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Heirlooms in battleground
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Post by
atomicwolf22
You can easily be on the same playing field as a person with heirlooms even without any, if you take some time to farm some items with a higher level you can beat anyone, assuming your skills allow it. If youre still getting killed by people with heirlooms youre simply not as good as them then.
Very True.
I'm tried on the QQ heirlooms are unfair. If you think there an unfair advatage the stay you self out of BG's were not forcing you to play them.
OP should like someone I would camp just to make them rage quit the BG.
And its not like Heirlooms are free you have to put time into farming them. Or cough up the gold to buy them. There are three advatages to heirlooms. First they scale with level. (But some cap at 80). Second you don't have to repair them. Third they give a bonus to incoming Exp.
With all the toons that I have leveled over the past few monthes in the under 60 levels its not like were there to school you all day. You can almost level once every Bg or come very close to it.
I did one bg in the 10-14 range with a Horde Twink Driud. He was in full Heirloom Gear. Using one of the twinks and had the Battlemaster trinket also. The Driud at level 10 had 1400 health.
I say if you want to QQ about Heirloom gear then go turn your Exp off and go so how badly you get schooled by twinks.
Post by
MrSCH
The Driud at level 10 had 1400 health.
You just made a post about how people shouldn't QQ about heirlooms and then give us this example. An average level 10 will have around 400 HP without them, and you claim that it's not that bad? Hmmm.
Post by
atomicwolf22
The Driud at level 10 had 1400 health.
You just made a post about how people shouldn't QQ about heirlooms and then give us this example. An average level 10 will have around 400 HP without them, and you claim that it's not that bad? Hmmm.
That was a Leather Toon. With 1400 health. I have seen some Plate Toons with more then that.
But my point still stands if you can't deal with other toons and there gear then stay away from pvp. Its not for you.
I bet that any of us can roll a low level alt. (That knows there Class)using no heirlooms and can faceroll people with heirlooms. Anyone that knows how to play will have to issues.
This topic is nothing but QQ nerf this. IF you don't want to be burned then stay away from the Fire.
Post by
Amry
The power of heirlooms are overrated; at lower levels, class imbalance plays a much larger role. And of course, at higher levels, whatever heirlooms you have would be eclipsed by the any halfway decent gear you can get from dungeon or even world drops.
Now, assume that the paragraph above is wrong, that heirlooms are overpowered. Then in a random battleground, we can further assume that the probability of a character shows up with an heirloom to be
P
. However, since
P
would be equal regardless of faction, it is just as likely for people from OP's side to show up with the said heirlooms.
In other words, unless heirlooms of one faction is better than the other's, chances of random people in a random battleground wearing a heirloom is the same regardless of whether you are in Horde or Alliance; therefore, there is no imbalance.
Post by
Sweetscot
Meh...if people think this is bad lets turn back on the ability to use any enchant that will apply to gear >:)
Also...if you farm the blues you can get at whatever lvl you want to pvp in and enchant it as well as it can be enchanted (clue: you can put better chants on non-heirloom gear beyond lv 19 bracket) you'll be on par or better than any full heirloom toon you meet.
Also...WTH is he talking about heirlooms proccing?
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Has anyone who is saying that heirlooms are not overpowered in the lower brackets even leveled a non-heirloom character lately?
I was leveling a druid healer (and I have an 85 resto druid, so I know the class) last month, and any dps in heirloom gear could easily do 4x-5x more dps than I could heal. Health pool is by far the least OP thing about heirlooms.
Now, I've always been a fan of twinking. I like the fact that if you put work into your toon, you can do well in the brackets. However with heirlooms, the only work that the person needs to do is have an 85 on that realm. And I, the guy rolling a new toon on the server who is perfectly willing to put the working into real twinking, can't because regular twinking is broken.
Post by
Sweetscot
Actually I have several toons on new servers that don't have BoAs...going in a bg on them with normal greens/blues from leveling is a darn sight better now with BoAs than going in against peeps with leg kits and lv60 chants was. I don't find it to be a problem myself.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Actually I have several toons on new servers that don't have BoAs...going in a bg on them with normal greens/blues from leveling is a darn sight better now with BoAs than going in against peeps with leg kits and lv60 chants was. I don't find it to be a problem myself.
Except you could work towards those things
. That's what twinking was all about. You farmed for the best gear, you mined/herbed/fished your ass off to save up for enchants, and you tied it all off by practicing every day till you were the best at it. You can't work towards heirlooms unless you level that toon up to 85, in which case you've defeated the whole point.
Post by
120504
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Squishalot
Having an 85 on the server (or an 80, even) isn't just enough to get your heirlooms. 2000+ JPs for Shoulders / Chest is still a reasonable grind. Plus 2000+ for each of your Balanced Heartseekers (thinking Rogue / Hunter). Another 2700+ for each of your trinkets. 3500 for your ranged.
All in all, to be fully decked out in grindable heirlooms (as opposed to guild reward ones), you need over 17000 JPs, only achievable by grinding out dungeons at the expense of your progression gear.
Compare that to 'regular' twinking - you can get items of equivalent power to heirlooms from dungeon drops. Plan ahead and you'll always have your gear. No matter what you do, whether you twink old-school or twink with heirlooms, you're still going to be grinding.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Compare that to 'regular' twinking - you can get items of equivalent power to heirlooms from dungeon drops. Plan ahead and you'll always have your gear. No matter what you do, whether you twink old-school or twink with heirlooms, you're still going to be grinding.
I had
every
wotlk heirloom in the game well before the expansion ended and my progression didn't suffer a single bit. But that's completely beside the point.
You
have
to have an 85 to get heirlooms. You didn't have to have a capped toon on that server or any server to old school twink...in fact the majority of the people in my twink guild didn't have 80s.
Post by
Squishalot
I had every wotlk heirloom in the game well before the expansion ended
You have to have an
85
to get heirlooms
That's quite the contradiction, you know. You can start getting heirlooms at 78 in theory, if you capped your XP (once you plough through the Argent Tournament quests, you'll probably level up from the Crusader grind). Same applies for WG weekly quests.
Anyway, my point is that an old school twink is still equally competitive in BGs as the heirloom twinks are. The only difference in the grind is that you only need to grind once for each character with heirlooms, but that grind itself is significantly longer.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
That's quite the contradiction, you know. You can start getting heirlooms at 78 in theory, if you capped your XP (once you plough through the Argent Tournament quests, you'll probably level up from the Crusader grind). Same applies for WG weekly quests.
Actually no, that's not a contradiction. In one I was talking about wotlk, and the other I was talking about cata.
Now granted, it's true that you can cap at 80 and farm there, but that's an extremely slow way to do it and ultimately irrelevant to what I said.
Anyway, my point is that an old school twink is still equally competitive in BGs as the heirloom twinks are. The only difference in the grind is that you only need to grind once for each character with heirlooms, but that grind itself is significantly longer.
No the difference is that you're permanently twinked at all levels, defeating the whole point of taking capped twinks out of the regular bg rotation.
Post by
Interest
Has anyone who is saying that heirlooms are not overpowered in the lower brackets even leveled a non-heirloom character lately?
I was leveling a druid healer (and I have an 85 resto druid, so I know the class) last month, and any dps in heirloom gear could easily do 4x-5x more dps than I could heal. Health pool is by far the least OP thing about heirlooms.
Now, I've always been a fan of twinking. I like the fact that if you put work into your toon, you can do well in the brackets. However with heirlooms, the only work that the person needs to do is have an 85 on that realm. And I, the guy rolling a new toon on the server who is perfectly willing to put the working into real twinking, can't because regular twinking is broken.
This. I've been messing around on other realms.
It stings. I'm quite capable of killing them, but usually I get steamrolled a larger percentage of the time.
In fact, screw it. I agree with most of this post.
You have to have an 85 to get heirlooms
Actually, HSR, you can get heirlooms as low as level 10. (honor heirlooms) and 70 (JP heirlooms). Guild heirlooms can be gotten with the appropriate rep amount (though for practical purposes, to get beyond neutral with your guild you need to be 80 to 85). I can confirm this because my friend, who has no character above level 70, purchased an heirloom through honor.
Post by
563815
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Squishalot
No the difference is that you're permanently twinked at all levels, defeating the whole point of taking capped twinks out of the regular bg rotation.
The only difference in the grind is that
you only need to grind once
for each character with heirlooms
Isn't that basically what I said?
I agree that capped twinks should be in the regular rotation. I wasn't a fan of excluding them, to be honest. This doesn't mean that 'regular' twinking is broken, it just means that it's not practical now that BG exp has been introduced.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
No the difference is that you're permanently twinked at all levels, defeating the whole point of taking capped twinks out of the regular bg rotation.
The only difference in the grind is that
you only need to grind once
for each character with heirlooms
Isn't that basically what I said?
I agree that capped twinks should be in the regular rotation. I wasn't a fan of excluding them, to be honest. This doesn't mean that 'regular' twinking is broken, it just means that it's not practical now that BG exp has been introduced.
You only needed to grind once before, so no, that's nothing like what I'm saying.
Now you
can't
twink the regular way (at least for any reasonable amount of time). Period. They broke twinking because they saw twinking as bad. Now they introduce heirlooms which go around the whole issue of having to stop at a certain level for your twinked set of gear to last for a decent amount of time by giving you permanent twinking gear. But
only
to a specific group of players.
So, they broke regular twinking which was possible for anyone, and brought back a bastardized twinking that is not possible for everyone.
And how is not practically working anymore not under the category of broken?
If a hammer stops being able to hammer nails properly, it's a broken hammer.
Post by
Sweetscot
Last I checked leveling to 80/5 is available to everyone, heros are available to everyone, heirlooms ARE available to everyone.
Post by
Hyperspacerebel
Last I checked leveling to 80/5 is available to everyone, heros are available to everyone, heirlooms ARE available to everyone.
It's only availible to same-realm
alts
.
Thus at least 1 character on every account will suffer in bgs while low level, barring account transfer.
In my case, where I was on 6-7 realms over my WoW life, that's 6-7 toons at the minumum.
Post by
Sweetscot
AHHH double post monster KILLL IT!
/whacks double post monster
Also, since when are a persons alt not that person?
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