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Shaman righteousness.
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Post by
Rankkor
something has come to my mind.
from a gameplay point of view, when a mage shoots a frostbolt, is the same action than a shaman shooting a lighting bolt, just press the key and the spell will shoot.
but on lore, they are completely diferent.
on lore, a mage must recite the spell, conjurating that wich he/she wishes to summon and presto, spell casted.
shamans on lore however do not "cast" spells, they "call" them.
when a shaman is facing a foe, he or she issues a "call" to a specifc element, and if this element deems the shaman worthy, and his or her actions worthy, they answer the shaman's request.
they don't own their power, rather take it borrowed, and the elements ofter refuse some of these calls, when the reason of the calling isn't worthy or honorable.
an example of this is what happened on Draenor, when the orcs atacked and killed the draenei this action ofended the elements, and they refused to aid the shamans anymore, so, whenever they issued a call, no anser was given.
now that orcs have regained their honor, and cut themselves off their demonic corruption, the elements once again listen to the shaman's call, and answer them or not depending on the situation.
if this is the case, then how can many shamans use their powers for dishonorable actions, or evil intentions? there are many shamanistic mobs in the game who uses the elements for terrible deeds.
if the elements refused to aid the orcs when they misbehaved, why do the elements aid so many bad guys who miss use them so much?.
a few examples are: broken daenei, and Lost Ones who use many skills related to shamanism, Wolvar shamans in dragonblight.
or the grimtotem tribe of the tauren.
heck I've even seen some twilight hammer cult members who have access to shamanism
even reghar earthfury when he called the frost to hit the amnesiac human (wich happened to be varian)
these and so many others are shamans who have used their powers for bad deeds, so I can't stop wonderign why do the elements aid them?
(and no, the reason is not the same as the holy light wihc aids the scarlet crusade, since the blood-elves proved that the light is still magic wich can be bended over to their will, but the elements are sentient living beings who are even more primordial than the light)
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Adamsm
broken daenei, and Lost Ones who use many skills related to shamanismThat's the major thing though, the Spirits themselves are far above us, for all we know, what the Broken and the Lost one's are doing are part of the grand balance...... Of course, who are we to try to understand the Spirits anyways, they are above us like we are above insects after all heh.
Post by
taurenmoo812
It is something to wonder about and I have thought about this myself on my shaman enough times.
As you say, a shaman asks for a favour to the elements to lend them there power, and only deeming him honorable or spirital enough will it answer. If this entails coming into combat with a a foe like a member of the alliance who is attacking his peopleland or people, then the elements would see this an an honorable reason to answer.. but if the shaman was to use his powers to, say, kill an helpless farmer in elywnn forest, why would the elements answer such a thing?
Obviously in a game mechanic it will always conflict with the lore (the very same reason undead priests are able to use holy magics), but in a lore term.. well, as you see with the example of Reghar Earthfury, his reasons weren't exactly honorable, until he freed Varian and his friends from there capture.. maybe the elements saw this was going to happen.. but who knows.
In terms of other npcs, thinking of the twilight hammer for example, who consist of a lot of shamans, these twilight hammer members ask the favour of the elemental lords themselves and phrase there names, so the elemental lords would give these shamans access to such powers, similar but different to the noble shamans we get to play.
Post by
Rankkor
They are not shamans: in case the caster isn't called "shaman" or "geomancer" there are also some "shaman" spells that can also be considered Arcane magic. As an example there were rogue Archmages who could use Chain Lightning in Warcraft 3. But that would be arcane lightning such as the one seen when arcanists use Arcane Power in game
this is a valid point, some of the lost ones and broken that use common shaman spells are called geomancers.
but on lore I've seen a few shamans who use their powers for wrong actions, if drek'tar said that the elements often refuse their aid I wonder how these evil shamans manage to stay in power, since the orcs weren't able to do so in draenor.
bakc there they were cut off completely to the point of not being able to even more a rock.
When you bend the nature to your will. Like the taunka
O_O taunka can do that? dear jebus, I gotta revise my lore and quests about them. as far as I know bending the elements to your will is imposible (or posible only to make small stuff like breaking stones, or calling sparks of fire, but say if I had training as a shaman and wanted to ask the spirit of the earth to create a massive earthquake to tear asunder a town, they would refuse such aid, for it's unworty and dishonorable)
Post by
Rankkor
whoa taurenmoo :D U amaze me, that was one gooood explanation.
Post by
Arkham
-They are not shamans: in case the caster isn't called "shaman" or "geomancer" there are also some "shaman" spells that can also be considered Arcane magic. As an example there were rogue Archmages who could use Chain Lightning in Warcraft 3. But that would be arcane lightning such as the one seen when arcanists use Arcane Power in game. And as a parallel example the Rain of Fire spell was once a Mage spell (warcraft 1).Very true. Consider also that mages' primary attack in Warcraft 2 was actually a bolt of lightning. So there almost certainly is a kind of "arcane" lightning that can be cast, that is probably different from the type of lightning that shamans or other "nature-casters" call on.
Post by
Skreeran
No, the Taunka do in fact bend the Elements to their will. They go find elementals, kick their asses, and force them to work for them. That's Taunka shaman for ye.
And as for the shaman doing dishonorable things, I always felt the elements react to the shaman. If the shaman is angry, the elements feel the anger; if the shaman is calm, the elements are calm. It's possible that their definitions of good and evil bend as well with the user's.
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Rankkor
Lightning is so cool
QFT
Post by
Orranis
It would be cool if they changed animations to suit the divine vs. arcane magic this. Like for a shaman, lightning bolt is casted by putting your hands to the sky, then when cast time is up, a bolt of lightning strikes you and you redirect it forward at your foe.
Post by
Rankkor
It would be cool if they changed animations to suit the divine vs. arcane magic this. Like for a shaman, lightning bolt is casted by putting your hands to the sky, then when cast time is up, a bolt of lightning strikes you and you redirect it forward at your foe.
while I like this idea (being a shaman myself) it would be time-consuming, and other players being jealous as they are would demand diferent casting animations for their classes too.
just look at the colosal amount of nerdrage over the fact that paladins got a new exclusive mount in 3.2 and the other clases did not. (not that I care, I got the mechano-hog xD)
whenever blizz adds something that's exclusive to one side, and unavaliable to others plp cry.
shamans were horde-exclusive and paladins ally-exclusive and plp cried.
horde paladins had seal of blood and ally paladins seal of vengance, and plp cried.
priests used to have a race-exclusive spell earned via quests, and plp cried.
=/ it comes with the game sadly.
(and for the record we do have one spell in wich a lightning hits us, and then is redirected to the enemy, is the 51 talent point Thunderstorm)
Post by
taurenmoo812
You can't help but wonder somethings if Blizzard are purposfully ignoring shamans nowadays, that its easier to make it all about paladins and mages and warriors. One might hope shamans will play a more important role in cataclysm with the elemental lords at least.
Post by
Adamsm
Suppose to be Thrall and Malfurion against Ragnaros at Hyjal, don't get more epic then that heh.
Post by
Rankkor
Me, I'm hoping the earthen ring will make it's oficial debut as a proper faction (complete with headquarters and all) in cataclysm.
is about darn time shamans get the atention they deserve.
as far as lore goes, few classes have gotten more attention than warlocks, paladins , death knights, and mages, (and posibly druids)
but on the side of rogues, shamans, and even hunters, is like they don't exist anymore exept for players
Post by
229054
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
104395
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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