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Post by
Squishalot
So, there's a certain video doing the rounds about a schoolboy being bullied by a couple of kids, who eventually snaps, and picks up and throws his tormentor into the ground.
Although the vast majority of the interwebs are lauding this as a great victory for anti-bullying, there is some criticism being put forward - on a different day, it could've easily left him in hospital.
What are your thoughts on bullying and retaliation? At what point is retaliation getting out of the realms of 'self defense' and into something worse?
Post by
Monday
(This is for elementary/jr. high schools)
Bullying is a much larger problem than people think, and some pretty nasty stuff goes under the label of "bullying," which makes it less likely to be acted upon for some odd reason. You can say: "He's bullying me!" then the teacher will most likely "have a talk."
If you say somebody is assaulting you, the reaction is deeper.
What are your thoughts on bullying and retaliation? At what point is retaliation getting out of the realms of 'self defense' and into something worse?
I believe anybody has a right to self defense. But once the other is down and won't be trying anything against you for awhile, you should let it go. Revenge is a canker.
Post by
Cambo
There's a great christian pastor in the USA whom I admire; His son came home early from school one day because he had punched a kid who was continually teasing him. The guy took his son out for ice-cream to celebrate - not merely for punching, but for not being a push-over.
Bullying is terrible and is not acceptable in any fashion.
I think that parents should teach their children to stand up for themselves, and also to teach limits. If I needed to use force in such a manner, I think one punch to the nose should suffice. I highly doubt that I would unleash a flurry of blows. I feel it is my human instinct to defend myself and my honor, but not to seriously harm the other person. Much like a dog would feel threatened, run in and bite, then back off.
Post by
executorvgk
Theres an old Spanish saying which explains pretty well my ideas on retaliating to a bully.
The saying is: Para cabron cabron y medio
basically it means an eye for an eye... and a little extra.
What this means of course depends on the case and should involve a little bit of common sense, this by no means means that if a kid hits you, then you should pull a gun on him. It would mean if someone hits you and you haven't done anything to deserve getting hit then hit him back harder or a few more times.
You of course shouldn't go and look for the person to do this, just do it as a reaction, if your going in to do something first due to something he did yesterday it wouldn't be considered self defense, I guess it depends a lot on the timing and if it was a reaction done immediately or if it was a calculated thing due to something that happened before, this is however all pretty relative there isn't any numbers which say if done before X time and because of Y it's fine but if not then it isn't self defense.
This is my policy on actual bullying and not cyber "bullying" which I see as a complete joke, for that my policy is thicken up that skin of yours
Post by
Monday
This is my policy on actual bullying and not cyber "bullying" which I see as a complete joke, for that my policy is thicken up that skin of yours
So if your son died, and people started posting images of his corpse and saying "lol kid deserved it," you should just grow thicker skin?
Post by
Adamsm
Some of the bullies do need a swift kick in the head....but do it to the wrong one, and you could end up with a knife to the gut or a bullet to the face as the bully snaps as well. I mean, sure, everyone always says 'Oh tell someone!'; problem is, depending on the school, that does jack and squat: I dealt with some real idiots in both elementary school and high school, for different reasons.
In elementary school, I moved there in grade 4, was a quiet type, shy, and rarely stood up for myself; perfect bully bait. Had a group of the older students who did their best to make my life a living hell. I told the teachers, the vice principal and the principal....and the only one who gave a damn was our VP; if he saw them going for me, they were in massive !@#$. But the rest just ignored it. My mother went to speak to some of their parents; the parents laughed in her face and slammed the door. The only good thing was by grade 7 most of them were gone, and I went through a few growth spurts so suddenly I was the same height if not taller then some of the few tormentors who were left; they stopped at that point....of course, the fact that one of them pushed me into a rage and I smashed a baseball bat against a soccer goal post might have had something to do with that....
As for high school....god that was horrible; it was around that point I found my own beliefs, and there were a group of jocks who had a problem with that. Gotta say, learned how to move quickly at the end of the day; again, went to speak to the VP's at the high school and they didn't believe me, said that the 'good' boys like them wouldn't dream of doing any of the things I said. The one kid's parent wasn't any better; I actually heard that jack ass egg his kid on, to 'bash the skull of that witch'. Of course, parent with influence = nothing done with that threat. Again, towards the end of high school, I actually went toe to toe with one of them, and kicked his ass; that stopped the rest of them from going near me. Didn't have a huge group of friends, but had enough that they were sticking with me at that point to keep the rest of them off, 'just in case'.
So yeah, bulling sucks #$%^, and I don't regret beating that guy in high school; but I have to admit, glad he was embarrassed that he got his ass handed to him by the 'freak' because it kept them from trying to press charges on me; had just turned 18 so could have been bad.
Piece of amusement; guy who was the ring leader, is now nothing but a pump jockey.
So yeah, I don't denounce someone for beating down their tormentor, and have to admit that for some of those ass holes out there, the ones who drive young girls and boys to suicide with their taunts and insults, that they would get back what they serve. Maybe it would teach them something....but probably not.
Post by
executorvgk
This is my policy on actual bullying and not cyber "bullying" which I see as a complete joke, for that my policy is thicken up that skin of yours
So if your son died, and people started posting images of his corpse and saying "lol kid deserved it," you should just grow thicker skin?
well here's the thing chances are you don't know who it really is not much you can do about it so the solution is simple
a) exit internet
b) close tab
c) press alt f4
The thing about the internet is you don't have to see anything you don't want to, you know kind of like if you don't like all the RIFT blogs you can scroll under it or exit, if you see a post like that just stop reading comments as well.
You can't tell me it's the same thing as a person saying your kid deserved it to your face
Post by
Squishalot
You can't tell me it's the same thing as a person saying your kid deserved it to your face
From what you're saying, it seems like you're using the old 'sticks and stones' adage, so if they do it to your face (instead of behind the veil of the internet or beating your face up), what's the 'appropriate' retribution in your mind?
Post by
HoleofArt
This is my policy on actual bullying and not cyber "bullying" which I see as a complete joke, for that my policy is thicken up that skin of yours
So if your son died, and people started posting images of his corpse and saying "lol kid deserved it," you should just grow thicker skin?
That's kind of taking it to extremes - most people say "cyber bullying" as in someone calling someone else names over the internet. That's where the "thicken your skin" idea comes in.
However, something like you're suggesting would fall under "complete *!@#$%^".
Or maybe the kid did deserve it.
/shrug.
From what you're saying, it seems like you're using the old 'sticks and stones' adage, so if they do it to your face (instead of behind the veil of the internet or beating your face up), what's the 'appropriate' retribution in your mind?
I don't ever see that happening. People lose any confidence they have when it comes to face to face confrontation.
Post by
Squishalot
I don't ever see that happening. People lose any confidence they have when it comes to face to face confrontation.
It doesn't need to be the extreme only, the same question applies for general name-calling as well. Should you 'thicken your skin' in that situation too when someone's hurling abuse at you IRL? (As opposed to physical abuse, that is)
Post by
Adamsm
I don't ever see that happening. People lose any confidence they have when it comes to face to face confrontation.
Heh, I had a bruise under my eye for a week that says otherwise to that statement.
Post by
HoleofArt
I don't ever see that happening. People lose any confidence they have when it comes to face to face confrontation.
It doesn't need to be the extreme only, the same question applies for general name-calling as well. Should you 'thicken your skin' in that situation too when someone's hurling abuse at you IRL? (As opposed to physical abuse, that is)
I would say it doesn't apply there, as I was referring to only cyber bullying. :P
I don't ever see that happening. People
who act like that on the internet
lose any confidence they have when it comes to face to face confrontation.
Better?
Post by
Squishalot
Better?
I don't think so. The people who act like that in real life *also* act like that on the internet. It's too much of a generalisation to say that everyone who 'cyber-bullies' will chicken out in real life, especially when cyber-bullying is often an extension of real-world bullying (e.g. facebook bullying).
I don't think forum trolling counts as cyber-bullying, from most people's points of view (i.e. the only time that cyber-bullying will occur in the absence of a real-world presence).
Post by
Adamsm
Aye, trollers are nothing like a cyber bully; you might be able to make a troll back down, but get into the face of a bully, and they'll get right back in yours most of the time.
Post by
executorvgk
You can't tell me it's the same thing as a person saying your kid deserved it to your face
From what you're saying, it seems like you're using the old 'sticks and stones' adage, so if they do it to your face (instead of behind the veil of the internet or beating your face up), what's the 'appropriate' retribution in your mind?
If it's simply words I wouldn't really be seeking retribution, I don't really get offended very easily like you mentioned "sticks and stones". Chances are I'd either ignore it, laugh it off, or try to be witty about it.
Doing so would make the person stop, or begin to use the phrase in a joking manner, I've actually gotten some of my old nicknames, Nazi to name one, from people trying to be offensive.
Now if it's something extreme like saying lol your son died like holeofart said people wouldn't generally have the confidence to say it to you face, but if that ever did happen I would bet it would not be a matter of retaliation but of how well your temper holds.
I'm not an aggressive person but if anyone ever did insult a close loved one that died recently while your still grieving I doubt it'd be a matter of retaliation for most people either,
Post by
executorvgk
Aye, trollers are nothing like a cyber bully; you might be able to make a troll back down, but get into the face of a bully, and they'll get right back in yours most of the time.
Ya but the thing is you can make this "bullying" stop easily
Hey person A said I was an X and a Y and that I Z in 3 different e-mails hey I just got a new e-mail from them I'm gonna just open it
Hey person B is saying X and Y about me on Z site I'm going to read every message of what they said and if it's a social networking site I won't press the block button.
I'm being harassed by C in X game community, I won't block them, ignore them, have a mod ban them, not read any messages by them etc.
The thing about cyber "bullying" is it's an easy fix this can be fixed the same way the people who hate blogs in Wowhead people can fix the problem, by scrolling down or not clicking on it
Post by
Adamsm
Yes....except the bullies are sending emails, texts, and other messages, disguised under the names of the victims friends. So, unless you are suddenly going to stop opening every single email, stop accepting all texts, and block every single person you know.....
Post by
xaratherus
I was on the receiving end of a fair amount of bullying in school. I only got into one fight over it. The bully had an odd reaction: He seemed to think that fighting meant posturing and putting on a show for the people who gathered around. I slammed him with a 15-pound backpack, once - and hard - in a rather sensitive area while he was busy taunting me. Then I turned and walked away while he was writhing on the floor.
I advocate self defense. I also advocate ending any physical conflict as quickly as possible, by putting the opponent on the ground by any means necessary*.
*Non-lethal, if the person doesn't seem to have lethal intent.
Post by
Queggy
This thread makes me think of Ender's Game.
:|
Post by
soccergenius
There was a bully I remember back in middle school, eight grade. He was a small wrestler, and kinda insecure--he was on 24/7 anti gay patrol, but I digress. He used to bully a much larger kid quite often. One day, in the P.E. locker room, he shoved him against the lockers one time too many. The larger kid turned around, confronted him, and the two started swinging. It was actually kinda funny because most kids don't know how to fight and these two were no exception. The gym teacher came in to break it up and I saw the bully about 10 min later in homeroom with a broken pinky finger, crying like a little baby. He stopped bullying the larger kid that day.
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