought about going back to their sister tribe and help make things right. Even though they are both Water Tribes, they are completely different groups. Which is also why they have separate seats on the council in the Republic City.
It doesn't helps explain then why the south tribe later gets special treatment, and gets a specific seat on the republic council, whereas a MUCH larger city like Omashu does not.
Lets face it, awesome as it was, there are some plot holes on the original show.
Post by
Nathanyal
Makes sense to me. Omashu is in the Earth Kingdom, therefore they still are under the rule of the Earth King. But it would be hard for him to rule the entire Earth Kingdom, so each settlement that is big enough has a King of their own. Or in the case of the Fire Nation, they have the King and then they have Governors for the territories.
But the Water Tribes do not depend on each other at all. The only thing they have in common is that they live on the poles. They get a seat on the council because they are 2 different tribes. What they do in the Southern tribe has nothing to do with what the Northern tribe does. Something that may be good for the Northern tribe may not be good for the Southern.
We also don't know what the Southern Tribe is like nowadays. It may be as big as the Northern Tribe for all we know.
Post by
Patty
Because the Southern and Northern Water Tribes are entirely different entities. If the airbenders were still around, they may have gotten three seats.
As for Yue, don't think about it too much. Pocahontas is considered a Disney Princess despite being a Chief's daughter as well - it's just easier for most kids, particularly those living in countries that would be less familiar with actual monarchies.
Post by
Patty
I didn't like the Korra finale ending. :( Korra should have remained blocked to water, earth and fire imo. It would have been much more interesting than intervention from Aang.
Post by
Rankkor
I didn't like the Korra finale ending. :( Korra should have remained blocked to water, earth and fire imo. It would have been much more interesting than intervention from Aang.
see? someone who gets it.
IMO I don't think having her permanently locked from all the elements would had made a nice ending, I happen to like happy endings, but the way it was handled in the show was too neat and too clean.
As I said, I would had prefer it if she had gotten her powers back but flicker and faint and had to re-train herself in water earth and fire again to regain her former mastery of it. And likewise give her the ability to restore other's bending but they too get it flicker and faint and need to re-train it from zero.
Its a happy ending, yet they have to earn it. And cramming that "I love you too" in the last 20 seconds felt kinda tacky.
Just sayin'
Asides from these minor gripes, I did enjoyed the ending a lot. Though I feel it could had been better.
Post by
Patty
I think what would have been great would have been for Korra to first master internal harmony (reaching spiritual enlightenment, you know), which would then help unblock those three elements. Furthermore, Korra was in the spirit world when she saw Aang, obviously, and we know that all bending is impossible in that world. How did he cure her, exactly? :/
I think it would've been more interesting character development to lose what she defines herself by, and what she allows other people to define her by, forcing her to change, than just having a happy ending.
On another note, you said earlier that Avatars possibly couldn't master any of the sub-disciplines, because it's never been shown. Korra was shown as a capable waterhealer even before the season finale (when she healed Bolin after the pro-bending match). The more you know.
Post by
Azazel
One word: Energy bending.
Post by
Patty
Is, nevertheless, a form of bending. Again, spirit world.
Post by
Rankkor
I think what would have been great would have been for Korra to first master internal harmony (reaching spiritual enlightenment, you know), which would then help unblock those three elements.
Furthermore, Korra was in the spirit world when she saw Aang
, obviously, and we know that all bending is impossible in that world. How did he cure her, exactly? :/
I think it would've been more interesting character development to lose what she defines herself by, and what she allows other people to define her by, forcing her to change, than just having a happy ending.
Actually no. Watch that scene again, she's in the physical world. To enter the spirit world you need to leave your body behind, and its your spirit that goes inside. This was Aang manifesting himself on the real world, much like how Roku occasionally manifested himself on the real world on the original show as well (Such as when he helped Aang leave the Fire Temple).
Previous Avatars can rarely return to the physical world to help the current avatar. Another Example is when Kyoshi momentarily returned to the world to explain what really happened to Jin The Conqueror, and how she founded Kyoshi island. So this wasn't a case of Korra entering the spirit world and somehow being able to bend in there when its stated that's not possible. This was a case of Aang entering the physical world to help Korra. Furthermore, Mako saw the whole thing, and he wasn't in the spirit world. Regular people don't enter the spirit world unless dragged by a spirit themselves.
As to how did Korra learned spiritbending in the first place.............. your guess is as good as mine. I guess its not a hard discipline to learn, given how Aang learned it in a few seconds from that lion-turtle.
as for your other comment:
On another note, you said earlier that Avatars possibly couldn't master any of the sub-disciplines, because it's never been shown. Korra was shown as a capable waterhealer even before the season finale (when she healed Bolin after the pro-bending match). The more you know.
Ejem, I didn't said the avatar couldn't possibly master the sub-disciplines. I said that from a writing point of view it makes sense they don't let him or her do it, because it would make the avatar far too powerful and far too boring.
When creating a hero or heroine one has to be careful of how much power they're given. Being able to bend the 4 elements and using the avatar state is gamebreaking enough, being able to bloodbend+metalbend+lightningbend+waterheal on top of firebending+airbending+waterbending+earthbending AND being able to enter the avatar state would make any Avatar too frikking powerful, and basically a God-Mode Sue.
I'm pretty sure there's no reason in-universe for the avatar to learn the sub-disciplines, and I self-corrected myself when I stated that Korra does indeed knows how to waterheal.
Bloodbending and Metalbending are particularly new disciplines, so there's some excuse for the avatar not knowing how to use those (it would require to focus too much on a single element when they have to master 4 at the same time) but it does not explains why can't they use lightning or heal.
Also I just had a Fridge Brilliance moment here.
Airbending is particularly endangered because there's only 4 airbenders in the whole world (Unknown ATM if Rohan can bend any element at all) and this means the genetic diversity of airbenders will be somewhat risque.
But the thing is............. The avatar inherently can bend air as well, so the avatar can just keep having kids till at least one of them is an airbender. So if korra has an airbender child, that's one brand new airbender, and if the next avatar has another airbender child, there you go, more genetic diversity.
Tenzin better write down all the airbending techniques on scrolls tough, because knowledge like this is scarce.
Post by
Patty
That depends on how bending abilities are inherited, really. And, let's say, a couple of airbenders per generation isn't really going to lead to a massive increase in biodiversity, and it would be an incredibly slow process that assumes there would be little threats to airbending inbetween Avatar generations. But I don't think bending is necessarily always hereditary; Katara's parents and GranGran weren't waterbenders, and it would probably have been mentioned if her grandfather was, and I don't think Toph's parents were earthbenders either.
Post by
Rankkor
That depends on how bending abilities are inherited, really. And, let's say, a couple of airbenders per generation isn't really going to lead to a massive increase in biodiversity, and it would be an incredibly slow process that assumes there would be little threats to airbending inbetween Avatar generations. But I don't think bending is necessarily always hereditary; Katara's parents and GranGran weren't waterbenders, and it would probably have been mentioned if her grandfather was, and I don't think Toph's parents were earthbenders either.
Given that during the time Aang was frozen and the rest of the air nomads were wiped out not a single air bender was born, then yes, we have to assume bending is inherited.
Maybe it can skip a few generations (notice how Bumi, one of the children Aang and Katara had, is a non-bender) but its still inherited.
I would not be surprised if bumi marries a non-bender, and still has kids with bending potential, why? because his parents were benders. As long as somewhere in your family tree one of your progenitors was a bender, you can either inherit bending, or pass it to your own descendants.
And what I was going at, is that if only Tenzin's kids are benders, that would lead to little genetic diversity, but if other families had airbending kids (Such as one of Korra's kids, or heck, even one of Bumi's or Kya's kids) the diversity would increase.
Man this would be easier if people actually had LASTNAMES on this show. Its like only Toph is the one and only family on the whole world with a last name (Bei Fong BTW)
Post by
Patty
Well, how is it inherited, exactly? It doesn't seem to show a typical inheritance pattern. Furthermore, if it
was
genetically determined, bloodbending would be unable to
permanently
wipe out a bender's abilities.
Post by
Adamsm
Aye, have to agree Rank; look at Toph's parents: Neither of them can Bend after all. I think in the Avatar universe the Bending Gene is the X-Gene; you have a chance to be born with it, but if there isn't anyone around to train you in it, it just goes to waste.
So the 'reason' there weren't any new Air Benders during the 100 years between Aang being frozen and the start of Book 1 is that A) There were no new Air Nomads to train them and B) Fire Nation troops were still hunting for anyone who showed the Air Bending trait...and well, we know how that ends.....
Post by
Patty
The problem with that theory being that there was a ~70 year window of opportunity for anyone who may have shown air bending traits to be trained, and none have shown up yet. But yeah, thinking about the genetics of benders is making my head hurt. I spent like half an hour trying to come up with crosses and calculating the ratio of expression of genes for bending and it didn't make any sense so I gave up.
Post by
Adamsm
And for all we know in Book 2 of Korra, they'll find a lost tribe of Air Benders running around heh; it is a 'big' world after all.
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