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Weapon speed questions
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Post by
belechannas
I am a relatively new player, but I have played all the classes a bit (4 Level 70's, 3 Level 60's, 3 Level 30's).
I am wondering when, if ever, a fast melee weapon is preferable to a slow one.
What I think I understand:
1) Enhancement shamans, DKs and Paladins always(?) want slow weapons. The higher rate of procs from certain passives with a fast weapon. The only advantage of a faster weapon would be to increase the rate of procs tied to auto-attacks.
2) Warriors have more of a trade-off, since auto-attacks generate rage, and rage is good.
2a) Slower weapons will do more damage per skill
2b) Faster weapons will generate more rage from auto-attacks, allowing more skills to be used
2c) Tanks likely generate more rage from getting hit than DPSers, hence they have less need for faster auto-attacks.
2d) My impression is that relatively little threat comes from auto-attacks, hence tanking warriors also want slow weapons for the higher damage per skill.
3) Unclear how weapon speed affects Feral Druids. I would think cats, at least, fall into category #1 (slow is always better) and bears, being tanks, are subject to 2c and 2d.
4) Unclear what considerations apply to Rogues. Some of their talents/abilities require fast weapons (daggers), but otherwise I would think they too would prefer slow weapons (have only played Rogue to 30).
Thanks for any enlightenment/corrections.
Post by
120504
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
Warrior rage generation is normalized, so using different weapon speeds of the same weapon type won't increase or decrease rage generation.
Post by
DiGiCat
I am wondering when, if ever, a fast melee weapon is preferable to a slow one.
Soccergenius put it best for combat and assassination rogues...
Rogues generally want a slow/fast combination. A fast offhand stacks deadly poison quickly (and other good stuff depending on spec) while a slow main hand maximizes instant attack dmg (affects instant poison application rate?). Assassination uses daggers in both hands, combat should only use a dagger in the offhand. Subtly is a bit more flexible depending on play style, you'd have to hit the rogue forums for info.
Only thing is with assassination, I remember you want the slowest daggers to get the best damage per energy, and for sub rogues now with ambush not needing daggers, I assume it's the same slow/fast combo as combat.
Note: I am still leveling my rogue since my druid is my current main, and haven't raided with my rogue since BC, so my thoughts on the play style may be off.
Best to check the rogue forums to reassure yourself if you are deciding to roll rogue
Post by
blademeld
Backstab needs daggers and Ambush does extra damage with daggers.
Post by
DiGiCat
Backstab needs daggers and Ambush does extra damage with daggers.
The real question is if a 1.8 or 1.9 speed dagger would really benefit from the extra damage compared to the 2.6 and 2.7 speed one handers. Like I said, I haven't researched since I don't play my rogue often, but I am sure either the rogue forums here on wowhead, the official rogue forums or elitist jerks already did the math for you. Just search and go there instead of asking here :D
Post by
239153
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
No, because instant attacks are normalized.
The base damage will be greater with slow weapons, which is what increases the damage, not the speed itself.
For the AP --> Damage in instant strikes,
Daggers are calculated at 1.7 speed, regardless of the actual speed
All other one handed weapons are calculated at 2.4 speed
Two handed weapons are calculated at 3.5 speed.
Post by
120504
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
My mistake on the two handed weapon speed, however, that article is outdated.
The only attacks on the list of non-normalised damaged that are actually correct are Stormstrike and Rend (and Scatter Shot).
Heroic Strike now does damage based on AP instead of weapon damage.
Ghost Strike and others don't exist anymore.
Wing Clip does no damage.
They're missing Hammer of the Righteous, which is a tank ability and relatively irrelevant to the discussion.
Post by
Loetek
1) Enhancement shamans, DKs and
Paladins always(?) want slow weapons
. The higher rate of procs from certain passives with a fast weapon. The only advantage of a faster weapon would be to increase the rate of procs tied to auto-attacks.
Negative. Unfortuanately its all Ret paladins have at the moments. We want the fastest 2hander possible since Art of War is one of our biggest damage dealers.
Post by
770678
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
No, weapon speed in calculations for instant attacks are always based on base weapon speed.
Regarding the retribution and faster weapons...
There's only about 0.15 weapon speed difference (after haste effects) for auto-attacks. It takes 24 white attacks to get an additional swing for the AoW proc, or about one attack every minute+, at 20% proc chance, I'd say you get about 1 additional AoW over 20 minutes, or 4-5 boss attempts.
I would think the loss of damage from instant attacks would be greater.
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