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Why so much hate towards the Dark Lady?
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Post by
611800
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Post by
306612
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Post by
Rockbrow
Personally I think it's because her loyalties are only to herself and she's basically making the horde look like fools as she attempts world domination.
Post by
Patty
I see the point you're trying to make, but really, the part I quoted is
not
like the Middle East at all.
No? All of those nations, with the exception of Jordan I think, don't recognize Israel as a state, and this is one of the major problems with achieving any sort of peaceful, diplomatic solution. It isn't respect for Israel's right to be there so much as the fact that Israel has some powerful friends and will quickly and freely use its substantive military power to defend itself that keeps them at bay. But aside from that, I think most of the official "Death to the Zionists" and fatwas are pretty analogous.
Around 7 states in the Arab league recognise Israel's right to exist, if I recall correctly.
Plus, my quoting was ambiguous, I meant to say that it's a stretch to say that
all
the nations in the Middle East do not recognise Israel, or its right to have the land that it controls. The latter is particularly fair, with the aggressive policy of settlements (Israel's own form of ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians, albeit through far less murderous means) treading on land that
is
legally Palestine's.
But, anywho, that's enough derailing for now I think. ;)
Post by
299264
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Post by
611800
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Post by
atkrei
What I think is happening is that since the living/alliance treat them badly, they start to learn to hate them. They find that unfair, and then the forsaken start to discriminate against the humans, and the alliance, because of how they treat them. When the greymane wall broke, the first thing they probably thought were:'' oh look humans in lordareon! KILL THEM!''
If they were treated maybe just a little nicer, they wouldnt be acting so badly. I think alot of alliance fail to see dat they have free will, and they think for thereselves, and not always under someone else like sylvanas.
Post by
Skreeran
What I think is happening is that since the living/alliance treat them badly, they start to learn to hate them. They find that unfair, and then the forsaken start to discriminate against the humans, and the alliance, because of how they treat them. When the greymane wall broke, the first thing they probably thought were:'' oh look humans in lordareon! KILL THEM!''
If they were treated maybe just a little nicer, they wouldnt be acting so badly. I think alot of alliance fail to see dat they have free will, and they think for thereselves, and not always under someone else like sylvanas.While that's certainly a factor, there also seems to be an inherent darkness in some Forsaken. There have been a few that turned bad within minutes of their resurrection.
Post by
229054
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Post by
299264
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Post by
229054
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Post by
atkrei
Well, to be sure, it wasn't the happy healing power of the Holy Light that's responsible for their unlife, but a strain of demonic Burning Legion magic. That might just have an effect.
That said, I'll have whatever the dark rangers are having!
valkyr dont have demon magic, and neither do deathknights, but they still can raise dead.
Post by
Skreeran
So it may be that simply being risen is capable of causing a change of character - as is shown by some Raise thems as Forsaken quests in Andorhal and Silverpine - but I am not sure that its enough to make you snap into most profound madness. Far too many Forsaken have abandoned the cause of their brethren once they found a refuge with the Argent.Right. I'm not saying that 100% of the time, resurrection makes them 100% evil.
Otherwise I wouldn't roleplay one, after all... :P
My point is that many Forsaken are more (or less, depending on how you see it) than just dead humans who've been brought back to life. Their personality seems to shift slightly towards the cynical, nihilistic end of the spectrum.
Post by
611800
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Post by
Braevia
Personally I think it's because her loyalties are only to herself and she's basically making the horde look like fools as she attempts world domination.
Hmm, I don't think she's quite that power-hungry. Now, she goes and knocks Bolvar off the throne and claims the title of Lich-Queen, then I'll start to agree with you. :)
Perhaps we could consider the Forsaken's venture toward Gilneas as a settlement-like expansion, or maybe it's more of a Manifest Destiny thing.
Manifest Destiny sounds closer, considering the Forsaken's goal is to either 1)Kill, 2)Drive off or 3)Assimilate all of Gilneas under their rule and remake it in their image. It's also driven by a desire for resources(albeit at Garrosh's insistence moreso than Sylvanas', I'd venture). They want the port and they want the raw materials the land possesses.
Meantime the native humans end up trapped between two sides. The emerging Worgen population and the invading Undead. Many of them get forced into choosing what must seem like a lesser evil. That sounds a little closer to what people of the Middle East have had to endure. Side with this foreign invader or side with that foreign invader. And choose quick, there, Habeeb. Our trigger fingers are itchy...
I still haven't seen anything to suggest that Sylvanas had designs on Gilneas prior to Garrosh telling her to get cracking. Garrosh wants a port in the Eastern Kingdoms, not Sylvanas. The blame for Gilneas' problems lies with Garrosh, who had a good idea of what he was letting loose on the Worgen from the start. The only thing he didn't plan on, and that we can definitely fault Sylvanas for, is the use of the Val'Kyr to "turn" humans.
Post by
611800
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Post by
taurenmoo812
Funny really, seeing this is yet another example of Garrosh's war and how he wants to wash off any blame for anything the rest of the horde do. His want for taking stonetalon mountains lead to the land being ravaged, and his want for taking Gilneas lead to the forsaken raising the dead and using blight. His want for dominating has him not even bothering to check on just what the horde forces are doing until its to late.
And people !@#$%ed about Thrall and the wrath gate, lol, its a joke..
Post by
Monday
/sigh
Post by
taurenmoo812
Fine then I'll stick to subject. Sylvanas is a crazy &*!@# and now more so then ever, but I wouldn't expect anything less from her, so in regards I simply consider her doing what she always does, and much like the forsaken do too.
Sylvanas and her forsaken however arn't behaving much different to there usual manner, its just there attention is drawn elsewhere now on the alliance in lordearon.
Unlike her or the forsaken, I expected better from, say, the orcs in stonetalon, and we see there the worst example of betrayal of honor the orcs had to there own and allies.
So overall, I've got no problems with what Syl's doing, since its what one expects of her and her kind.
Post by
306612
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