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Garrosh fans?
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Post by
Adamsm
Just how much about the Horde do the Horde people know in lore about Garrosh? Because we're looking at things from an all-knowing type basis and not from the perspective of the Horde citizensThe Mag'har know everything.
The Warsong seem to follow him, and I guess he's done something to get them to follow his lead beyond being the son of Hellscream, after all the Frostwolves didn't just follow Thrall he had to prove himself to them.
And we know some of the more vicious Horde members will already follow him, but if they all would, with a direct order from Thrall......
Post by
taurenmoo812
I'm wondering since you and adam are more educated about the Horde than me
How would the Horde public react to Garrosh's leadership. For example in lore few know kraus's real identity. Just how much about the Horde do the Horde people know in lore about Garrosh? Because we're looking at things from an all-knowing type basis and not from the perspective of the Horde citizens
To be frank, unless you've been living under a rock the past year or two, you can not have avoided Garrosh on anything, from first seeing him in Garadar, to him challanging Thrall in Orgrimmar (which in a lore term the citizens of ogrimmar would have known about) to him being there first in Borean Tundra, and then in the violet citadel.
These debates rarely come down to what npcs themselves know about it and more about the ones who can view the lore from a wider angle.
Post by
Adamsm
from first seeing him in Garadar,Most Azeroth Orc's wouldn't know about his past there. After all, their not all adventurers like our toons are suppose to be.
to him challanging Thrall in Orgrimmar (which in a lore term the citizens of ogrimmar would have known about)Which is a bad thing, from the viewpoint of a watcher, they would see what seems to be Garrosh winning till the Necropolis shows up and Thrall hits him with a blast to knock him away, then deal with the Scourge.
to him being there first in Borean TundraThat's where I got the Warsong... oh wait, there, that's his 'proving point' like Thralls. As for the the average joe in orgirimaar, they'd hear about his leadership in the Tundra(maybe).
and then in the violet citadel.Average people wouldn't have heard anything about that, as I doubt Thrall would want them to know one his higher up's made a huge mistake like that.
Vgk was asking how the average joe in the Horde would think/know about the son of Hellscream.
Post by
451455
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
taurenmoo812
For the record Dark I could ask him the same thing about you for every blatant insult you've thrown around on other threads at me or other posters who don't see the same thing as you. My opnions may be adject but at least it doesn't result in calling the other names.
Did you actually just say your posts don't result in name calling? Are you that deluded to thinking you are actually right?
I don't try to insult people, you just start running around calling people who don't agree with you names, then act shooked when they get angry.
Please just admit your wrong and move on.
Oh this must be that thing you do where you take what someone has already said based on your own misgivings, and try to turn it back on them saying 'there the ones who did it, not me' like in every other thread you made.
god.. at least answer vgkthehordeslaye's post with some sense of civility and make a debate.
Clearly you are just going to keep acting immature and being a troll, so I rest my case.
Oh give it a rest already geez, I'm at least able to join a debate on this with more intelligent lore people like Adam or Skeeran, well your trying to carry this on?
Post by
Monday
For the record Dark I could ask him the same thing about you for every blatant insult you've thrown around on other threads at me or other posters who don't see the same thing as you. My opnions may be adject but at least it doesn't result in calling the other names.
Did you actually just say your posts don't result in name calling? Are you that deluded to thinking you are actually right?
I don't try to insult people, you just start running around calling people who don't agree with you names, then act shooked when they get angry.
Please just admit your wrong and move on.
Oh this must be that thing you do where you take what someone has already said based on your own misgivings, and try to turn it back on them saying 'there the ones who did it, not me' like in every other thread you made.
god.. at least answer vgkthehordeslaye's post with some sense of civility and make a debate.
Clearly you are just going to keep acting immature and being a troll, so I rest my case.
Someone calling someone immature is being immature (so I guess I am immature...)
anyways
I think Garrosh is as immature and stupid as some people in this thread. I mean, just look at his dialogue in the Argent Tournament grounds. He acts like a whiny kid who can't shut up. Would you want this person to be your leader? (and to those who say yes, i suppose you act the same as him.)
And to those who say Thrall is a hippie. Warsong Gulch. Its a deforestation process. Is that hippie like at all?
I think that Garrosh will prove so horrible for the Horde that the Horde will exile Garrosh. When Garrosh refuses, they will attack, and call for help from the Alliance, possibly in a world event, where horde pick sides between Garrosh and the next leader of the horde. (I say Nazgrel, but...)
Although one thing about the old horde. While they were bloodthirsty savages, they still had some shred of honor in the form of Doomhammer. If what i said above doesn't happen, and the Horde reverts back to its old ways, perhaps a hero will rise and challenge Garrosh, showing honor, and strength enough to defeat Garrosh.
Or my final theory. Thrall becomes the Guardian of Tirisfal, this has been said. If this happens, than perhaps it happens that during his time in outland, Garrosh was possessed by a demon, and Thrall must now destroy him.
Post by
Adamsm
Thrall becomes the Guardian of Tirisfal, this has been said.That still hasn't been confirmed.
Post by
taurenmoo812
Thrall becomes the Guardian of Tirisfal, this has been said.That still hasn't been confirmed.
This ^
This rumor has been regurgitated enough times based on one event that played in the comics, when Jaina asked Thrall to join the guardians, and he sent Earthfury as the representative for shaman magics. Theres nothing more to it then this.
Post by
Monday
Thrall becomes the Guardian of Tirisfal, this has been said.That still hasn't been confirmed.
This ^
This rumor has been regurgitated enough times based on one event that played in the comics, when Jaina asked Thrall to join the guardians, and he sent Earthfury as the representative for shaman magics. Theres nothing more to it then this.
I only said that it had been said, not confirmed. If it is true, than i think the third one will happen. If not, well then not.
Post by
138638
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
taurenmoo812
thanks adam and taurenmoo I guess he could have a decent approval amongst the common joes within the Horde.
Regarding the new Guardian of Tirisfal I believe it will be
the sue
Medan. The comics seem to focuse a ton of Me'dan regarding Garrosh being possesed by demons all I can say is if theres a new council of Tirisfall Cuthn will not be the last demon/old god threat the new council of Tirisfal deals with and I believe cataclysm will focuse a bit on that.
Meaning the Garrosh being possesed theory would explain the sudden attitude change within Garrosh and seems similar to what the burning blade clan did with the help of a demon in tides of darkness and seems very possible if not probable
Now that is intresting. Not forgetting Grom himself was lead on by demonic forces beyond his control, it would be systematic to have his son possessed by demonic forces too, and having his actions dressed up as that typical orcish warrior stance of 'kill now ask later'. The thought of him leading the horde well under the sway of demonic control gives reason that the horde can be saved from him.
Post by
Morec0
I'm not saying that I'm a fan of Garrosh, but I think that making him Warcheif is an interesting twist in WoW.
Now, I'm not say that, lorewise, it was a smart choice, he's going to wage all out war against the Allaince - if he gets the chance. But I, personally, think its better then the Thrall/Varian events:
Thrall: I don't want to fight you.
Varian: Die!
Thrall: I'm not going to fight you.
Varian: Die!
No offense ment to Varian fans.
Now, lets replace Thrall with Garrosh
Garrosh: Human pig!
Varian: Demon spawn!
*Awsome battle*
I was getting a bit tired of the whole "one sided war" thing, and I'm glad that he's bringing some more tension to the game outside of PvP.
I'm going to enjoy seeing where WoW lore goes with him as Warcheif.
Post by
NeoBlackheart
Good luck trying to keep people from bashing Garrosh in any thread about him.
I hate him. I hope he gets eaten by Deathwing.
I was hoping people could be civil, but i guess you proved me wrong right away.. thanks
Thrall - George Washington
Garrosh - George Bush *rollseyes* okay.. anyone else?
next can we call Garrosh the virtual Hitler?
I would call him hitler. Just like hitler tried to supress the Jews( think it was I hate history) Garrosh thinks that all but the Orcs are weak.
Most liekly only reason he keeps tauren around is cause he likes hamburgers
Post by
479137
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
HiVolt
You know, despite my anger toward Garrosh's actions and his arrogance and disrespect to Thrall, I'm willing to change my opinions on him if I see a bit of character development.
Right now all we see is uncontrolled and uncalled for hatred, anger and warmongering from him. Why does he want war with the Alliance so badly? What have they ever directly done to him to cause his anger toward them? Does he have more than one mindset, that being "RAWR! ME SMASH PUNY PINKSKIN!"?
If I could get those questions reasonably answered, I might throw my hat into the "Garrosh Fans" ring. By reasonably, I mean give him a reason, other than just pure hatred, to go to war. Make him lose something in the process. And, show another side to him.
Right now, he is being made out to look more like Cobra Commander (tactically stupid, arrogant, and unabashedly hateful of everyone) than Grom Hellscream, or even Blackhand for that matter. Blackhand at least had a the reasoning of leading the Horde to power that the Orcs, and more importantly, the Blackrock Clan had never known, even if he was a puppet in a larger plan.
But if you ask me, there's just too much about Garrosh's psyche that is unknown and unexplained; and there is too much on the surface that is just unappealing (To many people. I'll admit some people may find his superficial characterization appealing, however disappointing that is to me.) to have loose supporters, let alone fans.
I'm all for a more powerful, warlike, savage Horde, but not at the expense of shallow characters in the leadership positions. I won't lie, I want a noble and honorable Horde. But, all is subject to change with the development of the story of the game, and that is what I want more than anything, development of the story. However, a story with weak, one-dimensional characters in pivotal positions within the story is not appealing or interesting.
Post by
451455
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
taurenmoo812
I'm all for a more powerful, warlike, savage Horde, but not at the expense of shallow characters in the leadership positions. I won't lie, I want a noble and honorable Horde. But, all is subject to change with the development of the story of the game, and that is what I want more than anything, development of the story. However, a story with weak, one-dimensional characters in pivotal positions within the story is not appealing or interesting.
I agree with you HiV0LT4G3.
Because right at this moment, the only reason it seems for Garrosh being here is to just have a counter character to match Varians insane obsession with killing the horde, by having someone equally as rage driven leading the horde, and without changing Thralls character. That strikes me as the only reason for Garrosh being here, that he's just a tool.
Post by
fsngnshiekfan
I love the mag'har, and with it, Garrosh, well pre wotlk garrosh who wasn't so stubborn and violent
Nagrand Garrosh = tha shiznit
Wotlk/cata Garrosh = asswipe
Post by
taurenmoo812
I love the mag'har, and with it, Garrosh, well pre wotlk garrosh who wasn't so stubborn and violent
Nagrand Garrosh = tha shiznit
Wotlk/cata Garrosh = asswipe
hmm.. dunno, he was simple a crying emo who did sod all for his people in nagrand, until Thrall broke him out of it and in that 1 moment, did that railing battlecry in the name of Hellscream. After that he.. well, as you say.
Post by
HiVolt
I'm all for a more powerful, warlike, savage Horde, but not at the expense of shallow characters in the leadership positions. I won't lie, I want a noble and honorable Horde. But, all is subject to change with the development of the story of the game, and that is what I want more than anything, development of the story. However, a story with weak, one-dimensional characters in pivotal positions within the story is not appealing or interesting.
I agree with you HiV0LT4G3.
Because right at this moment, the only reason it seems for Garrosh being here is to just have a counter character to match Varians insane obsession with killing the horde, by having someone equally as rage driven leading the horde, and without changing Thralls character. That strikes me as the only reason for Garrosh being here, that he's just a tool.
The only difference between Varian and Garrosh though, is we know Varian's motivation. And that alone makes him a much more interesting character. It doesn't really increase my liking of him all that much, but I can at least get where he's coming from. Whereas, with Garrosh... there's no reason behind the anger, the arrogance, and the warmongering.
Neither the game or the comics, both the most recent and sources of lore, show that he's trying to live up to his father's name, as most would say he is. But, there's no confirmation for that from any official source of lore.
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