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10.2.7
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4.2 so far
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Post by
Kangi
I hear this a lot, and what bothers me is that it sounds a bit 'rude'. Because there are a lot of players who don't play spriest and do like the affDrain spec. So I would say it is definitely not 'fine'.
Well, my reasons for not liking it can be chalked up to my dislike of change. =p
I do hope that they keep the drain spec at least somewhat viable, but just not optimal compared to Shadow Bolt. That's just the way that I, being a grumpy "traditional"-type Warlock, feel that it should be.
Post by
DraconisAerius
As far as I can see, they are doing serious damage to the viability of afflic in pvp, just because they decided they don't like warlocks using Drain Life in pve.... It's kind of childish really.
Post by
tugipus
As far as I can see, they are doing serious damage to the viability of afflic in pvp, just because they decided they don't like warlocks using Drain Life in pve.... It's kind of childish really.
Drain life is right now one of the main reasons affliction is somewhat viable in PvP outside a strict support role in fine tuned team play.
"Childish" isnt the right word for that as my two years old son certainly isnt that dumb ;)
Post by
asakawa
I can't help but feel that all this talk of "childishness" is a little naive itself. The stream most often flows in the other direction and gameplay that people are enjoying in PvE is altered because it doesn't fit PvP.
This time it seems that a change being made to fix a PvE problem might have an effect on PvP but I promise from years of experiencing this stuff that whatever version of this change eventually goes live (remember that it is still in testing and we may not be seeing the whole picture right now) Blizz are keenly aware of what they're doing and the ways in which it affects the rest of the game.
Post by
tugipus
Blizz are keenly aware of what they're doing and the ways in which it affects the rest of the game.
I wish i could share that kind of optimism. Most recent examples when PvE changes did negatively affect PvP and they never even mentioned that they are aware of the problem:
Fel hunter devour nerfed: corresponding glyph that was only used in PvP not updated
Pet stops attack with cc: no regard to PvP problems it causes
Another thing: If you buff something because you think its too weak and then decouple it from gear scaling so it turns basically into a nerf in the not too distant future it does not show a great deal of foresight or makes people think you are aware of what you are doing.
Post by
LookOut
Maybe that's why I'm not hitting the high marks in 3v3, because I don't use drain life all that much. I usually just dot people up and fear the third to either prevent healing or prevent dps nuking down our healer.
That said, I once went fullout on a warrior with full dots, drain life and my rogue buddy and he almost died :p But by then CC hit DR on the healer, so yeah.
Post by
AWildmann
Well, those are very sad news for me. I always wanted to use drain life to deal damage in old times, and I was really happy that I could do so in Cataclysm, but seems like they didn't even wanted it. Its really too bad, I loved it.
By the way, maybe at higher gear levels, the mastery that we'll get might buff DL damage so it might be viable again?
I know it aways very little, and gearing towards mastery isn't viable, but maybe from all we can gather without reforging, it might just be enough to at least reach the SB spamming dps levels.
Post by
asakawa
If 25% stays to live and if it's a full coefficient change then this could not be made up by any realistic amount of Mastery.
In Patchwek sims showing absolutely perfect use of all spells and abilities DL only just comes out ahead of SB in terms of damage done by the filler. Things like Shadow Bite and Nightfall procs make DL Sim higher and they aren't enough to keep DL viable as a mechanic if the damage isn't there.
Post by
238331
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
Well as someone with both feet firmly in one side of the PvP/E divide I do very much agree with you. However I can understand why Blizzard have always been reticent to make the changes necessary to make this happen.
It means every tooltip needs to be twice as long and every player needs to learn the spells twice, on top of all the other learning they are required to do when first entering PvP.
Personally I don't think the problems entailed are entirely insurmountable but that's likely from an experienced perspective and Blizzard are always far more mindful of new players who are entering such a mature game.
Post by
AWildmann
Well, they made those kind of changes for abilities like Colossus Smash, I would call it unfair if not everyone had the chance to see something like this.
I don't think they should do this for EVERY thing right now, but slowly adding those changes to most abilities, it would be very beneficial to the game balance to do so. Is this spell too strong on pvp? Nerf its pvp counterpart and there's no changes on the Pve one.
edit: more stuff
Post by
238331
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
But I think Blizz likely consider the CC differences to be a thoroughly annoying and inelegant solution to a problem too great not to solve and, while there are still abilities like Colossus Smash, they've been continuing to try and remove abilities that behave differently rather than make more (Curse/Bane of Doom).
As I say, I do agree (from the other side of the fence) but Blizzard have their reason, even if it's not one we really agree with, and we all get burnt by it occasionally. Once 4.2 gets released the dust will settle and then we'll see how things look. Don't be too surprised if it's not quite the game-changer you expect it to be right now.
Post by
238331
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
I main spec Demo and I've got to say, don't believe the Sims when it comes to Demo. SimCraft
still
doesn't default to Felhunter which on its own brings it up to Destro's level. I find it to do every bit as well as either other spec in raids and is more flexible than either providing burst on demand, AoE (both burst and reasonable sustained) and can even adapt well to 5mans.
Post by
238331
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
really?
Solo on a boss dummy, unbuffed and with neither flasks nor food, I get 18k+ in 359 gear. A recent Nefarian kill resulted in 20024dps (19216(e)DPS) with all the twists and turns that fight contains.
I don't say this to brag, my gear is certainly nothing special and my performance, while something I take pride in, is also not much past ordinary. I simply mean to
demo
nstrate (^_^) that if you're seeing a vast shortfall when playing Demo then there's likely some small detail that you're missing that will be easily solved if we can put a finger on it.
To The Maw perhaps for more discussion on it?
Post by
AWildmann
I usually also test on dummies for a few minutes to see how much dps I can sustain, with affliction its usually 14k dps. With demo its 12k, but I do know for the fights I had, that I always managed to get about 17-18k on most raids I've been to.
Since affliction is gonna suck back to sb spam, I'd rather play as demo, which I also have a lot of fun playing with. I just haven't learned the destruction rotation, too many dots to keep up and I barely get any nuke off. And somehow I still manage to do 15k unbuffed at dummies =/ I really hate how things work.
Post by
606231
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
238331
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
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