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The QOTD Thread: Goodbye
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Post by
134377
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Squishalot
I do not support or condone hitting children, under any circumstances. Apart from that, they're going to be the ones picking your nursing home...
How is any other form of discipline going to endear you to them?
Post by
Haxzor
It works, but it's a very delicate subject.
Post by
Adamsm
Spanking and possible wooden spoon across the knuckles; anything else, way too much.
Post by
Interest
No.
Post by
Gone
I always think of the demented ways parents punish their kids
without
hitting them. It's like the old cliche about catching your kid smoking, and making them smoke a whole carton of cigarettes as punishment. WTF!
My mom used to wash my mouth out with soap for cursing. Another person on these forums told me her mom used to make her eat chillie (that one actually sounds fun). A friend of mine's grandfather used to take him out to the pool when he was really young, and convince him he was going to drown him, and wouldn't let up until he started crying.
Compared to some of that stuff, I'd rather take the wooden spoon.
Post by
240140
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Gone
I think the question we have to ask is, how old does a kid get before it's no longer considered child beating? I imagine there are plenty of dads just waiting for their bratty teenage son to turn 18 so he can give him a good ass whooping...
^ That was a joke.
Post by
asakawa
I always think of the demented ways parents punish their kids
without
hitting them. It's like the old cliche about catching your kid smoking, and making them smoke a whole carton of cigarettes as punishment. WTF!
My mom used to wash my mouth out with soap for cursing. Another person on these forums told me her mom used to make her eat chillie (that one actually sounds fun). A friend of mine's grandfather used to take him out to the pool when he was really young, and convince him he was going to drown him, and wouldn't let up until he started crying.
Compared to some of that stuff, I'd rather take the wooden spoon.
How about doing none of those things? Really, who is suggesting that there's a choice between physically harming a child or taking them to water and telling them you're going to drown them... these are the best parenting ideas that are available? Of course not, that's a
false dichotomy
.(##RESPBREAK##)16##DELIM##asakawa##DELIM##
Post by
Gone
How about doing none of those things? Really, who is suggesting that there's a choice between physically harming a child or taking them to water and telling them you're going to drown them... these are the best parenting ideas that are available? Of course not, that's a
false dichotomy
.
Well, compared to being murdered I'd rather just be stabbed, but all in all, I'd rather none of them happened. *extreme examples for the win*
Squish the way you present the other way of discipline makes it sound it's the only other way. Sitting down and talking to your kids when they act up is an option too, you don't need to ignore them or hit them. I only mentioned the corner cause it would bore a kid to sleep. If I ever did make my kid go stare at a wall I'd still be a few feet from him trying to talk it through.
Obviously I don't have kids, so I don't know how it would be 24/7, but I have worked at day cares with wild kids, and it has worked to hug them and talk to them instead of yelling. Maybe yelling works too but why go there and waste energy when you don't have to?
Maybe everything doesn't work for all kids and parents but I think it's worth trying a lot of things and not just settle for lots of yelling, ignoring or spanking.
Idk where you guys got the idea that I was saying it was a choice between physical or psychological abuse. That post was in no way abdicating physical punishment. I just wanted to point out the crazy things parents do to their kids, besides beating them (and mainly I just wanted to share the story about my friends psychotic grandfather).
Post by
240140
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
asakawa
I always think of the demented ways parents punish their kids without hitting them.
This reads as "
I always think of the demented
"
Hence the false dichotomy. If you hadn't intended to suggest that violence is good because it's better than the suggested alternative then I'm glad we cleared that up.
Post by
Haxzor
Positive Reinforcement. .| Positive Punishment
___________________.|___________________
..................................... .|
Negative Reinforcement.| Negative Punishment
These are all ways of encouraging or discouraging behaviour. It's better to use both of the Reinforcements but using the Punishments work in some cases (Taking away internet is negative punishment, spanking would be positive punishment)
Post by
Gone
I always think of the demented ways parents punish their kids without hitting them.
This reads as "
I always think of the demented
"
Hence the false dichotomy. If you hadn't intended to suggest that violence is good because it's better than the suggested alternative then I'm glad we cleared that up.
If I meant avoiding violence I would have said that. I literally meant just what I said, that all this talk about physical abuse is making me think about the non physical abuse that some parents inflict on their kids. I was half joking to, which I figured people would have picked up on with the capital WTF and the story about my friend and the chillie. I wouldn't bring silly stuff like that up if I was making a serious case about how harmful non physical punishment is.
Post by
asakawa
Fair enough. I thought the suggestion, even if only inferred through humour, was worth challenging.
Post by
Squishalot
Squish the way you present the other way of discipline makes it sound it's the only other way. Sitting down and talking to your kids when they act up is an option too, you don't need to ignore them or hit them. I only mentioned the corner cause it would bore a kid to sleep. If I ever did make my kid go stare at a wall I'd still be a few feet from him trying to talk it through.
Obviously I don't have kids, so I don't know how it would be 24/7, but I have worked at day cares with wild kids, and it has worked to hug them and talk to them instead of yelling. Maybe yelling works too but why go there and waste energy when you don't have to?
Maybe everything doesn't work for all kids and parents but I think it's worth trying a lot of things and not just settle for lots of yelling, ignoring or spanking.
You're describing a situation in which you don't need to punish your children, when you can sit down with them and cognitively challenge the issues. What would you do if your kids won't sit down with you or participate? If they refuse to put their clothes on to go out of the house, and just squirm and struggle and prevent you from forcibly putting on a shirt or pants? (Example derived from an article I just read in the newspaper.) The whole reason why you would be
punishing
them is because they're not doing what you want them to do.
I agree that you should be trying lots of things - I'm not saying that as soon as they step out of line and *
WHACK
*, or anything of the sorts. However, if it comes down to a punishment of sorts, I'm just highlighting that physical punishment is just another means of enforcing punishment when it's required, and that I'm not comfortable with the assertion that it leaves more in the way of scarring than a mental/emotional punishment.
Post by
Gone
Fair enough. I thought the suggestion, even if only inferred through humour, was worth challenging.
It's all good, things get lost in translation when typing. I only took issue with it because that would have been a dumb argument, and I wouldn't want you to think I would be making it.
Post by
asakawa
Hehe, blame it on my fusty British stiff upper lip preventing me from detecting colonial comedy ^_^
Post by
240140
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Squishalot
If my kid refuses to sit down with me, I sit my kid down. It's not that hard, and you don't need to use force, have you seen how small kids are?
And what, pin them to the ground to stop them from getting up again? Also, it's not the physical act of sitting down, it's the 'listening / participating' element that I would question. Use the clothes example I provided earlier - what would you do with a 3 year old who doesn't want to put pants on when it's cold outside?
I don't believe that what haxzor called positive punishment is a good thing.
Again I ask - what makes negative punishment any better?
You wouldn't hit a teenager, you'd take their phone, so why hit a kid?
Some people in this thread have said it's okay only if they are young, why exactly?
That's a very good question - you'd need to ask them, because I never said anything to that end. I'm personally a believer in negotiating and going down the cognitive challenging path. I would argue though that there's only a certain age when that's possible from - you can't cognitively argue with a 3 year old. So again, in the clothes example, you can't convince them that they'll be cold outside if they don't put pants on, because their brain isn't going to be thinking that way / won't care.
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