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Project: Updating the feral guides
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Post by
Tarkeel
There is a lot of good stuff in the guides, but some of it can be hard to find, some is outdated, and some is missing. My latest crazy idea is to consolidate this info in three new posts: One for new, leveling druids, one for lvl 80 bears, and one for lvl 80 kittens. I've started writing some of the text, but I want feedback on the proposed contents:
Feral 101: Introduction and Leveling
1) Introduction
1.1) Quick stat sumary
2) Key Abilities
2.1) Cat
2.2) Bear
3) Leveling
2.1) Solo questing/grinding
2.2) Instances as tank
2.3) Instances as dps
Feral 102: Bear Tanking
1) Stats
1.1) Defensive/Survival
1.2) Offensive/Threat
1.3) Summary
2) Gear
2.1) Profession Bonus
2.2) Gems
2.3) Enchants
3) Abilities
3.1) Defensive
3.2) Offensive
3.3) Rotation
4) Talents and Glyphs
4.1) Key talents
4.2) Major Glyphs
4.3) Minor Glyphs
4.4) Example Builds
5) Useful advice
5.1) Be prepared (some notes about specific dungeons)
5.2) Rage conservation
5.3) LoS pulling
Appendix: Pre-raid gear list
Feral 103: Kitty DPS
1) Stats
1.1) Offensive stats
1.2) When to gear for ArP
2) Gear
2.1) Profession Bonus
2.2) Gems
2.3) Enchants
3) Abilities
3.1) Abilities
3.2) Rotation
3.3) Aadra's DPS tutorial
4) Talents and Glyphs
4.1) Key talents
4.2) Major Glyphs
4.3) Minor Glyphs
4.4) Example Builds
Post by
LookOut
well, Hashmel already has a pretty damn sweet tanking guide, so I think you can leave that part out. Ofc, it doesn't hurt having another one, in case some *cough* lazy *cough* people want every aspect of PvE feralism in one place.
Your biggest focus should be kitty deeps though, since it's the only spec which doesn't have a 101 thread yet.
Post by
hashmel
Looks like a good format.
I'm personally too lazy to write an entire guide so I stick with my bear in a nutshell post, can be found in my user profile. We do need a more in depth look at the bear than what I copy+paste.
GL with the guide, look forward to it. =)
Post by
Tarkeel
Yeah, going to credit hash for most of the feral post, but it's a bit light in some areas. It's mainly what is good, and not why it is so. Like I said, most of this info is in some stickies somewhere, either here or on EJ, but not all of it is presented in a way that's easy to find.
Would it be best with all 3 parts in one thread, or one thread for each part? I'm a fan of the latter.
Post by
hashmel
Cat and bear definitely deserve individual threads for each and leveling is such a chore in itself it deserves its own thread as well.
I'll continue with my "copy+paste in a nutshell" posts but it's regulars like yourself with the drive to make a whole guide to explain exactly why certain things are as they are and work so well. Laziness will be the death of me but I'll go out with a-
●█████▄▄▄▄▄▄▄▄ <BANG!>
▄▅███████▅▄▃▂
██████████████████►
◥☼▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲⊙▲☼◤
Post by
Tarkeel
First installment is ready for proofreading; I've edited Aadra's DPS guide:
All credits for this go to
Aadramelekh
; Some modifications made by me to move it to a generic perspective which are indicated by italics as well some links.
I believe
many
don't have a real understanding of the 'hardcore' concept. 'Hardcore'
is not
'playing 10 hours per day'. You can be as hardcore as it gets playing one hour per day farming a few random heroics and doing the very best you can do at your gear level, or raiding for 9-10 hours per week but also doing the best you can at your raid / gear level.
Hardcore means performance. It means quality, not quantity. And since you
want
guidance regarding feral DPS, this is what you get, otherwise why did you bother coming here to
find out
? You can simply spam Mangle and Ferocious Bite every 5CPs and you would still do DPS.
If you want to
play your druid as good as possible
then you should be willing to invest some time in understanding the mechanics and practicing (practice makes perfect). Remember this is just a computer game and frankly the way I see it even a monkey could understand and properly use the feral druid DPS mechanics if it took a little time to read some guides and use a few synapses.
What's to be scared about? Open the web page with
the guide
, go to a training dummy and start smacking it. Alt-Tab and start applying the reccomendations in the guid step by step until you get the hang of them. IT IS BLOODY EASY. Trust me on it. The fact that Feral DPS cycle is considered to be the hardest in WoW doesn't necessarily mean it is some rocket science. Remember: even a MONKEY could learn to do it properly.
The essential skills that you need are listed pretty clear on that topic on the second section:
As there is no real rotation, we speak of a "priority list" for cat DPS. Try to follow the following instructions in the given order.
1. Keep up
Savage Roar
2. Keep up
Mangle
3. Keep up
Rake
4. Use
shred
for CP regeneration (remember, that points 2 and 3 are more important)
5. When at 5 CP and
Rip
is not up, use Rip
6. When below
30 Energy
, use
TF
7. Use
Clearcast
Proccs for Shred
8. When at 5 CP and Rip and SR are running with 8 seconds (might be longer, depending on your gear) or longer each, use
FB
9. When Rip and SR will drop at nearly the same time (with less than 3 seconds difference), try to recognize it early. Then use SR with a small amount of CP to desynchronize both timers.
10. Use
Berserk
only at high energy, (but not higher than 85) not directly after TF and as often as possible. If you will get Hysteria or some boss mechanics will enhance your damage, save it for these situations.
This priority list is quite hard to maintain. Cat DPS is one of the most complicated ones in PvE WoW. Try to remember these rules:
1. Remember: Savage Roar buffs everything; Mangle buffs bleeds and shred; Bleeds buff shred. That means, never shred without applying mangle and at least one bleeding.
2. It doesn't matter how many CP you use for SR. Just make sure it never drops!
3. Use Rip and FB only with 5 CP
4. It is very tricky to squeeze in FB's in your rotation. At first you should try to maximize SR, Mangle, Rip and Rake uptime (in this order). When you get more experienced, try to FB more. You need to guess how much time is needed for building up 5 CP's - this depends on your crit chance. Usually, a FB is worth dropping Rip for 4 Ticks approx (8 seconds). Remember that after using Rip, you need energy for building at least one more CP to refresh SR if necessary.
5. FB is most efficient when used at 35 energy. It gets worse when you spend more, thus making it least efficient when using with 65 energy.
6. A 5 CP FB is always more efficient than a shred, even when used at 65 energy.
7. When using the shred glyph: When rake and rip are about to expire and you could shred to extend the rip duration for 2 more seconds at the cost of letting rake drop for 1-2 seconds - do it.
How to learn this:
1) Go to a dummy, apply
Faerie Fire
and start smacking it, just melee swings. Look at your recount and see how DPS evolves.
Reset DPS meter.
2) Start using
Mangle
as well.
Just Mangle.
Spam Mangle.
Look at your DPS once again, notice the differences. Also start paying attention to the target dummy, notice the Mangle timer. Since you are spamming it there is no real challenge, just be aware of it.
Reset DPS meter.
3) Then Start using
Rake
and start tracking Rake timer. It ticks three times (or four if you have 2xT9 bonus). In the meantime keep spamming Mangle. When Rake does its last tick, reapply it. Again notice the timer. Also keep an eye on your Recount DPS meter and notice the differences.
Reset DPS meter.
4) This time you are going to include
Rip
in the rotation. Spam Mangle, use Rake every time it expires. This time keep an eye on your CP (combo point) count on your target. When you reach 5 CPs, use Rip. Now watch the Rip timer add on your target as well. Rip ticks every two seconds. Just like Rake, wait for it to finish before reapplying it. Always make sure to have 5CPs before you use Rip. At this point you have three timers to watch: Mangle, Rake and Rip. Also notice your DPS recount and see the differences.
Reset DPS meter.
5) Now you have to go with one more ability,
shred
. This is in fact the bread and butter of CP generation. Now what I need you to do is this: You will not spam Mangle anymore, you will watch the timer instead and only renew it when it is about to expire (12 seconds without glyph). This time you will use Shred. But remember Shred is buffed by both Mangle and bleed effects (Rake and / or Rip). 30% bonus from Mangle, 20% from having a bleed effect on target (this is a one time buff, does not cumulate for all bleed effects).
Basically you will do like this: Mangle -> Rake -> Shred until you have 5CPs. At 5CPs use Rip. From here on, watch timers. Refresh Mangle as it is about to fall off, refresh Rake and Rip after their last tick and otherwise just use Shred. Watch your DPS meter and notice the increase in DPS. Keep practicing.
This is where you really need distributive attention. Monitor Mangle, Rake, Rip timers, monitor CP count and use Shred instead of Mangle spam.
Reset DPS meter.
6) Now you'll add the big epeen DPS finisher into the fray,
Savage Roar
. This baby buffs ALL your damage by 30% (33% with glyph). Savage Roar's DURATION depends on the number of CPs you use to activate it. This is a big difference from Rip. Rip must ALWAYS be used at 5CPs. Savage Roar can be use even with one CP (for 14 seconds duration). Here's what I need you to do...
Mangle -> Rake -> Savage Roar -> Shred until 5CPs (refresh Rake if it falls off / renew Mangle and you are still under 5CPs) -> Rip@5CPs. From here on a new timer appears. This time it is not a debuff on the target, it is a buff on yourself, Savage Roar. Savage Roar has to be maintained 100% of the time for maximum efficiency. At this point you have Mangle, Rake, Rip, Savage Roar, CP count to watch. Also try to watch your DPS meter as well while doing this.
As you get more comfortable with the cycle, you will usually want to use Savage Roar right after your first Mangle, for an earlier buff to the first Rake.
7) From here on, my boy (or girl), it's ALL PRACTICE. Don't hurry. Don't push it. Just take 10-15 minutes to practice every step of this progression. And you'll have it in your reflexes in no time. It's not hard. Just demands a little distributive attention, that's all :P
Nail this down, and when you feel comfortable you should start worrying about Ferocious Bite, Tiger's Fury (energy replenishment with talent) and Berserk.
8) Starting with the easiest stuff.
Tiger's Fury
will restore 60 energy when properly talented (
King of the Jungle 3/3
). It is usable every 30 seconds. Basically you will want to watch for this and use it every time you have around 30 energy or less. No complicate stuff here, just keep in mind to also watch your Tiger's Fury timer and try using it every half minute. As time passes by and you get more comfortable with the DPS cycle and you gain more real dungeon / raid experience, you'll get the hang of how to use this ability when it is really needed in certain situations (special raid boss mechanics etc). But basically you should use it as often as possible. It's free energy!
9) Moving on to
Berserk
. This talent here reduces the energy cost for all your attacks by 50% for the next 15 seconds when activated (20s with glyph, but this is not an optimal glyph for pussy cat DPS). This baby is pretty powerful. It is a tool that makes pussy cats pretty much able to put equally geared tanks to shame in terms of threat generation. But threat is not our interest here :P It is usable every three minutes. The main idea is the same as with Tiger's Fury. You want to use this as often as possible. Usually the best way to use Berserk is when you have Mangle / Rip / Savage Roar rolling strong, almost a full energy bar and you want to dish out some massive DPS.
If you have an idea of how long the fight lasts, you can plan when to use this: In a 5 minute fight, will have time to use it twice if used within the first 1,5 min or so
.
Unless the raid boss has some specific mechanics that require DPS bursts on demand, you should use this as soon as you start the fight. Your goal during Berserk is to spam Shred and Ferocious Bite(s), so the first Berserk usage should happen like this:
Fight starts.
Faerie Fire -> Mangle -> Savage Roar -> Rake -> Shred -> Tiger's Fury ->
and from here on you go on with normal DPS cycle - apply a 5CP Rip, renew Mangle, Savage Roar and Rake when needed, spam Shred for CPs. When you'll get to the last 5 seconds of Berserk you'll usually have piled up 5 CPs. Using a Ferocious Bite and then getting in one or two more Shreds before the end (while Shred costs only 21 energy) is ideal.
If the boss fight is well under way and Berserk is available again, you want to have a full fledged Savage Roar and Rip rolling. Preferably have at least 20 seconds to Savage Roar left, a fresh Rip and Mangle started and a full energy bar. Under these conditions it is pretty much possible (with a little crit / OOC luck) to spam Shred and get two Ferocious Bites and also finish Berserk with 3-5 CPs accumulated. You'll get the hang of it over time.
10) Last thing...
Ferocious Bite
. This finisher is tricky. Used properly (you do need quite a high gear level to be able to do this however) it yields a nice DPS increase. Used wrong it will DECREASE your DPS. Strange but true. The reason is that it also uses CPs. The DPS guide quoted from
Murna
on elitistjerks explains the difficulty about this finisher pretty clear. This takes time and experience along with high gear level.
---
Last word...
After practicing all those steps above you should be able to basically fulfill all those criterias on the DPS priority list quoted above. The more you practice the more skill you'll gain in handling clearcasting procs, weaving Ferocious Bites in your cycle with minimal Savage Roar / Rip downtime and paying attention to all your timers in order to learn to anticipate critical moments when timers will end almost simultaneously and how to handle 'fast restarting' in case you screw up something. Not to mention also being able to pay attention to the environment - watching out for hazards such as falling debris, void / fire zones, adds, special boss attacks, raid warnings and so on and so forth. It seems a lot to process but as I said, practice makes perfect. This is why spending a lot of time mastering the optimal DPS cycle on the training dummy is crucial to your development as a respectable pussy cat. You have to reach the point where you can almost 'feel' your damage flow, anticipate timers and weave your abilities on the fly. This will give you more room to learn and adapt to different boss encounters and their specific movement / damage control mechanics.
This wall of text may be scary. But all that I've written here is piece of cake with a little focus and a little rapid decision making sense. There will be mistakes. There will be pain. But the reward will be so much more gratifying. Especially when you reach the level where you can keep your attention split between so many variables but also stay fully focused at the same time and still destroy most (if not all) of your DPS competition. That big fu**ing grin that will grow on your face when everyone in your raid group cries 'nerf feral QQ' and you know you are the best of the best. THAT is worth all this hard work, all this pain, all the sweat, blood and tears needed to master...
Pussy Cat DPS
/roar
Post by
Tarkeel
2.1) Profession Bonus
This is limited to raid bonuses at lvl 80; several professions give BoP items that are useful while lvling or fresh at 80, but that is outside the scope of this comparison.
Alchemy
Primary bonus is
Mixology
, increasing the effect of all flasks and elixirs
that you can make
, and doubles the duration.
Flask of Endless Rage
gets a
82 AP
increase.
When not using raid flasks, you can use
Flask of the North
for
40 Strength
.
Blacksmithing
Primary bonus is extra socket on
Bracer
and
Gloves
, which when combined with epic gems will give you
40 AGI or ArP
(or similar itemization value in any other stat you would want).
Enchanting
Primary bonus is
ring enchant
for 40 AP; two rings give
80 AP
Engineering
Primary bonus is split on several enchants:
Glove enchant
(does not stack) giving
340 haste for 12 sec, 60 sec CD
(Does not trigger GCD)
Boots enchant
that trades 12 hit for 12 crit, and run speed.
Cloak enchant
that gives
+1 AGI
and parachute
Frag belt
Secondaty bonus is fun, and teleport.
Herbalism
Primary bonus is
Lifebloom
,
3,6K hot (3 min CD)
Inscription
Primary bonus is
shoulder enchant
,
80 AP
better then alternatives.
Secondary bonus is that you don't have to get
Sons of Hodir
rep (only applies if this is your first and only lvl 80)
Jewelcrafting
Primary bonus is 3 improved gems of your stat-choice.
3x14=34
AGI
or
ArP
.
Leatherworking
Primary bonus is
bracer enchant
that is
80 AP
better then alternatives.
Secondary bonus is cheaper
leg enchants
Mining
Primary bonus is
60 STA
Skinning
Primary bonus is
40 crit
Tailoring
Primary bonus is
cloak enchant
that procs 400 AP for 15 sec, with roughly 25% uptime making it 100 AP, or
approx 80 AP
better then alternatives.
Post by
464040
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Tarkeel
1) Stats
Leather gear will usually follow the same convention for stats:
Agility and Stamina for white-stats, Attack Power and 2 of the following as green-stats: Critical Strike, Haste, Armor Penetration, Hit, Expertise.
1.1) Offensive stats
Agility
83.5 AGI = 1% Crit
Strength/AttackPower (AP)
Attack power increases the damage you do; 14 AP = 1 DPS. Before talents, 1 STR = 2 AP for druids.
Talented and buffed, 1 STR = 2 AP *
1.02
*
1.06
*
1.10
= 2.37864 AP (2.1624 unbuffed)
Because druids don't use weapons to attack with in forms, all weapon DPS above 54.8 is converted into Feral Attack Power (FAP).
Predatory Strikes
increases all attack power (FAP, normal attack power and direct
+AP enchants
). This makes AP more valueable then STR on weapons, but STR more valueable then AP everywhere else. (This is normally a moot point, as AGI is better then STR whenever you are not crit-capped).
Raw attack power should never be gemmed for by any druid, you will get a better return by gemming for base stats. Strength is also not worth gemming or enchanting for by a bear.
Critical Strike Rating
Crit will make more of your attacks be critical strikes. Normally, only direct-damage attacks can be crits, but Rip can crit from talents, and
Rake
can crit from gear.
For normal melee attacks, crit will cap out at 73% effective crit This is because bosses have a 24% for white attacks to be glancing-attacks, which cannot be pushed off the attack table, and bosses have a 3% innate crit-reduction. If you are not hit and expertise-capped, the crit-cap will go down with the % of your attacks that can miss or be dodged. Note that this cap applies to crit from all sources, including raid buffs. Yellow (special) can not be glancing, so crit rating over the cap will affect these. Crit-rating will lose severe value though.
Haste
Haste increases your base-attack speed, and will increase white melee damage and
Omen of Clarity
procs. Note, this is increase in attack speed, not a decrease in swing-timer, 100% haste will result in 50% swing timer.
32.79 Haste Rating = 1% increased attack speed.
There are no caps on haste for kittens, but it is also the least valuable DPS stat.
Armor Penetration (ArP)
Hit
Kitties are single wielder, so the hit cap for white (normal melee) and yellow (specials) melee attacks are the same.
32.79 hit rating = 1 % chance to hit with melee. Thus, you need 178(heroic)/263(raid) hit rating for all melee attacks to hit.
Heroics bosses have a 6% miss on melee and spells.
Raid bosses have a 8% miss on melee and 17% on spells.
Unlike most other DPSers, hit-cap is not prioritized above other stats for a cat. The reason is that kitties are based on energy, and
get energy back
when finishing moves fail to land. Being hit-capped will make your rotation more smooth however, so it is advised to keep it at a level you are comfortable with.
Expertise
Expertise will decrease the chance for your attacks to be dodged or parried.
Change to be dodged (in %): 5 + (def skill - wpn skill) * 0.1
If your weapon skill is maxed, this becomes: 5 + (mob lvl - player lvl) * 0.5
Heroic bosses are lvl 82, so they have a 6% chance to dodge.
Raid bosses are lvl 83, so they have a 6.5% chance to dodge.
3.79 Expertise Rating = 1 Expertise = 0.25% reduction in dodge and parry. Thus, in order to not be dodged by heroic bosses, you need 24 expertise, or 14 with
Primal Precision
. For raids, you need 26 total expertise to avoid dodges.
Bosses can not parry from the rear, and since kitties should always do it from behind, you won't need more then 26 expertise.
1.2) Caps
Hit: 263 (raid) / 178 (heroic)
Expertise: 26 (raid) / 24 (heroic)
Crit: 73% effective crit (when hit/expertise capped)
ArP: 1400 is hard cap, soft cap depending on trinket used.
1.3) When to gear for ArP
Post by
Tarkeel
This last part needs some more formatting done, but will go over and do that later on.
I need some help writing the Ar Pen section; especiall part 1.3: When to gem for ArP, any takers?
ALso need to write AGI part.
Post by
hashmel
Change to be dodged (in %): 5 + (def skill - wpn skill) * 0.1
If your weapon skill is maxed, this becomes: 5 + (mob lvl - player lvl) * 0.5
Heroic bosses are lvl 82, so they have a 6% chance to dodge.
Raid bosses are lvl 83, so they have a 6.5% chance to dodge.
Cat and Bear claws are innately at their maximum potential skill per level so the first two lines can be simplified to something more along the lines of-
"Targets of equal level have a base 5% chance to dodge, gaining or losing 0.5% chance to dodge for every level above or below your own."
3
2
.79 Expertise Rating = 1 Expertise = 0.25% reduction in dodge and parry. Thus, in order to not be dodged by heroic bosses, you need 24 expertise, or 14 with Primal Precision. For raids, you need 26 total expertise to avoid dodges. was missing a 2 is all.
I'm not entirely familiar with feral dps but I believe if you're capable of reaching more than ~1150 ArP from changing agility to arp you should start to see an improvement (given favorable RNG) though it will have a negative effect on your crit rating making combo point generation less fluid which could result in something falling off resulting in a net loss of dps. There're just too many factors in the agil vs arp topic such as rng luck, set bonuses, and just how much agility you'd need to sacrifice for ArP to name a few.
Afraid that's all I can say in this regard and a more informed individual may be able to provide their input.
Post by
AldaranStormrage
3
2
.79 Expertise Rating = 1 Expertise = 0.25% reduction in dodge and parry. Thus, in order to not be dodged by heroic bosses, you need 24 expertise, or 14 with Primal Precision. For raids, you need 26 total expertise to avoid dodges. was missing a 2 is all.
I'm not entirely familiar with feral dps but I believe if you're capable of reaching more than ~1150 ArP from changing agility to arp you should start to see an improvement (given favorable RNG) though it will have a negative effect on your crit rating making combo point generation less fluid which could result in something falling off resulting in a net loss of dps. There're just too many factors in the agil vs arp topic such as rng luck, set bonuses, and just how much agility you'd need to sacrifice for ArP to name a few.
Afraid that's all I can say in this regard and a more informed individual may be able to provide their input.
That expertise conversion is misleading. From wowwiki
For each 8.1974973675 expertise rating you equip, you gain 1 expertise at level 80
Link
The number you linked is the number you require to negate 1% of dodge which is 4 expertise.
As for ArPen: Afaik, you need to ensure that you have a minimum of 50% + a proc trinket if you are going to gem for ArPen. I don't have the math for that on-hand and wowwiki is out of date there.
Post by
hashmel
Good eye, I've got the conversions in my user profile and it still got by me.
8.1975 Expertise Rating = 1 Expertise Skill = 0.25% Dodge/Parry Reduction
or
32.79 Expertise Rating = 4 Expertise Skill = 1% Dodge/Parry Reduction
Post by
Tarkeel
After a complete burnout and break, I'm sort of back. Will be posting up a leveling guide sometime over the weekend; I see there is a updated cat guide finally, but will still post my bear and cat guides eventually.
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