The truth is, players are getting more used to some stuff. There are only that many new spells Blizzard can introduce in new content. The all-devastating Lightning Nova Loken casts is actually not a lot harder to avoid that Shade's Arcane Explosion. Why are people dying then? Timing. Loken doesn't give the luxury of time, not to mention that you could dispel the Slow off during Shade's spell, and relax next to the wall.Another interesting point. The reason why some fights are being dubbed "like Shade" or "like Maiden" is because TBC introduced a new set of boss spells and mechanics that became emblematic for certain spells (I doubt anyone done Kara will forget what to do when Vent explodes with "FLAME WREATH!"). A lot of the old world raiding, in my limited experience, was to simply outlive everything the boss throws at you. Poisons and diseases - get rid of them, or heal through. AoE - move. Heavy hits and adds - have a tank with enough health. In addition, a huge number of the players now were able to experience BC raiding, but not Vanila WoW - so BC is kind of a common language. In TBC some things changed - the whole raid group was required to pay attention to what's going on. Spam Renews during Zul'Jin's eagle phase and you will be taking insane amount of damage. Don't step in Maiden's Holy Ground and your tank might die, because you are taking a nap. And so on - there is the element of using some of the boss's abilities or encounter mechanics against the boss himself.In WotLK this idea is even further developed - the main focus of the game is no longer gear, but skills rather. Not a lot of skills, yes, but they are more important than having beaten certain benchmark in DPS, or hit points, or mana, or mp5, or whatever. That's probably why the game seems as easy as it does - old players have pretty good experience, reflexes, a "feel" of how the game goes, and since they no longer need to spend months to gear themselves for a certain place, and the skills are at hand, the place doesn't look as hard as back then when they had neither the skills, nor the gear.
Im kinda doing somehting like furoius 5 xcept its only 2 people, me an arcane mage and my friend a ret palyWe quest together then pug a random person and do an instance and almost never wipe. Its annoying when 3 people that are too low lvl to even use the gear that drops sometimes can just breeze through ulda/SM/RFD. And puging raids is just wierd imo
There are 2 pages of comments so I can't see if someone already made this point (it's 10, I am up in 7 hours). Remember Vigor? Rogue 31 point talent? It's now an 11 point talent. Shield Slam, warrior 31? Now all warriors have it. Pretty much the ONLY decent gear you could get was from raiding. There was no "BG for an hour a day for a week and get an epic." There were no quest rewards or instance drops comparable to MC gear. The game has gotten significantly easier on many sides. Talents are WAY more powerful, gear is WAY easier to get with more desirable rewards for all classes/specs easily achieved within 2 levels of hitting outland, and one of the vastly major changes is people can offtank, or offheal, or whatever. Pretty much unheard of. Holy/resto couldn't kill anything at 60, now they do decent damage. MS would have a hard time tanking an instance, but, if you watch your threat it's fine now.That's my opinion. The game is vastly easier from many sides. Players more powerful, gear more powerful, playstyles more viable to be group friendly.
Remember the first time you did BRD? Wasn't it horrible?Or UBRS with 15 members - what a mindstorm eh?I have a confession - I've only just done all of BRD now for the achievements :PBefore that I ran through uber quick with some guildies 3 and a half years ago to get MC attuned.
Who hasnt been a "noob" at some point. There is a thread circulating right now with ridiculous noobish moments of first playthroughs. New players isn't bad in itself, and the truly worthless new players that beg for gold or help, spam worthless crap in global, or grief don't stick around long and are replaced by new asshats so the chain is endless. On the other hand the good players that start and need to work through their noobishness stick around and in time may become the newest member of top server raiding guild.It's true that nothing you do will change Blizz, but I would argue that if you don't accept the flow to some point, you aren't going anywhere i.e. you quit WoW. You don't like the flow, but you accept that it's gonna nerf the crap out of your hunter because Blizz needs to break the 20 million mark by 2012(one of the signs of the Apocalypse)And I don't see how any new content is ever bad for anyone that pays a flat rate per month that never changes (surely I've just jinxed us). It's all in how you play the game. Personally I /spit on gold beggers and ignore.To come back to the point of the thread, I would love to do this and explore level appropriate content in vanilla WoW, the trick is finding others who want to do the same.And you're gonna be a true sad panda when the Pandaren is added as the new race in the next expac.
I can't help but feel that the solution to "too easy/too hard" problem is to have some servers with a "PvE hard mode" feature.I think it would also be possible to implement a "force scale down to dungeon" feature on hard mode servers, so that e.g. a level 80 entering Onyxia's Lair would become 60. Whether this would disable items requiring a higher level or just downscale them like the heirloom items could be decided.
Fraps them and give us links to YouTube or somewhere. Better yet, WeGame.
I've read a lot of peoples comments, and I see the argument going both ways. Personally, I think WoW is too easy now. Some people will say I'm a elitist jerk, but thats not true, seeing as how prebc I never even got to the upper level content. I think blizzard should let everyone experience this content in a way, but in the form of 10 man raids. Imo, 25 mans now are just as easy as 10 mans, which i see as very unfair. I think a person should be fully geared from 10 man naxx before being able to sustain the dps (or heals or whatever) of a easy 25 man like OS. This is how it was with bc raids, you needed almost full t4 before doing t5 raids, and how easy bosses of BT were easier than Lady Vashj. Basically, blizzard needs to keep heroics as hard as they are, keep 10 mans as they are, so ppl with greens can't do them, and make 25 mans WAY harder for the hardcore people. The difference between the gear should also be a little bigger imo.This is why i currently love the arena system, u can get hateful if you're good, allowing u to get the rating for deadly stuff, but its almost impossible to get the deadly gear without having hateful or other good epics.
I would say it has definitely gotten easier. When i get a pug and we go to Maraudon, Uldaman, or Sunken Temple (started over again after a one year break) it seems like everyone can basically go all out with a healer to pick up the slack whenever we start dip pass half life. Maybe it's different with higher raids. Don't get me wrong we've had wipes, but i think I've had two and it had nothing to do with the enemy being too strong (dc, afk, etc.). I wanted the full group experience where we all have to communicate, and the battle is actually hard...not just a run through for gear. Times just change i guess.
Talking about new spells, Mind Sear made it possible for Shadow Priests to solo clear not only all pre-TBC instances, but some TBC instances as well. As lvl 70 I had a really hard time soloing BRD. I had to drink almost after every pull and I wiped numerous times. I was geared in blues and Kara epics and it was good gear for starters. But SPs had no AoE spells (Holy Nova wasn't worth spending talent points in Holy tree in my opinion), so if a pull consisted of more than two mobs, you had to re-shield yourself numerous times.Now things are different. Last week I tried soloing Seth and I died twice. First time was because my PC crashed during the pull. Second time it was on a five mob pull just before Talon King Ikiss. And I believe I could have lived through it if only I pushed the buttons in the right order, but I don't feel like going again to check at the moment.I can't imagine myself trying to solo SFK for example at lvl 45. Maybe I should have tried, but I was busy doing other stuff in game. I was healing. Every instance from RFC to Ramps as shadow with no point in Holy. Heck, I was using Greater Heal till Mara when I decided to switch to a proper rank.The best experience I had as healer was in ST when a 5-man PUG suddenly transformed into a 3-man. Paladin as tank, rogue as DPS and shadow priest as healer. We did it all in four or so hours save for Shade of Eranikus who proved unbeatable with our lame damage dealing and we had to ask a lvl 60 to help us finish that nightmare. It was fun and hard. I was going OOM really fast and tank had to drop a heal or two on herself from time to time.Today I did heroic OK with guildies. We were at Elder Nadox and decided to pull him all way back to the entrance to make the fight easier (someone even got Respect Your Elders IIRC). So while we, DPS, were relaxing near the entrance to the instance, tank and healer were kiting boss to us. Healer was a bit slacking and got all the aggro from small adds and was torn apart. Thanks to him being Holy specced, we enjoyed 15 seconds of Spirit of Redemption. After that I popped out of shadowform and started dropping Flash Heals on a tank and two other DPS. Suddenly I realized that I'm not OOM, tank isn't dying and I can start using Greater Heal instead. I was at 9k mana when our healer came back to the instance after running and all of my CDs weren't used yet. I don't think that my ten or so epics only one of which has mp5 (Band of Neglected Pleas) had anything to do with me being able to heal and feel myself quite comfortable in lvl 80 heroic dungeon doing things I weren't doing for about forty five days worth of playtime. My past healing experience had nothing to do with that either. Things are just a bit dumbed down in my opinion.
i find that the problem with wow being too easy now a days as people call it, is that you can't spend as much time on it as you used to, of course in some way that is a good thing since you won't be in front of an computer all day, but seeing as some people WANT to use a little time playing a game and they want to be challenged it can be bothersome... im sure they could find a challenge in a lot of places but if they are playing wow my guess is that, that is were some of their intrest lie... i don't really have a solution to the problem just trying to say that people that want to put 3-4 hours in the game will have a lot of things done pretty fast... i don't see myself as an SUPER GAMER but i do spend time playing maybe more than other people and i find it bothersome that right now the only thing i can do on my main char is achievements and raids... all the single char and 5 man things is done and raids is only 3 times a week and i don't attend them all. there needs to be some blance in easy and hard... i myself like to belive they found that with pvp (at least for now) since you need rating to get the good stuff AND you need arena points so a guy that just goes to a BG and Afks can't get the same things as in TBC (it was getting rediciolus in TBC imo)
To all the people remarking how a handful of 80s can take down a level 60 40-man:You have to remember that players have MUCH more stamina now than they did at that point in the game's progression. Even a level 80 healing class can easily have over 4 times the hit points of a raid-geared tank at 60.
Try 3 manning instead of 5 manning to recapture the challenge. Using a healer, tank, and a single DPS will often uncover some of the difficulty in fights that is masked by high DPS groups. Two friends and I have completed every WotLK dungeon at its appropriate level and about half of the heroics so far using only instance gear, so its definitely doable. Good luck!