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Post by
Orranis
I mentioned the fact an enviorment without predators was flawed. That was my entire point to why post-sapience evolution in humans has been flawed.
There are ideal ecosystems and there are flawed ones. Flawed is as you described, something is removed and thus has a detrimental effect.
Notice that humans, as the deer, are eating all the "grass" because of our lack of predators.
This flawed enviorment has led to a cancelation of natural selection due to our flawed, and finite, enviorment, allowing flawed mutations to flourish.
If we eat all our "grass" that means we go extinct through natural selection. Homosexuality isn't the problem there, it's the fact that not enough of us get eaten or die. That is an evolutionary flaw within itself, not a lack of natural selection. Sure, we might not evolve any further than we have already, but only because it's too difficult for nature to kill us, which can turn out to be an evolutionary flaw itself. We removed all our wolves.
You honestly just agreed with me by pointing out the fact of evolutionary flaws. I said that homosexuality wasn't a direct result of evolution, making it an evolutionary flaw. (Still no problem with it.)
Yes it is. We've
evolved
to this point you know. And homosexuality existed before humans did, you really can't say it only started existing when we started agriculture without some serious sauces.
And Light: There sure as sh*t can be a perfect enviorment. Orranis SAID the perfect enviorment if each level only had one species: Grass, Deer, and Wolves (and air...). The deer eat the grass, the wolves eat the deer, and the woves fertalize the grass when they die. A perfect cycle of an enviorment promoting proper evolution.
As I said, your beetle is the result of a flawed enviorment that promoted flawed evolutionary traits to flourish.
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS PROPER EVOLUTION. IT'S ALL EVOLUTION. ALL OF IT. GOOGLE PROPER EVOLUTION. THE FIRST RESULT IS ABOUT A BLOG ABOUT THE STARBUCKS LOGO. THAT IS A BALANCED ECOSYSTEM. IF SOMETHING UNBALANCES THE ECOSYSTEM, IT IS BECAUSE ITS TRAITS DID NOT SUIT THE ENVIRONMENT. THIS IS WHERE EVOLUTION OCCURS.
Post by
Patty
About homosexuality being an evolutionary flaw, that's
debatable
.
Post by
Atik
There is proper evolution: Evolution resulting from a proper envioment is proper evolution.
Post by
Orranis
There is proper evolution: Evolution resulting from a proper envioment is proper evolution.
Circular logic much?
If everything in the environment was perfectly balanced, there would be no evolution.
Post by
Patty
There is proper evolution: Evolution resulting from a proper envioment is proper evolution.
Define: Proper environment.
Define: Proper evolution.
Post by
Atik
There is proper evolution: Evolution resulting from a proper envioment is proper evolution.
Define: Proper environment.
Define: Proper evolution.
A proper enviorment consists of a very large "bottom tier", plants and such, a smaller tier or herbivores, even smaller tier of primary predators (eat herbivores), then a very small tier of optional secodary predators (eat other preds) and at the very top are other, non-living dangers that can just kill anything.
To go back to Orrnis' example, let me throw something to eat the the wolves: I like velociraptors, 'cause they are cool. Then let's say there is quicksand around.
The deers eat the grass, the wolves eat the deer, and the velociraptors eat the wolves. The quicksand can kill anything, and when something dies it goes back and feeds the grass; restoring the cycle.
This enviorment actually has a bit of leeway. Certain things can be removed without destroying the proper-ness.
Because it is a proper enviorment, it promotes proper evolution. Mutations that are beneficial to the species will flourish, while non-beneficial ones will not be allowed to flourish.
In a flawed enviorment, non-beneficial mutations can flourish, causing flawed evolution.
Post by
Patty
A proper enviorment consists of a very large "bottom tier", plants and such, a smaller tier or herbivores, even smaller tier of primary predators (eat herbivores), then a very small tier of optional secodary predators (eat other preds) and at the very top are other, non-living dangers that can just kill anything.
To go back to Orrnis' example, let me throw something to eat the the wolves: I like velociraptors, 'cause they are cool. Then let's say there is quicksand around.
The deers eat the grass, the wolves eat the deer, and the velociraptors eat the wolves. The quicksand can kill anything, and when something dies it goes back and feeds the grass; restoring the cycle.
This enviorment actually has a bit of leeway. Certain things can be removed without destroying the proper-ness.
Because it is a proper enviorment, it promotes proper evolution. Mutations that are beneficial to the species will flourish, while non-beneficial ones will not be allowed to flourish.
In a flawed enviorment, non-beneficial mutations can flourish, causing flawed evolution.
Not sure if you're trolling or just stupid at this point. :|
Post by
pikeyboy
The original rhetorical question is an oxymoron. Morality is connected to the harm that you do by performing a certain action. Sexuality is who you fancy. As far as I see it, as long as nobody is coerced into sexual activity, work away. My gay and lesbian friends certainly behave the same way as everyone else I know, apart from what they do in bed, which is no business of mine, or anybody else. Lots of people fancy both sexes to varying degrees. I really don't see what harm it does, or any relevance to morality. If Billy fancies Matthew, and I fancy Marie, They don't fancy her, I don't fancy them, and everybody gets to be happy.
Post by
Orranis
There is proper evolution: Evolution resulting from a proper envioment is proper evolution.
Define: Proper environment.
Define: Proper evolution.
A proper enviorment consists of a very large "bottom tier", plants and such, a smaller tier or herbivores, even smaller tier of primary predators (eat herbivores), then a very small tier of optional secodary predators (eat other preds) and at the very top are other, non-living dangers that can just kill anything.
To go back to Orrnis' example, let me throw something to eat the the wolves: I like velociraptors, 'cause they are cool. Then let's say there is quicksand around.
The deers eat the grass, the wolves eat the deer, and the velociraptors eat the wolves. The quicksand can kill anything, and when something dies it goes back and feeds the grass; restoring the cycle.
This enviorment actually has a bit of leeway. Certain things can be removed without destroying the proper-ness.
Because it is a proper enviorment, it promotes proper evolution. Mutations that are beneficial to the species will flourish, while non-beneficial ones will not be allowed to flourish.
In a flawed enviorment, non-beneficial mutations can flourish, causing flawed evolution.
I'm pretty much done arguing with you. You clearly don't understand enough about how evolution works to be able have a conversation about it.
Post by
soccergenius
@Atik
You can't use your own definition of Evolution, you have to use what's been generally accepted. What you're describing doesn't even match a middle school explanation of Evolution.
Post by
Adamsm
Should read his definition of ghosts in the Supernatural thread.
Post by
Azazel
It's worth it, trust me.
Post by
Interest
There is proper evolution: Evolution resulting from a proper envioment is proper evolution.
Define: Proper environment.
Define: Proper evolution.
A proper enviorment consists of a very large "bottom tier", plants and such, a smaller tier or herbivores, even smaller tier of primary predators (eat herbivores), then a very small tier of optional secodary predators (eat other preds) and at the very top are other, non-living dangers that can just kill anything.
To go back to Orrnis' example, let me throw something to eat the the wolves: I like velociraptors, 'cause they are cool. Then let's say there is quicksand around.
The deers eat the grass, the wolves eat the deer, and the velociraptors eat the wolves. The quicksand can kill anything, and when something dies it goes back and feeds the grass; restoring the cycle.
This enviorment actually has a bit of leeway. Certain things can be removed without destroying the proper-ness.
Because it is a proper enviorment, it promotes proper evolution. Mutations that are beneficial to the species will flourish, while non-beneficial ones will not be allowed to flourish.
In a flawed enviorment, non-beneficial mutations can flourish, causing flawed evolution.
My brain just blew up.
Post by
EnigmaPunch
I recently heard a radio interview with a Gay rights activist here in Australia, and he went into many points about why gay marriage should be allowed and why it should be embraced etc etc, but his last point was one that I had never heard before, and thought was excellent logic:
"The straight people of the world should welcome homosexuality, because it automatically reduces your competition for a mate".
Post by
EluraE
I recently heard a radio interview with a Gay rights activist here in Australia, and he went into many points about why gay marriage should be allowed and why it should be embraced etc etc, but his last point was one that I had never heard before, and thought was excellent logic:
"The straight people of the world should welcome homosexuality, because it automatically reduces your competition for a mate".
Really you've never heard that before?
I don't really like that saying anyway.
Post by
Jubilee
If a gay guy was was the one stealing all the girls from you before, I think there might be other problems =P
Post by
Azazel
If a gay guy was was the one stealing all the girls from you before, I think there might be other problems =P
QFT
Post by
Atik
If a gay guy was was the one stealing all the girls from you before, I think there might be other problems =P
Girls actually have a tendancy to want gay guys. They usually say it is because of how senstive, caring, ect they are. Even though they almost never like metrosexual guys.
Seems more like a "want what you can't have" thing.
Post by
Adamsm
Or, they are showing what kind of guy they want? And if all the guys are just cavemen around them well.......
Post by
EluraE
If a gay guy was was the one stealing all the girls from you before, I think there might be other problems =P
Girls actually have a tendancy to want gay guys. They usually say it is because of how senstive, caring, ect they are. Even though they almost never like metrosexual guys.
Seems more like a "want what you can't have" thing.
I've never met a girl who's wanted a gay guy unless she didn't know he was gay. Even so, being gay doesn't make you automatically sensitive and caring so if a woman thinks that, she's... stupid.
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