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Official Warlock Cataclysm Thread
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Post by
darkdog
and even improved soulfire oughtn't be overlooked until we get chance to theorycraft it out properly. since all specs will have access to an instant SF by buring a shard it may become the accepted way that warlocks start all boss fights
I sincerely hope, that Blizzard will nail that to a point where this won't be happening. It's more than wierd that a Shadow DoT spec would open combat with the most powerful yet nearly untalented fire nuke.
Be interesting to see what happens with that. Imagine destro warlock in pvp chaos bolt/conflag/instant soul fire ( Boom headshot?)
Post by
asakawa
and even improved soulfire oughtn't be overlooked until we get chance to theorycraft it out properly. since all specs will have access to an instant SF by buring a shard it may become the accepted way that warlocks start all boss fights
I sincerely hope, that Blizzard will nail that to a point where this won't be happening. It's more than wierd that a Shadow DoT spec would open combat with the most powerful yet nearly untalented fire nuke.
Actually after what they achieved in Wrath - Affli being Shadow and Destro being Fire spec, with Demo combining those two schools, it would be like a slap to their own face.
personally i don't think affliction having access to instant SFs is a particularly bad thing in itself.
while it may be good DPET compared to an SB it's a very long cooldown and aff will likely have better uses for the shards.
the problem comes in if aff has access to the 15% haste buff at the start of the fight. it
may
not be that great since for aff to take 2 points in it they will definitely be giving up some other DPS increasing talents and burning the shard on an SF also has an opportunity cost. however, it could be a seriously major buff and totally worth it and if that's the case then i think, as you say, it feels weird for affliction.
i too like the placement of:
shadow | demons + both | fire
for the warlocks trees and dilluting that would be a shame.
Post by
152018
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
hehe, it might be drawing things out a little too far to put the trees in boxes like that. as pilda said blizzard really found a clear definition for the warlock trees in wrath and they are simply shadow (dot emphasis), demon and fire (nuke emphasis).
currently seed is the strongest nuke AoE warlocks have so affliction does well in AoE fights because it has talents to boost it. we will likely see destro moving over to RoF and hopefully blizz can balance it a little finer to reduce the disparity.
Post by
DraconisAerius
as pilda said blizzard really found a clear definition for the warlock trees in wrath and they are simply shadow (dot emphasis), demon and fire (nuke emphasis).
Agreed.
I think that as the cata trees are now is blizz trying to balance them all a bit more and really it's fuzzing the lines/distinctions between the trees. Destro is getting another dot and procs that it has to keep and eye on, for example empowered imp no longer is any spell, only soul fire. Demo is getting another colldown to balance and another shadow dot and another fire dd/dot. Again solidfying that it is a mix of afflic and destro with demon buffs thrown in. And afflic is getting more aoe capabilities, expanding on its fairly limited options (really it could only either single target or SoC) and an extra dot to play with.
So imo while all three trees have their positives and negitives in wotlk it seems to me that in cata they want to make them more similar rather than giving each a defining role.
Post by
asakawa
i had a friend mess with BoD in beta and we found the following:
BoD has a 1 minute cooldown.
this is not effected by impending doom (talent)
it ticks every 30 seconds
WITH impending doom it ticks every 15 seconds.
now, these tests we done with a premade warlock character that had 15% haste from gear. while 15% isn't much i had expected that after a minute the final tick of doom would occur noticeably sooner than the cooldown expired. it didn't appear to, the cooldown was up at the same time as the last tick happened.
this needs far more testing than me talking to a guildy over vent while he presses buttons and watches the combat log but IF that is correct (it is entirely possible that it is erroneous) then doom doesn't benefit from haste.
it's also worth mentioning that the test dummies are a little different on beta realms and after many doom ticks no guardian minion was summoned.
Post by
LookOut
it's also worth mentioning that the test dummies are a little different on beta realms and after many doom ticks no guardian minion was summoned.
Well, you can't level up your weapon skill on dummies either. I reckon it's pretty much the same thing that prevents the guardian minion from spawning ...
Post by
DraconisAerius
it's also worth mentioning that the test dummies are a little different on beta realms and after many doom ticks no guardian minion was summoned.
Is BoD the same as CoD in that it only spawns on the targets death or does it have a chance to proc from each tick?
now, these tests we done with a premade warlock character that had 15% haste from gear. while 15% isn't much i had expected that after a minute the final tick of doom would occur noticeably sooner than the cooldown expired. it didn't appear to, the cooldown was up at the same time as the last tick happened.
I gather from this that with the talent it ticks 4 times for each cd. Does it do the same ammount of damage per tick with the talent as it does without the talent? And is it plausable that Banes won't be affected by haste but curses will?
this needs far more testing than me talking to a guildy over vent while he presses buttons and watches the combat log but IF that is correct (it is entirely possible that it is erroneous) then doom doesn't benefit from haste.
I was listening to Bind on Equip podcast today (the current one) and they have started a contest where two winners will get a beta key each. Maybe you should enter then you have a chance to maybe test stuff yourself. Be better for everyone imo if someone good at theorycrafting could do some testing.
Post by
asakawa
@lookout yeah, i wasn't at all surprised that it didn't spawn a demon i just thought it was worth mentioning that i didn't have any info on that aspect of BoD.
@mastor
lookout linked this for you earlier:
Bane
vs
Curse
.
i didn't get my friend to test this specifically but i think it's pretty safe to assume a tick with impending doom is the same damage as a tick without it.
also, curses are debuffs, banes do damage. there is no need for curses to benefit from haste.
i didn't sign up for the beta and i really don't want to see it early. i like being in beta tests for games i'm not sure if i'll buy or not but since i will certainly be playing cataclysm i really don't want to see any content before it goes live. i like seeing the talents and spell changes as they move closer to release and theorycrafting all that stuff but if i was in beta i'd have to go flying around stormwind (etc.) which is something i really want to save for live.
Post by
TheVorago
Cata's gonna be awesome. But to be honest I don't really care what happens to the middle and right talents trees. In my opinion, affliction has always been the sole tree that breathes warlock at its core. I do raid as destro, but that's just because I'm lazy and because destro has proven much more applicable and handy on average (again in my opinion). Otherwise the only thing destro's good for is looking cool in arena vids ^_^ And Demo is just meh.
Post by
asakawa
And Demo is just meh.
oh no you didn't!
maybe it's because of demo's sad history but i've adored demo in this expansion.
in vanilla there was basically one tree worth playing (aff, SM/ruin!), in tBC we started as affliction and graduated into destro until everyone was 0/21/40 by the end
*
(adding insult to injury by actually killing our own pets!)
wrath's version of demo is, to my mind, quintessentially warlockian!
centred around pets and using DoTs to enhance nukes. it's got it all.
the most important thing, though, is that we have a choice of all three trees which is unprecedented and even unique among the pure DPS classes.
*
some locks played demo at T5 because the T5 set bonus gave them what became fel synergy allowing their pets not to die within seconds in the pre-
avoidance
game. the living pet helped but demo still sucked ^_^
Post by
TheVorago
And Demo is just meh.
oh no you didn't!
maybe it's because of demo's sad history but i've adored demo in this expansion.
Lol. Sorry Asakawa, wasn't my intention to offend a spec so dear to your heart. Since my wow-ing started with wrath, I lack the TBC nostalgia (wish I didn't though) and while I leveled to a great part specced demo it just never felt fascinating to me. Much like a measly BM hunter. I mean, according to blizz we're supposed to treat our pets as slaves (not even getting to name those expendable creatures) and the idea of being less self-sufficient for depending on a strong pet doesn't appeal to my individualism I guess =)
Post by
LookOut
And Demo is just meh.
oh no you didn't!
maybe it's because of demo's sad history but i've adored demo in this expansion.
/agree! But then again, I started out as demo, and loved it from the first moment. Got a little slow between lvl 40-50 (still using voidy back then, got kind of slow and boring), but once the felguard gets in it improves a lot. When he's fully powered up, it becomes even better :)
Didn't really spend much time at max lvl in BC, but I remember shadowbolt spam :p In WotLK I was demo all the way (even when not optimum spec) just because of demo pact (and because I cba to change ^_^).
It's all personal opinion. As asakawa, I still commend Blizz on the fine job they did with balancing the 3 lock specs.
Post by
TheVorago
It's all personal opinion. As asakawa, I still commend Blizz on the fine job they did with balancing the 3 lock specs.
Absolutely. They have done a very good job balancing, which is pretty amazing concerning the sheer number of variables there must be in the mechanics. Perhaps not as good in pvp though, where I do believe demo IS meh. But expecting such balance in pvp would be obscenely demanding and probably impossible. The choice, like you say, is personal.
Post by
Fingulfin
And Demo is just meh.
oh no you didn't!
maybe it's because of demo's sad history but i've adored demo in this expansion.
QFT. On this (my third) warlock, I have actually been demo from level 1. From leveling as SiLi/FG, to raiding Naxx/Ulduar as FG/Emberstorm... Into being the Demonic Pact biotch in ToC, to pulling mad DPS AND providing a kickass buff in ICC, demo has really been fun this expo.
Post by
DraconisAerius
Just re-reading the Bane of Doom tool tip... I wonder if i has the possibility to spawn either one of the two guardian pets? The wording has me wondering...
Post by
asakawa
mastor, please read the discussion you're trying to take part in!
earlier in this thread we had:
A) Are the "guardian demons" summoned by Bane of Doom still doom guards?
to which you directly replied:
I would presume that Bane of Doom does summon a Doomguard since both have Doom in the name.
why is it that so many of the points you're raising in this thread can be answered within the thread itself and often by looking at people's replies that were directed at you? in this case the answer can be found in something you've said yourself!
i'm thoroughly enjoying discussing the various questions that are being raised by news from the beta but it's frustrating to have a participant who seems unwilling to keep up.
as for the question, i've yet to see confirmation so the educated guess would be that it will summon a doomguard (the single target pet) however it is entirely possible that it is random.
Post by
USMCDiablo
Or it could be another proc...
Post by
DraconisAerius
mastor, please read the discussion you're trying to take part in!
I'm going to assume you are talking about the bickering you lot were doing about specs. I personally didn't wish to take part in that (I get enough of it in the dk forum), however I did want to pose a question about cataclysm, which is what this thread is about (hence the name).
Also to the best of my knowledge the question I posed had not been discussed. Yes we disscussed that it might be a whole new demon guardian, or that it might be the Doomguard, but it had not been suggested that it could be randomly picking between our 2 guradian demons.
So please, get down from you high horse and try to comprehend what others are trying to say rather than assuming things.
Post by
asakawa
So please, get down from you high horse and try to comprehend what others are trying to say rather than assuming things.
I'm going to assume you are talking about the bickering you lot were doing about specs.
quoted for irony.
no i wasn't talking about the specs discussion and i don't remember that being a discussion to which the term "bickering" would be appropriate. i'm simply suggesting that at times your replies suggest that you haven't read the thread you're taking part in.
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