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Marks Hunter getting owned...by a BM Hunter...
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Post by
xcrunr1647
Bunch of BM Hunters can't spell and talk too much here.
I'm sorry, but your pet is your sole advantage over us in PvP. With intimidation, it's damned hard to get away, especially if you have any type of brains, you would have a cat (with Dash), a Warp Stalker (with Warp), or a boar (with Charge). Your pet would be on us literally within seconds. After your pet is on us, they get behind us and puts out a steady stream of numbers, and once they are behind us, they are hella hard to kill, because, well, they are behind us! That gives a MM/Surv hunter about a maximum of two seconds to dish out at least 5.5k damage to the pet before it's "unkillable", which is insane and close to impossible.
Any smart BM Hunter would pop BW as soon as he's in the fight, because he can always have some lucky crits, burst you down to 40%, which isn't hard, silence you, so you can't use BW, then commence pwning you.
Most MM Hunters would start at 41 yards in the beginning, instead of 20 (Scatter Shot) range, because they'd pray that the BM Hunters are 41/20, and we'd have a 6 yards advantage over them, which is not much, but it's something.
An equally skilled BM Hunter will always beat an equally skilled and geared MM Hunter.
I can beat you, no problems, though.
/cheer
For the record, Rufwon, I would absolutely shoot you as soon as possible after I trap you...the whole point of a Freezing Trap is to freeze the target (hence the name "Freezing Trap")...in addition, traps have a nasty habit of wearing off early in pvp, so I'll get my range then do an Aimed/Arcane Shot double on your ass, followed shortly thereafter by a Multi-Shot.
In a no-pets duel, a MM hunter would hand a BM hunter his @$$ any day.
Post by
Qlix
Im BM! I Pew! Pew! you QQ!
/rolls eyes
Post by
Lohr
Right because I'm just going to stand there and just let you just shoot me. Don't you think I know this rotation enough to interrupt and I'm not talking about BW.
This thread is a joke. I'm done with it.
Im BM! I Pew! Pew! you QQ!
/rolls eyes
Post by
xcrunr1647
This thread is a joke. I'm done with it.
Im BM! I Pew! Pew! you QQ!
/rolls eyes
lol
Post by
Sgtpain
BM Hunters put out more DPS faster then MM Hunters. Well at least ive noticed a difference when i respecced.
I'm not going to get into that debate with you.
However, the key to pvp is
burst damage
, namely, doing as much damage as possible in ~4 seconds. At this, BM hunters can come nowhere close to MM hunters. Between Aimed Shot and the
6 different attack power/damage dealt multipliers
(yes, 6, and I'm not including crit bonus/cooldown/DoT modifiers to that number), MM hunters can pump out more damage than either BM or surv in a span of 5 seconds.
It's not even close.
Take another look at the BM talent tree. BWI, Ferocious inspiration and serpent's swiftness are all mutpliplyers also, and, I STILL managed to get Aimed shot, Rapid killing, Lethal shots, and, Go for the Throat. Why doesn't anyone think they can complete a tree and not grab some talents in another? As for aimed shot, there is only one thing that makes this better than steady shot, and that's the 50% decreased healing. The dps is EXACTLY the same as steady shot when you take casting times into account.
I am mainly PvE, so I missed out on Hawk Eye, but in most cases, I have yet to have a real problem with that. In most cases, 6 yards can be closed very easily without being hit.
Serpent's swiftness is a nice little added bonus for interupting your silly aimed shot too. ;)
As for BW and dealing with it, I won't use it in most cases until my pet is on the person already. It's more of a fail safe switch for me in case a Lock decides to join in on the fun and I need to resist his fear and heaven forbid, wak up the next morning and find all my alts are dead from his DoTs. Everyone says that MM is better for this or for that, but I have yet to talk to a BM hunter who went to MM and thought it blew BM out of the water in dps.
In conclussion, if you want an even better fix, quit crying and respec BM if you want to PvP. There is a reason why each spec is better at one thing or another.
Post by
xcrunr1647
In conclussion, if you want an even better fix, quit crying and respec BM if you want to PvP. There is a reason why each spec is better at one thing or another.
The point of what I said was not that MM does better dps. BM, in my opinion, can pump better sustained dps over a period of time greater than 10 seconds than a MM hunter can.
The thing about pvp is that BM hunters can't even touch a MM hunter when it comes to burst damage. The damage per shot ratio is much higher for a MM hunter than a BM hunter.
As I have said before, I can pwn anything except a BM hunter that pops BW. I haven't actually had a chance to go 1v1 with a similarly geared BM hunter since I started this thread, but I have no intention of respeccing BM.
It's a game. I play it because it's fun. I wasn't crying, I was simply trying to get advice from more experienced PvP'ers on how to improve my game.
Marks is the spec I find most fun, so that's what I play. If that means I'm gonna get my face rubbed in the dirt by BM hunters, fine. I'll go do the same to a mage, priest, rogue, warlock, druid, shaman, warrior and paladin.
=)
Post by
109478
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
xcrunr1647
the no pets duel? Sure. But you get to remove your ranged weapon :)
Sounds like fun to me =)
Post by
Sgtpain
Ok, long story short here:
Sgtpain, you're wrong. MM is definately better for PvP, due to the high burst damage to take an opponent out of the fight quickly.
L2BMHunter as well, Aimed shot is not comparable to steady shot in any way, shape, or form. Steady shot DPS/DPM > Aimed shot DPS/DPM. With aimed shot, you'll be getting 2 autos, 1 aimed. Steady will be 3 autos, 2 steady. I think the steady shots win it.
If it's better, than why doesn't it crush BM every time? MM looks good on paper, but I rarely find an MM hunter that blew me away, unless he was just a really skilled player, which you can find in BM spec too. I always see the "burst damage" arguement for MM, but it never seems to quite work out that way on the BG. It's all theorycrafting and applying it never seems to work out the way people think it should.
A buddy of mine, in my guild, is a BM hunter. He was twinked out at lvl 59 for months to gain honor and marks. He respecced MM for the sole purpose of your arguement, tried it for about a month, doing BG every single day and learning how to use it. Fact of the matter is, he said that he just couldn't stay alive long enough to get off all of the "burst damage". He was being kited all over the place, and, non-stop, for that matter. He also lost intimidation, which not only gives you a chance to get in some additional dps on the target (which makes up alot of the lost burst damage) but it's also 4 seconds of not being hit by atleast 1 target.
dps is not always the end all be all. If it were, rogues would not have all of their CC or would simply not use it. Incapacitating a target and resisting his CC methods can keep you alive ALOT longer.
Post by
xcrunr1647
Fact of the matter is, he said that he just couldn't stay alive long enough to get off all of the "burst damage".
Then he sucked. The whole point of "burst damage" is to get it off in ~4 seconds. He couldn't stay alive that long? lol
Post by
Sgtpain
Fact of the matter is, he said that he just couldn't stay alive long enough to get off all of the "burst damage".
Then he sucked. The whole point of "burst damage" is to get it off in ~4 seconds. He couldn't stay alive that long? lol
Tell me how MM gets of more damage than BM in less than 4 seconds. Not to mention, how you kill someone in less than 4 seconds, not counting a lowbie lvl with green gear.
How many honorable kills do you have? Link to armory please.
Post by
Shrezt
This thread really needs to be locked.
Stop trying to increase postcount++;, there is no meaningful discussion here any longer.
Post by
xcrunr1647
/rant
1) L2READ...~4 seconds =/= <4 seconds
2) I never, ever, ever said that I kill people in ~(about) 4 seconds. I said "burst damage, namely, doing as much damage as possible in ~4 seconds." How does that translate to "I kill people in less than 4 seconds?" However, I digress...
/endrant
This is how I pump out more damage in a short time span than a BM hunter:
Casters
: Silencing Shot--->Aimed Shot--->Arcane Shot--->Multi-Shot--->Scatter Shot (for the spell interrupt)--->Aimed Shot--->Arcane Shot
Melee
: Aimed Shot--->Arcane Shot--->Multi-Shot--->Concussive Shot--->Arcane Shot--->Scatter Shot--->Aimed Shot--->Multi-Shot
Those sequences may take around 10 seconds to get off, give or take, since pvp is very dynamic. However, assuming that NONE of those shots crit (and I always get at least 1 crit in there somewhere, usually multi-shot for ~1-1.4k), clothies will typically be below 30% health, and plate/mail wearers will be below 45%.
Bear in mind, none of this include my cat, who does a significant amount of damage.
And often, BM hunter will say, "yea, but I have Aimed Shot too, yadda yadda..." Maybe thats true, but if you put 41 points in BM, then you cannot get mortal shots...+30% damage to crits. And as I said, I nearly ALWAYS get one of my shots to crit.
Summary:
1) L2READ...or maybe you can read perfectly, in which case you need to work on expanding your vocabulary.
2) When MM hunters crit, they crit big...way bigger than BM hunters of similar gear/level.
Post by
xcrunr1647
How many honorable kills do you have? Link to armory please.
Check my signature, Einstein.
Once again, l2read.
Post by
xcrunr1647
Yea, this really wasn't the point of this thread, my questions were answered many posts ago lol.
Post by
Sgtpain
/rant
1) L2READ...~4 seconds =/= <4 seconds
2) I never, ever, ever said that I kill people in ~(about) 4 seconds. I said "burst damage, namely, doing as much damage as possible in ~4 seconds." How does that translate to "I kill people in less than 4 seconds?" However, I digress...
/endrant
This is how I pump out more damage in a short time span than a BM hunter:
Casters
: Silencing Shot--->Aimed Shot--->Arcane Shot--->Multi-Shot--->Scatter Shot (for the spell interrupt)--->Aimed Shot--->Arcane Shot
Melee
: Aimed Shot--->Arcane Shot--->Multi-Shot--->Concussive Shot--->Arcane Shot--->Scatter Shot--->Aimed Shot--->Multi-Shot
Those sequences may take around 10 seconds to get off, give or take, since pvp is very dynamic. However, assuming that NONE of those shots crit (and I always get at least 1 crit in there somewhere, usually multi-shot for ~1-1.4k), clothies will typically be below 30% health, and plate/mail wearers will be below 45%.
Bear in mind, none of this include my cat, who does a significant amount of damage.
And often, BM hunter will say, "yea, but I have Aimed Shot too, yadda yadda..." Maybe thats true, but if you put 41 points in BM, then you cannot get mortal shots...+30% damage to crits. And as I said, I nearly ALWAYS get one of my shots to crit.
Summary:
1) L2READ...or maybe you can read perfectly, in which case you need to work on expanding your vocabulary.
2) When MM hunters crit, they crit big...way bigger than BM hunters of similar gear/level.
You miscalculated the talents, yes, I have mortal shots as a BM, but I couldn't get it until lvl 65, but atleast I have it, all 5 points too.
Post by
Qlix
Maybe thats true, but if you put 41 points in BM, then you cannot get mortal shots...+30% damage to crits.
um... im pretty sure i have 41 points in the BM tree... and im pretty sure i have 5/5 Mortal Shots
Samba - Unanimous - Gnomeregan US
*shrugs*
maybe i really DONT know the BM tree after all... or know how to read for that matter...
Post by
xcrunr1647
Yup, I miscalculated. My mistake.
Post by
Sgtpain
IMO, you can still get enough out of the MM tree to really boost ranged attacks to make BM totally worth it. Scatter shot is the only thing I see in MM that appeals to me, but I just don't think its worth giving up BWI, intimidation, and serpent's swiftness and most of all, BM dps is not as dependant on mana as MM is, which, after 2.4, is a huge deal now.
Post by
Qlix
well... you can still get Scatter Shot and ONLY lose Beast Within... thats where the struggle comes into play...
ok... so its not a struggle 18 seconds of godliness wins out =)
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