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Varian Thread
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Post by
451455
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Post by
138638
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Post by
Rankkor
cataclysm Varian should have been more aggresive
sorry bro, but varian is agressive enough, if he gets more agressive he's gonna be worst than garrosh, and I'm sure that's not what any alliance suporter wants, varian is varian, garrosh is garrosh, if they both try to imitate the other then the consequences can and will be disastrous.
Post by
451455
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Post by
Skreeran
Varian definitely meant to kill Thrall.
And if he's not going to exterminate the orcs, what does he plan to do? Kill them until they can't fight back anymore? Put them back in concentration camps?
your point is? just cause you like the Horde doesn't mean his actions were wrong. There is an unoffical war between Horde and Alliance and the Alliance are going to lose Ashenvale and in essence WSG this means Varian is not aggresive enough and let the enemy get land what Varian needs to do is storm into org kill Thrall get out plain and simple.
If anything Varian is not aggressive enough with the Horde gaining so much land and all in cataclysm Varian should have been more aggresive to do whats best for his people and get rid of the threat they poseThis is ridiculous. First, of all, killing Thrall would only succeed in putting the orcs into a rage the likes of which humanity has never seen. Stormwind and Varian would fall or the orcs would die trying. Think what happened with Lothar dying.
Second, it's not because of Thrall that the elves are losing Ashenvale, that's because of Garrosh. I don't care if you kill him.
And again, genocide is wrong, plain and simple. Always has been, always will be, no matter what your justifications are.
Post by
229054
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Post by
Rankkor
I was lmao reading how you think the Forsaken will be good guys. I really dont know who stared that rumor, but the Forsaken are probobly eviler then before...
Most of the betrayers from Battle for the Undercity were either killed or scattered. But RAS likley still exists. Farnel is still alive. The Grand Apothecary guy in Agmar's Hammer still lives. Sylvanas is still working to kill the human race, and now that all the Forsaken prior to Putresses betrayal now serve just her, the whole lot of them will help her destroy the human race.
I was so mad when Sylvanas kissed Jaina's butt in that one meeting, she would have played Jaina like she did for Garithos had Varian not stepped in. And FYI, the women being killed in RotLK was just beore WotLK. I think its safe to say the forsaken will never change... and even if they do, it wont bring the people given grusome deaths back, but like you said...
Time will tell.
apply some logic, the trolls changed, the blood-elves changed, the orcs changed, heck on cataclyms even the tauren who had never worshiped the light changed, so why then I ask of you do you think the forsaken can't change?
it's very close-minded and a bit naive to think that an entire civilization can't change, granted, on an individual level, some plp never change, but in a grand scale, change is posible.
if change was imposible, then we would still be wearing hats, the disco music would still sound on the nightclubs, and plataform shoes would be used still.
but nope, all those things are gone, why? because people change with the times.
the forsaken before WOW, were alone, stranded, in a world that they felt was hostile to them, and didn' wanted them, so, they embraced the stereotype of villians that people put on them.
but after almost 10 years on the horde., the forsaken feel wanted, they feel apreciated, even needed, what's more, they found a place were they feel like they belong (wich is next to other races who are despised by their former actions, and are struggling to find acceptance on the eyes of the world).
those circunstances can sow the seeds of change on a civilization.
and to think otherwise is really to have tunnel-vission and a close-minded view of the world.
Edit: major typos
Post by
451455
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451455
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229054
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451455
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Post by
Rankkor
but it looks pretty obvisous that she went from the horde, timing and all
you gotta elaborate that part better, because I don't understand at all what u just said there (maybe is my english that's failing me U.u)
And its also wierd she goes after Varian FIRST, doesnt it?
nope is not, she atacked varian first because her mission was to put the horde and the alliance against each other in case her assassination failed, think about it, if she hits thrall, and varian sees that, then he's not gonna assume she was sent by the horde, why would they atack their own leader?
is pure logic, she hit varian first as a backup plan in case she failed.
Wierd that the horde would deny it?
again, flawed logic, the horde didin't doit, and u think is weird they deny it? o_O
so let me get it straight, they didn't doit but they should had said they did it? that's nonsence.
she killed Llane because she had to, or she would be killed by the Shadow Council
on the yogg-saron encounter we see that it was them manipulating her all along, even in a subconsious level.
he is not a human superesist
right, that's why he uses racial slurs against all races of the horde isn't it? he can't just call them orcs, nope, he calls them Dogs, green-skinned aberrations, savage animals, uncivilized brutes, and other forms of slurs directed at dehumanizing his hated oponents.
sorry mate, but a racist individual is that who dismisses another race as inferior to his own.
in the case of wow, it's more a matter of species rather than races if we think about it, but meh it's the same thing.
no other leader (exept maybe garitos) uses slurs when talking about members of the horde.
Post by
229054
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Post by
Skreeran
I never said things cant change, but the Forsaken wont, nor will they.
Dont look at them as good guys, they are not. They are still evil, Sylvanas still works on plagues, and wants to kill all humans, etc.
They dont want acceptance, they want death to all who are not them, i cant read the acceptance thing with out laughingWhat about Leonid Barthalomew?
And then there's
Dan Golthas
...
"When I clawed my way out of the grave, I thought my family would welcome me with open arms. Instead, they drove me out of the village, screaming in a language I could no longer understand."
Post by
Rankkor
I never said things cant change, but the Forsaken wont, nor will they
again flawed logic xD, that's saying things can't change.
believe me, it's closed-minded to think an entire civilization can't change mate.
no matter how u spin it, to generalize an entire civilization as something unchangeable it's simply close-minded.
everything (including the forsaken) can change.
and no, they are not "good" yet, but I think the change started.
and for what's worth, after wrathgate the forsaken don't develop bligth anymore, and if u got a source saying otherwise, point it out. (and I mean AFTER the wrathgate)
Post by
451455
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229054
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451455
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451455
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Post by
Skreeran
By "timing", i meant during a peace meeting, of all places.
Yeah, i know... but it still looks like the Horde was behind it.
If i was trying to assassinate someone, and it failed, i would deny every thing.Don't forget, there were plenty of Humans, Night Elves, and other Alliance races attacking as well.
Yoggy just flashed back, he is not making the dragon meeting happen, but we see that to anyway.No, it's implied that he manipulated them. After all, it was old god whispers that drove Neltharion insane, which is why he made the demon soul. So it's proven that he did have influence on that.
Varian only hates Orcs and Forsaken for stuff they did, saying he wold cast away Furbolgs or a random race is just stupied. You said he thinks the Alliance is the only "good", and junk like that. Its not true.But he hates the whole race. He refuses to see the good and honorable side that orcs can have; the side that Tirion, Jaina, Alexstraza, the Naaru, Rhonin, and so on see.
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