My hypothesis on why alliance loses alot

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Сообщение от Blightman

The alliance loses a lot in pvp due many reasons... i'll list some here:

1. Protagonism

Everybody knows how to lead the batttleground and is not rare to find like 3 or 4 people giving order at the same time. If you are doing Alterac Valley, you'll find like 12.

2. Some ally players mess up the strat...

I generally post a strategy in the chat channel, in fact I have macros for all the battlegrounds, and is not rare to find someone who says, no do this instead... that's also part of point 1.

3. Alliance players quit easily...

If they see that the things are going bad, is not rare to see 2 or 3 giving up, when we still have a good chance.

Overall the alliance needs to play as a team and follow instructions, if someone steps up first as leader in the bgs, we should help him to develop his strat/s... instead of screwing up and confusing the rest...

No Plan Survives Contact With The Enemy, a military phrase acknowledging that you cannot fully plan for a fluid situation. To address this, the military has sets of Commander Intentions, which are what the troops turn to when the plans go astray.

A big problem in BGs is that people try and make a plan work even if the other side has done something that makes that plan difficult or impossible. You see this a lot in AV where 1 or more people keep talking about the strategy they won with last time. Guess what, BGs are not an instance where the other side will react the same way every time. Even more importantly, unless everyone on your side is the same, you r sides tactics will be different. Maybe you have more healers than last time, maybe fewer. Maybe you have a lot of stealth classes or only 1 or 2.

The side that adapts their strategy to counter the other side fastest is more likely to win.

Сообщение от 118061

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Сообщение от MIXTAP3

I don't know whats wrong with my battlegroup, but more often than not alliance wins... At least in the 29 bracket. I think 19 and 39 are more horde-winning

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Сообщение от victor2008

Battlegroup : Nightfall.

just in the eots last night ,we are outnumber 5vs 15 ,and we get full group after something like 1200 vs 200. Nobody give up and we finally win 2000vs1800. 3 cap+flag.
It is the spirit that all the hordies have ,they don't choose a faction that is beautiful (not BElf) ,they choose the spirit and honor.

Сообщение от Blightman

No Plan Survives Contact With The Enemy, a military phrase acknowledging that you cannot fully plan for a fluid situation. To address this, the military has sets of Commander Intentions, which are what the troops turn to when the plans go astray.

A big problem in BGs is that people try and make a plan work even if the other side has done something that makes that plan difficult or impossible. You see this a lot in AV where 1 or more people keep talking about the strategy they won with last time. Guess what, BGs are not an instance where the other side will react the same way every time. Even more importantly, unless everyone on your side is the same, you r sides tactics will be different. Maybe you have more healers than last time, maybe fewer. Maybe you have a lot of stealth classes or only 1 or 2.

The side that adapts their strategy to counter the other side fastest is more likely to win.

Ummm... If you read the art of war, your obiously learn that you will have to adapt the strategy for emeging situations. but you can't go into a war without a strategy... but a good plan indeed survives
contact with the enemy, the general or person who says such phrase should be fire quickly because those are the ones that can't win a battle in their territory or a war in a foreing territory. I don't know a war with a gneral who didn't plan to fight enemies...

LOL, thank you for
A) Agreeing with me
B) Not understanding what I wrote, check the parts of my original post I bolded for
C) Arguing both sides: strategies must adapt and that plans survive contact with the enemy. Switching to contingency plans <> following the original plan

Сообщение от Lorkin

Bottom line HORDE SUCKS IN WSG.

I have found this to be true as well. I think most Alliance PuGs know that in WSG you can turtle in the flag room and delay the game. There's no time limit, and Alliance toons are there to get kills anyways. Turtling just lets them do it for a long long time, don't think they care about winning the game or not. The more the Horde try to funnel into their camp, the more honor they get. You get the picture.

If you haven't experienced both sides, you should consider it. My observations on the servers that I play on are that Horde dominates from 1 to 69 in BGs, it doesn't matter which bracket. The only exception is Twink guides that go in with godly equip, but that doesn't happen too often.

Once you get to 70 though, its a bit split. This was before the changes to AV, but Alliance was pretty strong in this BG due to the rush to the Horde Flag. It may be different now with the new changes, I dunno. The other 2 BGs Horde continued to dominate, mostly because of coordination. WSG was a 50/50 chance of it turning into a turtle match. Again, my reasons why Alliance seem to stave off a WSG loss and sometimes win is because of the mentality of going for kills rather than BG wins. That and eventually some Horde gets bored of the turtle and leaves the game.

As someone else pointed out, take the mentality the Alliance are ONLY in it for racking kills and getting honor that way and it starts to make more sense. Horde get honor through BG wins and Alliance try to get as many kills as possible before they lose the game.

It really is like night and day on some servers. My Alliance toon had 45 mins to 1.5 hours queues to look forward to. We would lose anything BUT AV most of the time, which resulted in little honor and tokens. Would get out and have to re-queue again. So my best bet was to queue up for AV where the games were longer and we have a good chance of winning.

On my Horde server, queues were near instant. We won 90% of the BGs I was in (talking PuG vs PuG here), and got tons of tokens and honor. Would requeue instantly and be in another game right away. That being said, AB and EoTS were the best to queue due to quick wins and a time limit. WSG was hit or miss due to possible turtles, and AV wasn't good with all the afk'ers back in the day.

Just my observations.

Сообщение от Zanthis

I have to say it varies from each battle group. Who isn't good and who is good. Who is childish and who isn't. On Stormstrike the horde seem to adapt quicker and the alliance gives up on anything other than a pre-made vs pug. I played for a year on my Orc Hunter on Stormstrike before I moved to Nightfall to play with RL friends with alliance, about 7 months ago. The alliance there is childish, don't want to listen to suggestions on how to win. Spaz out once their 1st plan fails and gives up. I have better luck playing in the 51-60 pvp range atleast after 3 matches I have those guys winning since they will listen and adapt to things.

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Сообщение от Marat

I played Allince for the first 3 month cause i thought they were the "good" guys i got to lvl 28 and found out about PvP and tried WSG first we won the first match cause we had 5 twinks i went for another one and we lost 1-3 i tried a couple of more (i was a druid BtW) we lost all of them and i gave up so then my friend from my guild told me about premades so we made an 8 ppl premade WSG (no twinks) and we won 0-3 cause we had team work. when i pugged for WSG everybody just ran out of the base when the match began and started killing horde i was like <WTF i thought we were soposed to cap the flag?> so i went after the flag then got to our base and there were like 3 ppl on me and healers,warrs and others were just in the midfiled farming HK i was asking for help for like 5 min they all ignored me i died eventyally and guess what they blamed it all on me they said <U CAN""T EVEN HOLD A FLAG WHILE WE ARE TRYING TO GET THIR FLAG> i was like <huh u were waiting for horde to come to midfield while half of you could've whent after the flag > and they started calling me a noob and told me they will reprt me if i play like this i knew it was bullsh!t. This happned in AB too and in the 30-39 bracket and i got very tired of it and Ditched allince re-rolled horde and was actyally winnning there.

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Сообщение от daurenr

i think it is because ppl give up fast
playing horde rogue myself, i noticed if score goes ally 0 - horde1 on WSG
ally just either quit or turtle.
but if score is 2ally - 0 horde, we jus try our best to win. moments like getting a flag jus in front of ally FC and run so to give more time for horde get flag back becomes common.