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Elemental shamans (we rock, but why can't we compete?)
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Post by
2bwow
Okay, may original main was a Human Mage back during patch 1.1 (vanilla). When TBC (Patch 2.0) came out, I rerolled to a Tauren
Elemental Shaman
, and it has been my main ever since.
Now I know that shamans are considered a hybrid class and I was okay with that during TBC. I didn't mind not topping the charts. Then in WotLK, Blizz made Elemental Shamans into pure awesomeness! However, we still weren't chart toppers. I think the only time I ever topped the chart was in a Naxx run with a bunch of people's alts (I was doing about 4.8k dps, this was slightly after Blizz released Ulduar). Other than that, I've always been like 10 or more dps slots from the top. I couldn't really compete then, I don't feel I can compete now.
I haven't started raiding at 85 yet (I don't typically have time for raids) I run 5 man Heroics. But it is the same thing. I struggle to compete with other dps, even when I way out gear them. I've been playing a Shaman for so long. I know this class inside and out. So I can't imagine what I'm doing wrong. I don't even feel underpowered. I just feel that every other classes are better than Shamans.
Here's an example from my last Heroic (SFK). We had a Warrior Tank, Frost DK, Assassination Rogue, Me (Elemental Shaman), and a Holy Priest. Here's the DPS results of the Last Boss: (BL was used about 15 seconds into fight)
1. Frost DK: 24.8k dps
2. Ele. Shaman:19.0k dps (Me)
3. Assassin Rogue: 18k dps
4 Prot Warrior: 11k dps
The DK only slightly out geared me by a couple of 359 epics including weapons, not sure which ones. But here's the kicker. The rogue was horribly undergeared. 3/4 lvl 346 items, 1/4 333 items, zero epics, zero enchants, zero gems. HOW THE HELL DID HE PULL 18K DPS! (sorry caps...). The DK beat me (not unusual, DK's almost always beat me) by almost 6k dps, and the rogue barely lost to me in crappy gear.
This is actually quite normal for me. I can only compete with dps that is significantly undergeared compared to me. The only thing I can guess is that a lot of boss fight in 5 mans require the dps to move around a bit, and any kind of movement totally screws my dps ( I just bought the new lightning bolt glyph that allows casting while moving, but I haven't got to try it out yet). However, on that example fight, I didn't have to move at all...
Well, sorry for the long rant. I'm just wondering if other people are experience similar things in 5 mans on their elemental shamans?
Post by
120504
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
greywolfsage
I've heard of low gear rogues being able to do that. And with the patch they boosted rogues quite a bit, to put them back up high with the dps-pures.
Also, the green quality gems aren't helping, but not hurting you that bad either.
could use a belt buckle and a reforge of your Band of Secret Names.
Also, get soemthing thats not Core of Ripeness. You're only making use of half a trinket.
Post by
2bwow
As an aside, using
Flamebloom Gloves
instead of a 346 mail glove is a loss of 182 intellect because you're forfeiting your armor specialization.
Yeah, I was planning on using that only until I buy the JP one, I knew it was hurting me because of the specialization, but I hadn't done the math to see if it was actually that bad. 182 Intellect is a pretty significant number, I'll have to check my bags and see if I have some mail gloves sitting around.
I completely understand how procs can make a big difference in short fights. My Fire Mage can go from 10k to 20k, depending on the number of procs he gets. It is very frustrating when the procs just don't happen.
I've heard of low gear rogues being able to do that. And with the patch they boosted rogues quite a bit, to put them back up high with the dps-pures.
Yeah, I guess rogues got a buff or two... I wasn't expecting a rogue in blues, no gems or enchants to be able to compete with my awesomeness!
Post by
Haxzor
You can cast Lightning Bolts whilst running. Be happy with that
Post by
greywolfsage
The specializations at endgame are around 200 of the stat.
You have 4-5k on avg, so 5%...
A good item's worth of a stat.
Post by
HolyBrew
i was doing 6 to 9k dps in wrath....on my orc shaman, now in cata i rerolled tauren, yes kinda stupid but hey, and im still 80 about to turn 81, and i am doing 12k dps on boss fights in heroics. I generally top dmg in bgs all the time, and usually never go below 3rd on dmg when im not 1st, not bragging, just showing and stating that ele shamans still pump out a good amount of dmg....
Post by
321678
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
HolyBrew
im assuming at 85 it really does just get that sucky for shamans then?
Post by
120504
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
HolyBrew
too bad for no twinking anymore....well good twinking like in the old days....otherwise id keep this guy at 80...lol
Post by
faia
depends heavy on the group, but yes the dk do hit like a truck due to rime buff to 1hx2 (as you said weapons and not weapon)
rogue I assume this rogue normaly do around 14-15k with random gorup 15% buff but with
-horn of winter (1k dps rough)
-ice talon 10%
-crit from you (envenom spell and poison are spells more combo points)
-4 % more phys damage
-blood lust
-vendeta
most of his damage come out of instant poison , that get proced up the rate with envenom buff
so its easy as he got carried with buffs
I do around 20k with no buff from other but fast as I get buffs from other classes I can do up to 28k
you....you just buffed yourself and no caster buffs then the rogues master poison debuff.
rogue buff was not really that much to notice to diffrent then around 5% more damage yay.
also the time to kill him is less then 1 min so its fairly bad to compare as the rogue could also keep up overkill most of the fight
Post by
864443
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Onijitsu
I'd suggest you attempt to check your Ele Sham with other Ele Shams who are succeeding at pulling higher DPS. Perhaps consider using the Reforgenator addon or running your toon through AskMrRobot.com. (This is not an advertisement, as I have zero affiliation, and it is a resource to help players succeed) It can become expensive to re-do your gear when you obtain a new piece? And, from what I hear, Mr. Robot doesn't get everything perfectly right for everyone -- I take all advice with a grain of salt, and often add my own seasoning in the mix -- but it does produce significantly positive results for most. I squoze another 5k DPS out of my Enhance Shammy, regemming, re-enchanting, and reforging to get the right stat-mix for my gear. For one thing, I ended up ignoring most of the socket bonuses in favor of gems which would emphasize my primary stat (Agil) for massively higher output.
And yes, it's absolutely disgusting what some Rogues and DKs can do in crappy green gear. But hey, I can't hate them for that. I've honestly tried to play a rogue and DK, and I didn't find either really as interesting as my Shammy, Paladin or other toons.
Yesterday, my Paladin got repeat-pwned by an Ele Sham in a rated BG, and I decided I may have to give Elemental another look. It used to bore me too. But the changes wrought in the past while (since I last tried it, during WotLK, and then went Enhance) are awfully interesting.
Post by
Gnub
I think it's worth to consider that this original post was from before our Shamanism hotfix, which made a very big difference in our output.
Now - we can certainly compete.
Post by
863831
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
2bwow
Wow, I'm surprised that this thing is still alive! I've been away from my shaman (playing my arcane mage) for awhile.
Several of you have made very good comments. I completely agree that heroics aren't the place to gauge one's dps. I just never have time to raid, so I don't get to see how well I would compete in a raid environment. Sounds like 4.3 (with introduction of the LFR tool) might help change that, and allow me to actually experience raid level content, even if it's a lot easier than the current raids.
As for gear optimization, I have found AskMrRobot.com to be an excellent source for recommendations on gear, enchants, reforging. I don't follow it completely, as I like to heal sometimes using some of the same gear. I had to find a happy middle point when enchanting and reforging.
I've recently started playing my elemental shaman again, and have definitely noticed the shamanism buff, which is very nice. I'm now averaging between 16k - 17k dps without bloodlust on most boss fights in heroics and ZA/ZG. Which seems to be pretty good, unless I'm running with an arcane mage, they are way too OP in heroics. My Arcane Mage pulls 20-30k in heroics depending on encounter. But my Shaman is way more fun to play than my Mage.
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