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I need to be hit/exp capped or I cant tank?
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Post by
300134
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Post by
354743
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Post by
Doring
Ummm, not that many hits will one shot you if your healer is doing the job. If missing a DS and shield is what kills you, then your group and tactics need much more help than your hit rating and expertise. That being said, the increased strength, stamina and DPS are nice and I would not turn it down though it is not the best tanking weapon in the world. I would of course re-balance my reforging based on it.
It's a fricking Heroic, come on, it's an upgrade you could use, and a big one, need on it and go on from there. Honestly, unless people do some dumb stuff and/or ask, I don't offer any advice anymore in LFD randoms. It isn't worth the heartburn and people don't want to hear it anyway.
Post by
MegaVolt
You were 100% correct and the tank (and the group) were idiots.
DK tanks want mastery above all other secondary stats and hit/exp are pretty much useless for mitigation. They are good threat stats but threat is usually not an issue anyway.
You had every right to roll on the sword.
That being said the tank also had every right to roll on it. While the mastery from his 333 sword is nice the 346 one has higher stamina and he can still reforge out of the hit/exp. It was an upgrade for him. It obviously was a way bigger upgrade for you and a nice tank might have passed on it for that reason but he could still use it so rolling on it was fine (for both of you).
For a lenghy and pretty frustrating argument about hit/exp as DK tank just look at this one:
http://www.wowhead.com/forums&topic=184176
Post by
138583
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Post by
110480
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Post by
dervasavred
Calling someone a troll who has a different estimate as u is so american fat kid mentality...
What? Are we doing carpentry or accounting on the forums now?
I believe you meant to say "opinion" instead of "estimate."
Post by
138583
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Post by
bkevol
They were upgrades for both of you. I wouldnt have said anything about it, rolling on a 2H sword/mace/axe/polarm against a DK tank is the same as rolling against another 2H dps.
just read the DK tanking guide on this forum. it says hit isnt very important. but a tank should get to the expertise soft cap atleast
Post by
354743
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Post by
MegaVolt
Case in point: You take 2 big hits from a boss, you wait a few seconds for runes to come off cooldown, but miss the death strike. The 5 second grace period for the large heals and large shield from that high damage you just took takes away about a 20k heal and also an extra 20k shield. That's 40k worth of mitigation you just lost from one missed DS.
How about this:
You just got your runes off cooldown so you use your DS but you miss. Now you happen to be hit for an extremely high damage spike and your next shield from the high damage is 40k. If you had not missed that DS you wouldn't have any runes left, but luckily thanks to the miss you now do. That missed DS just brought you 40k worth of mitigation.
It works both ways. That's why it's pretty silly to expect exp/hit to have any significant benefit for your DS. I'm not saying it's completely useless (being able to control the timing might really be handy occasionally, especially when soloing content or when handling predictable damage) but avoidance obviously is just so much better.
Post by
354743
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Post by
Orranis
Case in point: You take 2 big hits from a boss, you wait a few seconds for runes to come off cooldown, but miss the death strike. The 5 second grace period for the large heals and large shield from that high damage you just took takes away about a 20k heal and also an extra 20k shield. That's 40k worth of mitigation you just lost from one missed DS.
How about this:
You just got your runes off cooldown so you use your DS but you miss. Now you happen to be hit for an extremely high damage spike and your next shield from the high damage is 40k. If you had not missed that DS you wouldn't have any runes left, but luckily thanks to the miss you now do. That missed DS just brought you 40k worth of mitigation.
It works both ways. That's why it's pretty silly to expect exp/hit to have any significant benefit for your DS. I'm not saying it's completely useless (being able to control the timing might really be handy occasionally, especially when soloing content or when handling predictable damage) but avoidance obviously is just so much better.
Lol my point isn't nearly that abstract. I'm talking about actually TRYING to time your DS correctly, not just spamming it willy-nilly and then getting lucky with your blood shield by happening upon a random miss. If you're not coming off a damage spike, you should not be using Death Strike. Let's not get too far into fiction with this...
That depends on the damage strike. If it's the case that the damage spikes will be physical, and it's not predictable, spamming it willy-nilly will probably be your best option to maximize your blood shield before it goes off. Even if theoretically you will get a bigger blood-shield by timing it correctly, while it will reduce the amount of damage taken overall it will still not be preferred because it puts your raid at risk, and as important as healer mana is, tank's surviving is more important.
If it's magic damage, then more then likely you should be AMSing through it or you're doing it wrong, in which case it will give you no to a very tiny increase, and if it occurs more then once every 45s, it's probably not a big enough spike to be effective, and if it's used more then once every 45 seconds and isn't avoidable AND is a big hit AND you can't sacrifice another cooldown, (i.e. getting Hydrolanced directly after Ignacius does his fire-shield thing because your OT was avoiding Glaciate and couldn't interrupt and you can't afford to waste another cooldown for whatever reason), THEN maybe it would be a 1-2% damage reduction over the fight to be able to avoid it well.
Post by
MegaVolt
Lol my point isn't nearly that abstract. I'm talking about actually TRYING to time your DS correctly
But when trying to time it correctly you have a giant window of 5 seconds after the damage spike to get that DS in. That's plenty of time to miss and cast it again. It's not like one miss automatically means you can't time the DS anymore. You'd have to miss 3 or 4 times in a row for you DS to be out of the 5 second window. That's extremely unlikely and not really worth worrying about.
Oh and what Orranis said ;)
Post by
354743
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