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Live
PTR
10.2.7
PTR
10.2.6
Beta
[Guide] Cata DK changes (Updated 10/12/10)
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Post by
110480
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
woohaa
In the level 85 heroics you can barely absorb one attack so don't worry about it much. Avoidance is what makes it take forever to stack up. Not the blood shield.
Also, 2 new changes.
Unholy
Unholy Presence now reduces the GCD on your abilities by 0.5 sec.
Frost
Improved Icy Talons now increases the melee and ranged attack speed of all party and raid members within 100 yards by 10%. (Down from 20%)
The Frost change is universal amongst all classes that provide the buff so don't feel like we're the only ones that got nerfed. The unholy presence change is a rather nice one, even though it's what we had before. It makes Unholy presence actually worth using because of the GCD cap. This will free up some GCDs.
Post by
Rankkor
sitll any word on how the vengeance buff lasts?
as soon as you get hit 5% of the damage gets turned into AP; but how long does that lasts? because if it's too short, it will reset each pull, if it's long I can chain it between pulls to afford higher burst threat.
Post by
495174
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
DraconisAerius
Have we seen yet what the set bonuses for t11 are? Or what they look like? I know that both of those things have been released for warlocks.
Edit: Also could anyone whos playing a tank in beta maybe list what their stats are looking like at 85 in greens? I'm curious about a few things.
Post by
495174
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
woohaa
this is taken from a post on
pwnwear
.
Level 84 (in Blood Presence):
Strength: 2274
Agility: 122
Stamina: 4168
Hit: 231 (+2.53% hit, 5.47% miss against a boss)
Crit: 4.22%
Expertise: 12 (Dodge reduced by 3% - boss has 3.5% dodge against me, 11% parry against me)
Mastery: 14.01. (87% of the amount healed becomes an absorption shield)
Armor: 28684
Dodge: 6.12%
Parry: 10.58%
If you didn't read the post...keep in mind this guy has a shadowmourne so it'll give you an idea of what type of gear he was wearing prior to replacing it with greens and blues. I believe his HP is around 100k buffed. also take a look at how low the avoidance is compared to Live. Keep in mind he's lvl 84 and his avoidance/hit/exp/mast will drop when he levels if he doesn't get any upgrades. This is just an example of ONE person so this isn't necessarily how your stats will look but it is an example.
Post by
495174
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
woohaa
o.O nice, Although blood is gonna feel RP starved if they ever fix RS >_>
Post by
495174
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
woohaa
Vampiric Blood no longer costs a Blood rune.
Path of Frost no longer generates runic power.
Blood Boil no longer generates runic power unless it hits a mob.
Death Coiling your pet no longer refunds runic power with the minor glyph if all of the heal is overhealing.
Single rune abilities now generate 10 runic, down from 15 last beta build and unchanged from live.
Double rune abilities now generate 20 runic, down from 25 last beta build and up from 15 on live.
Triple rune abilities now generate 30 runic, up from 25 last beta build and up from 20 on live.
Justice and Valor point vendors are now accessible.
These are the changes from consider's page. Not sure where triple rune abilities fit in since we don't have one anymore o.O
Post by
woohaa
oh also, MMO-champion just released the new lvl 85 epics that will be available and the PvP gear.
Post by
495174
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
woohaa
ah yeah doh >_> man i'm like off lately.
I'd actually like to see RS go off GCD, but at the same time i'd rather they just take out the avoidance portion. I think currently Heroic strike is hitting harder then it's supposed to. From what i read Heroic Strike is supposed to be their weakest attack since it's more of an ability you use to control how much rage you have instead of just using it constantly. I'd hate to think they put it off the GCD, keep the avoidance part and we just macroed it again and forget about it. We'd have alot of empty GCDs in blood x.x
Post by
495174
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
woohaa
It is kind of weird that the other 2 trees have so much more flavor then blood.
Unholy
Shadow Infusion
Dark Transformation
Sudden Doom
Runic Corruption
Frost
Rime
Killing Machine
ToT and MotFW - for diversity
Runic Empowerment
Blood
Rune Strike procs
Runic Empowerment
I'd like to see atleast 1 Threat proc for blood. RS shouldn't even be a proc it should be a GCD filler. I think something like. you have a 20% when you take damage to proc a free DS. i think that would be awesome. Cause atm the amount of times you can use DS is pretty limited so you'd get survivability and threat all in one proc.
Post by
495174
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Eremitt
STICKY THIS!
Post by
woohaa
Threat / Threat Decay
We actually never implemented threat decay. We're not sure we'll need it.
The bottom line is that being a good tank is a mark of pride for tanks. It's not fun to do a job well that any guy off the street could do with no practice or experience. Getting better at your job is a major motivator for players to play.
Threat is part of that. Back in the day, you got excited when you had a tank who knew how to generate threat. It was a source of bragging rights for the tank.
So just autoattacking, or just Thunder Clapping, shouldn't be enough for you to never worry about threat. You should have to pay as much attention to your rotations as an Affliction lock or Frost DK needs to do in order to be competitive on meters.
We don't want to go too far though. While it's not asking much for a mage to wait a few seconds before unloading with everything they have, it's also not fun if you feel that tank threat is constantly throttling you. In particular, we're trying to clamp down on the situation where say at minute six or seven despite everything the tank can do, the dps start to creep up on you. Vengeance was implemented almost entirely for this reason -- it helps keep tanks scaling their threat as dps classes gear up.
Finally, we don't want the tank to be solely at the mercy of others to generate threat. We don't want abilities like Tricks of the Trade or Misdirection or dps classes using their threat drop abilities on cooldown to solve the whole problem for the tank. All of those abilities still exist, but they won't turn a bad tank into a good one and they won't make a great tank feel 100% at the mercy of others.
Tank Balance
As far as tank balance goes, in beta we found that DKs and Feral druids were taking less damage than paladins and warriors. This is partially because of the Sanctuary bug (where it just wasn't working). Beyond that, the avoidance of the former were just a lot higher. Druids get dodge and DKs get parry just from wearing Agi and Str respectively. Block tanks used to get a little mitigation from Strength, but it was never much, and that won't really work any longer with the new model. Solutions include letting Str affect parry (for everyone in the same way Agi provides dodge) or giving all plate users some kind of Forceful Deflection passive or talent.
Basically, we think that avoidance below 20% or so doesn't feel very good because you don't see it, and avoidance above around 70% or so breaks encounters and forces us to add "radiance" debuffs to raids.
So no threat decay...woohoo. However, i have a problem with the vengeance portion of his statement. For fights where your trading threat back and forth or other such fights where only 1 thing needs tanking but you still need both tanks. Vengeance won't really stack well on the offtank EXCEPT for warriors. They get this
skill
. If your the offtank and your not getting any vengeance, your also not getting any RS procs. Which IMO is gonna be a big problem if you need to grab agro temporarily and your taunts miss. You'll be so far behind in threat there's not much chance of surpassing the MT without vengeance or RS to boost your threat. So hopefully this get's addressed for all tanks and not just wars....
Also, i've heard the tank balance statement is true. We supposedly take less damage then the other tanks in beta. minus druids. It'd be nice if they just left it since we haven't been the tank that takes less damage in a long time, but oh well...
Post by
110480
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