Sounds interesting, but I don't know how I feel about having to go back and clear bosses that no one needs normal loot from just for a chance at a Thunderforged item. Seems like more farming. Though I do suppose we'd be clearing bosses anyway, I'd be skeptical with a multi-raid version. Example, nobody needs anything any more from MSV, so no point in clearing it anymore. If this is applied to a raid tier down the line like the one we have presently, it could have guilds having to farm that teir's "MSV" for the chance at the Thunderforged loot.Now what I wouldn't mind is if the 25man version had a chance to drop items that are already valor upgraded.
What I don't understand is why they can't just let 25m drop an extra item, say 20% of the time? It seems fair, given the harder logistic challenge, yet doesn't progress them substantially over 10m. Aren't thunderforged items the same deal, except with a different color? The irony is that 25m raids are easier to do once logistics are handled, in that if one dps person dies, its not the end of a battle! In 10m, everyone has to preform their roles to near perfection, especially on heroic. I still don't get why they didn't do something like this for the last several years.
hey 25's, have some free extra loot because your raid leadership works hard and you all just show up and get better loot. totally fair..So what you're saying is, 10 man raids should get all the same loot and chance at loot as those who do 25 man raids despite 25s taking more coordination and effort? /boggle+1It's never been fair that 10-man and 25-man became considered equal. It's harder to coordinate a 25-man, it takes more effort and work and I'm 100% appreciative to have even this small advantage. However, it is just that... small. Both raid sizes will get it, rarely, it's just 25-man is going to get it slightly more often. It's not a game changer. It's not enough for 10-mans to start doing 25-man. This is exactly what they needed to allow current 25's to feel more comfortable continuing on that path while 10-man's can still be content with their current size.Sounds interesting, but I don't know how I feel about having to go back and clear bosses that no one needs normal loot from just for a chance at a Thunderforged item. Seems like more farming. Though I do suppose we'd be clearing bosses anyway, I'd be skeptical with a multi-raid version. Example, nobody needs anything any more from MSV, so no point in clearing it anymore. If this is applied to a raid tier down the line like the one we have presently, it could have guilds having to farm that teir's "MSV" for the chance at the Thunderforged loot.Now what I wouldn't mind is if the 25man version had a chance to drop items that are already valor upgraded.That is essentially what's happening. Thunderforged gear is basically already upgraded gear, they're giving both 10 and 25 the chance for it though. So, I'm not sure why you'd mind the current proposed change.
hey 25's, have some free extra loot because your raid leadership works hard and you all just show up and get better loot. totally fair..Ofc it's fair! It's 2.5 times more difficult to organize and lead the raids, kill bosses and so on.I'm personally for returning the higher ilvl for 25-man loot. It was much more fun raiding in 25-man, and I had more chances to raid actually. Nowadays, it's like 50/50...
You 25 suckers are just sick. Get a grip on yourself of try to use logic every now and then.Blizzard has screwed up twice now. In Vanilla, TBC and ICC. I sincerely hope they will not do it again.Do you really think that it's all about dropping to 10man to beat the content? 25s now are where they are supposed to be, and I am totally fine with this bone thrown to them - a higher chance of better loot. That's as much as they deserve. 25man raiding is an option that not only leader takes, but also players in general. It's called non-material excitement. Of course, we live in a material world, and people see 10man providing more rough value. But it's exactly as GC said:Like many players, we love the epic feeling that comes with banding together more massive groups to battle powerful foes25 will not die, because there will be people who prefer to play the way they want, not the way loot dictates. And this will just encourage them more. By no means is 25 supposed to be better, because 10man is easier and for good reason. You aren't going to be all like Method.Some players generally prefer 10man, because they do not feel fair in 25man. Be it a tight group of friends, or social anxiety disorder, like I have. Or even incapable PC. I hope Blizzard never babysits 25s like they did before, as this is what would ruin progress - it will change priority from raiding to reorganizing to raid.TL;DR: You want to raid 25? Then shut up and do it.As for the idea of thunderforged items themselves - it's bull*!@#. So what, now we have to re-enchant our items 5 times? Or maybe, like it was pointed out, choose between tier piece and ilvl? Watch as some RNG-asskissed bastards roll out in most thunderforged gear, while less lucky progress as intended? Never liked RNG. Or more loot priority concerns?Heroic is heroic. Hard mode is hard mode. Sha-touched weapon is sha-touched weapon. But a "wild thunderforged item appears" is bull^&*!.
I have an idea - pull an Ulduar and give the bosses hardmodes ( or "elite modes" as you call it ) and make the Thunderforged gear drop off those hardmodes.That's a good idea actually, and I like it a lot. But, it WOULD make you wonder, a tier set, or a Thunderforged item, which is a serious thing to ask yourself...
would be nice .... now its up to guild master to put a 25 man raid on calendar
"You’ll now see a 5.2 raid item of LFR quality at item level 502"wtf blizz... lfr gear 502 ilvl are you having a laugh basically your making msv and hof completely useless as lfr will be 10x easier and give just as good loot...
Maybe more people would do 25's if they didn't make that stupid decision to have 10 man and 25 man dungeons be an either/or affair. They don't need to go back to how it was in LK where it was different loot for both, but giving players the opportunity to run a REAL raid (not LFR) twice a week in two different situations (once in 10, once in 25) would mean players would have more to do, and, thus, more reason to keep their subscriptions up.Also, them saying not enough people do 25 man's is kinda their fault, seeing as how the reason they made 10 and 25 mans share the same lockout was because they didn't feel enough people were doing 25 man's.
Separate lockouts for 10 & 25 is and was a bad idea, it caused player burnout and boredom having to run the same stuff twice a week. Personally, and everyone will have a different opinion, I don't like this idea. There's already too much RNG in the game and its extremely infuriating at times, the other week I did 35 consecutive bosses in LFR on 2 chars before a piece of loot dropped for me, it sucks. Again, IMO, the only way to make 25 more attractive is to have completely different content. Like back in the TBC days, Karazhan and Maggy, Gruul etc, if you don't form a 25 group you don't get to access the content. It would take balls of steel from Blizz to go back to that model though.
I have an idea - pull an Ulduar and give the bosses hardmodes ( or "elite modes" as you call it ) and make the Thunderforged gear drop off those hardmodes.I think that's what "Elite" items are for. Might not be a bad idea, but yeah...still.
This will never be a true addition to make 25 mans more appreciated, it will only be an item which none will see realistic to obtain due to it's low drop chance in the extremely few bosses per raid Pandaria have and raiders simply carry on their raiding as usual, with no extra motivation. The one and only solution will always be to restore 25 man raiding to it's former glory: To always have a higher item level in loot over 10 man. It indeed is what it is, a simplified version of the raid and should never have been implanted in the first place.The only problem with 25 mans is u can have 2-4 players who suck and still clear bosses without problems but in 10 mans everyone has to have the same level of raid awareness to keep from wiping the raid.