The Garrosh Thread

Post by taurenmoo812

itd be bad writing if he either A. doesnt get killed off ,

or B. Doesnt get redeemed.

I genuinely don't think we'll see a specific "Garrosh's redemption" event. If anything, the entire horde story arc in Cata seems to be Garrosh's place to grow, and while he sure as hell has a while to go he isn't the same ape#$%^ dumbass he was in Wrath, either.

Besides, I don't know about you, but I'd really prefer it if Blizzard actually developed him into a good leader over time rather than just hammering some turning point type event into Garrosh's story just to say, "Ok, now you can start liking him."

As for Sylvanas, I'd honestly be a bit disappointed if she got killed off this soon after becoming interesting.

I'm not sure if this is denial or what, but its like overlooking the fact that he's actully worse then in northrend now. He's still yelling out about the horde conquering the world, like some old dark horde leader, only now, he's the warchief and showing little restraint.
So he goes one minute telling a commander he was bad for killing people with a bomb and it was against a code of honor, and in the next phase, he's yelling for world domination and to kill the alliance outright.
And I dare say someones gonna now say 'oh we've heard it all before tauren!', but only cause people arn't getting it either, or outright ignoring the rest.

Garrosh doesn't need to be "redeemed" or else why even bring him around if he's just gonna be Thrall with brown skin, and Sylvanas' whole schtick is being undead, killing her for that would be a stupid decision.

I've often thought this to. See, I've seen a lot of garrosh fans saying 'omg Thrall was a pussy Garrosh knows where its at!' and then later defend him saying 'nah he'll redeem and stop being like this'. So basicly you want him to be a tyrantical jackass.. but you also don't want him to be one and be a noble figure, but be a tyrent, but not a tyrent, who is one, but isn't.

Honestly, Just get over it and admit the reason why you like garrosh is because he acts like what the old horde use to be, when they were the evil demon lead orcs, because it satisfies playing a bad guy.

Post by 448765

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Post by Monday

Edworth, you have my kudos. You, sir/ma'am, are truly a level-headed person.

Post by taurenmoo812

I'm not sure anyone wants Garrosh to be a tyrant but you, really, but that's neither here nor there. The reason I don't buy the dark horde comparison is because it's a completely different context. The old horde killed, butchered, maimed, etc just for the sake of killing, butchering, maiming, etc and while i'm sure there are some orcs who will enjoy their work more than others, the horde's current aggression isn't as senseless as that.

I would agree with you Edworth, except well the horde would be securing resources at it was, and even fighting against the alliance over areas to secure that, one thing stands out with Garrosh to the rest of that, him yelling at the top of his lungs 'The world belongs to the horde!', not even remotely with restraint, he makes it clear, he wants to conquer the world and rub out the alliance along with it. and likewise, looking at the prelude to cataclysm with Varian, he wants to wipe out the horde too (that whole Varian to Saurfang thing was worth nothing, like I knew it wouldn't)

with Thralls horde, they secured there lands, made use of the resources to them, and defended what was theres to defend. With Garrosh's horde, he wants to destroy instead of defend, and its already showing in many orcs actions what he plans for the rest of azeroth.

Actully, that saurfang point does give another example of just how side winding this can be, where like I say, Varian let Saurfang takes his sons body, and suddenly every was saying 'Seee, he is nice to orcs, he's not such a tyrent after all', and what follows is him carrying out his offensive against the horde anyway, so it made that whole scene worth little.
Likewise, Garrosh copying Saurfangs speech from icc when throwing that murdering commander off a cliff, everyone saying 'omg seeee he is a good leader' just for him to later lead a flight to twilight highlands, break apart the fleet to dive bomb the alliance, and leading to his own airship being blown up.
These lessions they learn is short lived.

Post by 306612

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Post by Garenzo

Post by 571648

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Post by taurenmoo812

just for him to later lead a flight to twilight highlands, break apart the fleet to dive bomb the alliance, and leading to his own airship being blown up.
These lessions they learn is short lived.

Like I said, !@#$ happens. (even in times of war)

They didn't know about the Twilight Dragonflight, which makes the event a lot like when Thrall sent Grom to Ashenvale to chop wood (as a punishment) without knowing about the demons and night elves. Of course it's worse because Garrosh did it, even though the outcome of the Grom incident was infinitely worse.

Seems like you've just decided to hate this certain character no matter what... Fair enough I guess, had similar opinions about Varian when he was introduced, but after reading up on him my opinion changed.

Ha. funny thing is, mine didn't, I still can't stand Varian and his warmongering nature disguised as rightous intent, but I just hate Garrosh more for dragging the horde back down to the old days of 'War = Everything'.
I'd even say I would sooner see Varian kick Garrosh's ass, and this is someone whos spent years defending what the horde was about.

Actully, that point itself sums up why I dislike Garrosh and Varian so much, because they pretend to be rightous in there intent, but is just a cover for there want to justify there own bloodlust. If you say 'this is war so I can kill you without cause' then it basicly lets the character do whatever they want, and call it canon.

At least with characters like Sylvanas, she isn't disguisng herself as something she's not. She is a deranged cow who wants to extend her reach to anything within her surroundings, killing and raising it as her undead. She doesn't pretend to have holy intent, outside of bolstering her forces.

Post by Adamsm

Cataclysm = War, has nothing to do with Garrosh.

Post by yesiddsir

Okay let's see this situation through a game designers perspective. what do they think would be most fun to do in a the game? Do like Thrall and mostly just sit there and hope for the alliance to change their mind about the horde (especially Varian), or acctually do something productive (maybe not taking over the world) like trying to get a fothold in the same land as the biggest threat in your world, while attacking your oldest enemy and try to force them to submission. Even if that is a stupid choice it is fun to play.

And again Wow is a game, so what the designers are developing is content that is fun to play, and you got to admit that even if Garrosh is plain stupid he is cool in that way that he wont take any #$%^ from anyone. Sure Thrall probly dont take $%^& either but does he ever do anything about it? not what i have seen (please correct me if i am wrong). And i have an idea. Try to come up with how Garrosh should have been/should be developed and do some good.

(please excuse my poor writing skills, i am not from an english speaking country)

(And please do not rage on me for being a Garrosh super fan because i am not)

Post by 448765

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Post by taurenmoo812

The simple fact is this. People like Garrosh because he's in your face, obnoxious, loud and agressive. He acts before thinking and doesn't think very well when he does, and whatever way you want to interpret that, people like Garrosh because he has all the trates of the old horde style, brutal, relentless, and reckless, which is what the old horde was.

Now, some are trying to form the idea, that 'oh, maybe he will shape up and be a noble and smart leader who knows whats best for the horde'. So basicly, you want him to be a relentless thug, but you want him to be a smarter, more attuned and calmer one too.

In other words, people call Thrall weak because he isn't a reckless durp like Garrosh, but they want Garrosh to end up like Thrall anyway.

Post by GVHB

In other words, people call Thrall weak because he isn't a reckless durp like Garrosh, but they want Garrosh to end up like Thrall anyway.

And who are this people?

Post by Garenzo

In other words, people call Thrall weak because he isn't a reckless durp like Garrosh, but they want Garrosh to end up like Thrall anyway.

And who are this people?

Was going to ask that as well... Haven't seen anyone here saying Thrall is weak or a bad character or anything like that either.

I like Garrosh because I think he's a cool character (although as previously mentioned by many, there are some gaps to be filled about what happened to him between the expansions) who adds some good story to Cataclysm. I still like Thrall a lot, (who in their right mind could play through WC3 and not like him?) but I think the change of leadership (if only temporary) is welcome after all those years.

If a change of warchief is necessary, why would you wanna play safe and have one with the exact same ideas and attitude as Thrall? And why would anyone who likes Garrosh (or anyone else for that matter) want him to be Thrall with brown skin?

Post by taurenmoo812

You mean you really haven't noticed the number of people saying they think Garrosh is better then Thrall and Thralls a pussy?

Post by Garenzo

On MMO-champion maybe, but that place is incredibly troll-infested anyways. Haven't seen a lot of people say that here. (I'd take statements like "I hope Thrall DIES!" with a pinch of salt)

Post by GVHB

Post by taurenmoo812

There are people that don't like Thrall but like Garrosh, but I want to know who are the people that like Garrosh because he is not like Thrall but, at the same time, want Garrosh to be Thrall's clone.

You want me to go over the vast waves of threads to find these people then? Have a look though this thread, and go on mmo champ, and your find it.

Post by 448765

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Post by taurenmoo812

The problem with that, is that it was shards of grey before cataclysm. right now, the horde is a much darker colour then before.

The horde and alliance had what I call balance though wotlk with the introduction of Varian to the alliance. Here, you had a warmongering leader leading a group of races more intent on living an easier existance. On the horde side, you had Thrall, who wanted his people to live in a way devoid of war if it could be done, and even when many horde wanted war, Thrall kept them in line.

Think of its like yin and yang, a circle of dark in white, a circle of white in dark.

As of now though, the horde is lead by a leader with the same intent on the old horde, world domination, telling such like 'only the strong survive'.

And I have to say, seeing orgrimmar, seeing what Garrosh is doing to the horde and the direction its going.. for the first time, I'm actully starting to dislike it.

I'm even tempted to say, if this change is permanent, and this is how the horde is going to be from here on, I will hand in the towel and say feck of blizzard, this isn't the horde I grew to like, and I sure as hell won't go alliance again.

The Garrosh Thread

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