Those of us with math skills learned the first few days that ´hey, there is a 1000 vp cap.. I am not going to be able to buy this gear even if I do open it up´.. And also the ´hey, i can only use 90 lesser charms per week.. do I really need 2000 of them in m backpack...There are two types of people who ground rep the first few weeks1. Players who felt it was worth it to have vanity items2. People with bad math skills.I did nothing but GL and tillers the first 3 weeks, and I guarantee you I bought just as many VP items as you.Mm... Those of us who actually raid or care about the game, and have some brain skills learned that it's important to not just buy things that you can afford asap, but to buy the necessary upgrade. They also learned that Lesser Charms are inteded to be used when you run out of dailies - yes, such times will be, and these people would want then do either less dailies(Dominance Offensive) or none at all, good rest. They also figured that valor cap and gear are only small part of dailies, and if you are actually doing them to get valor - you are playing your game wrong.As for daily thoughts themselves, I'd say:GL - no @#$%, mandatory. Not just as a "fan out" to top-end reputations, but as a requirement for things like recipes and proper serpents. And yes, it could've been cut short to at least two questhubs. Especially when you have farmed it for weeks and know that half of leftover achievements will make you grind daily randomly to see that the questhub you need does not spawn(much like Getting around with Shado-pan, needed questhub spawns once in 2 weeks).Also BiS free amulet is a big deal at start.Klaxxi - same mandatory. Gear, recipes, 463 weapons(precious at start for offspecs) and same BiS rings. Was a bit annoying, but with zone buffs - quite tolerable.Tillers/Anglers - personal preference. Tillers are everdoable for daily gold(don't mind spending 5 minutes on plants to earn 100-300g). Anglers' quests differ, but the reward is actually unique mount, plus fishing(although I believe it's possible to cap it while fishing for Master of Ways). Nat Pagle - for maniacs, you are welcome(fished for OCS, Master and other things - have found only one green quest fish).Order of CS - personal approvement. Don't want to do them - you are a scrub carebear, period. Grind 48 hours for eggs - maniac. Your choice, but flying a cloud serpent is a part of this expansion, and no dedicated person would skip this.Shado-pan - mostly tank\\title mandatory. Gear\\mounts\\replica - all is matter of carebear. Other trinkets also have valuable raid counterparts\\upgrades. But the only other(exlcuding buffed OP, yet useless Niuzao) stamina trinket avaible is the exact copy from MSV trash. Many tanks go for stamina now, as well as for BDKs these trinkets are BiS even over heroic trinkets, with only 1-2 fight exceptions. Also, those who want to get 2nd most prestigious title in the current content, Shado-master, need this faction topped off(good advice would be to turn in quests dismounted, will save you weeks after exalted).Celestials - pretty much useless to top off if you don't have gold for the serpent or Alani mount. Also quests are terribly diverse. Tiger? 5 min boss zerg, free rep. Crane\\Serpent? Fly the crap out of small area to pick up key targets, annoying but fast enough. Niuzao? Get overrun by endless respawning mantid, while trying to pick up things.Lorewalkers? Get TomTom...Unfortunately, there's no way to do Brawler's Guild as a healer or a tank. It's basically how badass of a dps you are at killing monsters.There goes my hope to steamroll it on bdk. Well, considering the difficulty of obtaining this piece of excrement, to think that my TH frost will have to compete with ret or bm... Good game fellas, good game...The ideas of the daily content is to always have something to do to progress your character.Then it will yet again be a Pandairia. You can do 40 dailies for a month. You can do 15 dailies for half a year. Take your pick. Maybe you will "always have stuff to do" in the latter case. Or you will get more time to do other staff in former. Doing other types of rep-grind is not a clear solution. It all comes down to either being zergable(tabard style), farmable(drops\\procs), daily(quests, items, dungeons). It's not just the daily factor - it's the factor of repeating the same thing over and over and over. You can't just talk yourself out of it, true, but thinking of ways to make it actually different... I think out of the 3 abovementioned types, the daily is still the most fair. Just don't just it quest-only. Bind it to some PvP(with and without farming, to give chance to people who both can and can not win the game for some reasons), bind to scenarios. To events that are half-quest, half-scenario(like descending the Thundering Halls). But well, game is playable either way, tolerable and enjoyable.
Greetings!Let's talk about : World PvP - please stop using that phrase for PVE zone where PVE ppl do daily quests, who have no interest in PVPING!What is the point of sucking up to pve ppl by letting them 'pvp' with mobs who happen to use class-specific abilities/spells which resembles 'real' players? is THIS WORLD PVP you're talking about? ( I'm fan of lore myself and i see where is this goin and its a nice try, but only a try, why? We already have pvp ppl willing to battle one another, so why then make up false pvp by adding all those npcs?)Personally, what i find illogical is this:1. u want to raise world PVP on higher lvl ; having good intentions is one thing...but doing so this way?2.then u make whole new PVE zone, where usually pve ppl compete( well no wonder! its all pve rewards and fights!)3.So what happens is that most of the ppl doing dailies are like: ah damn they're ganking again, i just want to do dailies and get away ( so in some cases it is rly easy to do so as u can get horde and alliance questing next to each other- is THIS WORLD PVP?)4.PvP players are not bothering with dailies etc. ( unless they're interested in storyline) and the only thing that organized pvp raids do then is spoil the other factions daily routine of pveing as there's rly no rewards to go after or anything. It is the SAME as any other DAILY quests PVE zone.So you've made a pve zone, with pve rewards, where pvp ppl SHOULD go and bother all those petty pve'ers who are questing and simply are ignoring you as they see you as a boring guy who has nothing else to do but bore others -.- Oh and when pvp guilds organize pvp raids, guess where WORLD PVP occurrs? WELL THE SERPENT WALL, WHERE PVP VENDORS AND PVP PPL ARE! Sry bout the caps, but i just had to emphasize the absurdity of this world pvp, which i, as a pvp player rly find a mockery, just for calling it world pvp.Conclusion: This exp is based on ally vs horde as it has been said countless times, ok so why not make some story progress through pvp? instead of this? Because if you're interested in story, any story around at all, even the one that concerns faction based fights where you have participated over the past years and nothing ever changes there, is pve based.
Greetings!Let's talk about : World PvP - please stop using that phrase for PVE zone where PVE ppl do daily quests, who have no interest in PVPING!What is the point of sucking up to pve ppl by letting them 'pvp' with mobs who happen to use class-specific abilities/spells which resembles 'real' players? is THIS WORLD PVP you're talking about? ( I'm fan of lore myself and i see where is this goin and its a nice try, but only a try, why? We already have pvp ppl willing to battle one another, so why then make up false pvp by adding all those npcs?)Personally, what i find illogical is this:1. u want to raise world PVP on higher lvl ; having good intentions is one thing...but doing so this way?2.then u make whole new PVE zone, where usually pve ppl compete( well no wonder! its all pve rewards and fights!)3.So what happens is that most of the ppl doing dailies are like: ah damn they're ganking again, i just want to do dailies and get away ( so in some cases it is rly easy to do so as u can get horde and alliance questing next to each other- is THIS WORLD PVP?)4.PvP players are not bothering with dailies etc. ( unless they're interested in storyline) and the only thing that organized pvp raids do then is spoil the other factions daily routine of pveing as there's rly no rewards to go after or anything. It is the SAME as any other DAILY quests PVE zone.So you've made a pve zone, with pve rewards, where pvp ppl SHOULD go and bother all those petty pve'ers who are questing and simply are ignoring you as they see you as a boring guy who has nothing else to do but bore others -.- Oh and when pvp guilds organize pvp raids, guess where WORLD PVP occurrs? WELL THE SERPENT WALL, WHERE PVP VENDORS AND PVP PPL ARE! Sry bout the caps, but i just had to emphasize the absurdity of this world pvp, which i, as a pvp player rly find a mockery, just for calling it world pvp.Conclusion: This exp is based on ally vs horde as it has been said countless times, ok so why not make some story progress through pvp? instead of this? Because if you're interested in story, any story around at all, even the one that concerns faction based fights where you have participated over the past years and nothing ever changes there, is pve based.Quoted for truth.However would like to add a few words. "Petty pvers", as you call people like me, are indeed petty. All we have to do is to kill some npcs to get reward. That does not include any challenge, loss or feel of defeat. Nor does it include any particular skill. PvP, however, requires to be ready to lose, learn and tolerate. To have skills or to be ganked. This is the reason me and "pvers" avoid PvP and call it boring. Do not mistake PvE for being skilless though, it's same difficulty to kill heroic boss as it is to win a ranked match. Everything follows strategy. Except for players that are "heroic" or either way "better" do not have a bg where they only spawn. They can "spawn" in the world. Also, rewards for both activities usually end up in epics\\vanities. And since most pvp epics are now as valuable in pve - pvers will go for any opportunity of an upgrade. If, however, all rewards will be tied solely to PvP - pvers will complain, as PvE was, is and will be major leading factor(for same reasons as I am stating). So it is easier to make another daily grind(which has actually nothing particulary PvE-ish), and to give players regardless of their occupation a chance to prove their skills through PvP. In one thing you are very right - there is no real benefit of PvP in the new zone. 11% more damage\\faster mounting\\graveyard for rare farming? Yeah, that makes you want to spend time there. The problem rises with the backside of PvP - ganking. Much like vandalism, insanity or slaughter - the mentality is the same. Killing for the sake of killing, because you can. It can not be changed, unfortunately, as it is the core of human's mind to compete and prove his balls whenever possible. The feeling of victory becomes a drug. PvP without ganking - is PvE. I've always dreamed of something like AV or IoC or WG - a massive zone, where players compete for common objective, yet there is no feeling like: you are going to get that item - bam, you are twoshotted; you meet enemy players, they outmatch you flawlessly as a premade\\outgeared\\outskilled opponents. It is impossible merely because either there will be no PvP - no way to rightfully win, or there will be no PvE - no point for it.What I am trying to say is - do not blame Blizzard. They are experimenting. Back in the days of vanilla, PvP and PvE were tied to questing zones, both activities were entwined. Now at the peak of remote PvP, PvE and Sanctuary capitals, this PvP loses it's point. Blizzard has attempted to bring it back - to give reason for players to fight for their routine things. Ganking can't be helped, and I have not seen in my life an actual PvP raid(FTH on horde-side server does not count). Even if this raid becomes mass ganking - blame the beastiness of organizers, but bear in mind that PvPers also need a raid. They are just same "petty pvpers" on that matter, and can only do what their skill implies.
Hello again :)Yeah about that, petty pvers, i admit it was in heat of the moment, rly didnt mean to offend any1's choice of enjoying the game but i guess i gave in to frustration :P It was only that, nothing else, i'm not one of those who's gonna talk about skills n stuff, 'skill' as some feat was not in the focus of my post and i wasn't referring to that when i said petty pvers. I guess i was frustrated cuz to me, errors from this were 2 damn obvious and was like, omg why is no1 pointing out the logical conclusion of clear distinction of pve/pvp.For me, pvp is this: you compete with ppl who want to compete with other ppl( yourself included) and not like, hey that guy is killing a npc, i'll kill both him and npc just cuz i can -.- well personally i dont find pleasure in that especially if its close to being totally effortless( like killing lower lvl etc.) so i rly can live without ganking. I do however help other who are being ganked and then that sort of world pvp makes more sense cuz not even then, if i organize smth i'm not like if its red its dead, its like beat those who started it and who are bothering the weak and move on :)And i've pvped since vanilla and i can tell u for sure that pvp isnt about ganking/camping ppl - thats just sadistic( especially when ppl like that compete who gets more rage whispers etc.)What i'm trying to say is, this way of renewing world pvp is promoting ganking, which i'm against as it gives me no pleasure molesting other ppl. And whats with all those battlegrounds? why not make an effort and make pvp zone with daily pvp related qs, like, kill 10 horde PLAYERS( and players only) in this zone and u'll get few gold coins and lets say...25 honor 3 conq points, whatever - just a banal example. So that way you would get what? pvp players competing! Would you go into a such zone? as a pver? I mean, At the end, the reason i made the first post was frustration, as the only mention of pvp for this long awaited patch was this new zone, which already ended as disappointment in the eyes of pvp - don't get me wrong, its rly nice pve zone, nice sotryline, i'm enjoying doing dailies there, but guess what, i'm going there with my pve char who is killing creeps faster oh and yeah, the other reason than storyline is the mount, why i'm after the rep and when i feel like pvping, i go to bgs, as i've always done cuz when there are not rbgs planned, i as pvper have nothing else to do :)So i dont know how much more experimenting you consider is needed in order for pvpers, to get, after 4 expansions something other than new bgs :P okok rated bgs are cool, but they are still bgs.The matter is quite simple, if we're talking about pvp, it by definition excludes pve and all its players. its not a matter of: hey thats ours u cant have it, its simple as, we want to compete with other ppl, if u dont want to do that, well then dont come to pvp zone/place/whatever! So no need to put pve and pvp fans together in any way. and if I want to fight over smth that is considered a routine, again, i want it to be competition and not molestation, meaning i dont want to fight ppl who are not here to fight other ppl! And we're back at start, where i'm abhorring new zone being called PvP zone - the reason i made the post AND the account for that matter only as i've found it pretty offensive and yes i'm not sorry for wanting it for once to totally exclude pve content or pve anything whatsoever even to a measure of requirements such as a certain percent of pvp power/ress or whatever :)
I think the daily system is fine. The only problem I see is that they give way too little rep to make significant progression. It´s your own choice to do all faction dailies or just the 2 that reward the items you want. But what feels wrong is that you put 10 - 30 mins doing dailies for a faction and then end up with a gain of 1000 rep... so it discourages ppl to think it will take them approximately 2 months to finally ride that mount they crave so bad (especially Shado-Pan since you need to grind Lotus first)Some grinds are a real pain (IMPO Klaxxi) so you prolly will get exalted with them once and be done with. But a little more XP wouldn't hurt. The Commendations are great, but I think they shoul stack to help alts a bit more. So if you have 2 alts at exalted they give 150% or 200% more XP. That way 3rd or beyond alts won't give you such a hard time choosing between getting the Valor Cap to improve your main's gear, or finally leveling/gearing that third alt.I would recommend lowering the item Upgrade prices a bit. I think 500 for Valor/Justice gear and 1000 for Honor gear would be fine due to Valor's cap and the time you have to put in to farm Honor and Justice. Conquest upgrades are fine. But please make another way of getting Justice Points avaliable, because after you gear up a character, sometimes you are so Fed up with Heroics that will only go back to them on a different alt. Maybe after getting the Valor cap, daily quests could give Justice instead. And also lowering a bit the gap between Honor and conquest gear, so players who only do BGs have a fighting chance to be relevant in PvP against arena players. Or maybe increasing the Conquest gain from BGs could help with this issue.
There's a lot worthy of comment here but let me first confine myself to the cooking/farming complex.I've said before and will do so again: If we wanted to play Farmville, we'd be playing Farmville. World of Warcraft is World of Warcraft. Trying to graft in other games (Farmville, Pokemon) in a frantic attempt to attract more players is doomed to failure because the people who play Farmville have a culture of superiority to those of us who play "killing things" games like WoW. Simultaneously, those of us who are into "killing things" find our version of Farmville a distraction especially given the many, varied and interesting story lines built into Pandaria.Some with memories as long as mine may recall the hype from Blizzard as Cataclysm was about to drop stating that they had "simplified" cooking. Essentially that meant fewer ingredients and no more Northern Spices. The most complex items were the Seafood Magnifique Feasts that required three types of fish. Now we have dishes and feasts that require a special "spice" (soy sauce, black pepper) only obtainable by using tokens and at least three other items that either cost tokens or require both the farm and farming or fishing or both. One expansion later we've dropped farther down the rabbit hole of complexity and left that vaunted "simplification" on a trash heap far, far behind us. What it all looks horribly like is a desperate attempt to make WoW's own Farmville relevant by forcing player into it and contradicting the designers own earlier imperatives in the process.As for the Ironpaw Tokens themselves, yes, they are fairly easy to obtain but they impose their own farming burden. One needs to fish up. raise or kill specific items for tokens in addition to the fishing and farming of both kinds one needs to do for the feasts. This takes more time from questing, raiding, dungeons, scenarios and real life than most of us can afford.Let me digress briefly on the feasts themselves. In Wrath and Cataclysm we had feasts that fed our parties. The party size was irrelevant. The feast fed the group regardless of size. Now we have feasts that feed raid parties of either ten or twenty-five with the latter requiring double the ingredients of the ten. There's a little economy to the twenty-five person feasts. Yet we also have forty-person World Bosses and no forty-person feast. Do the Sha of Anger or Galleon or the Darkmoon Rabbit and we burn through ten-person feasts pretty quickly. Yet I don't want another forty-person feast. Two size-specific feasts are one too many. We need a feast that feeds one's party regardless of size if only to conserve bag space and player time in farming (in both senses) up ingredients. Actually it seems a lot like this wasn't thought through very well.Manhandling Farmville into WoW hasn't been the best of ideas. Being able to raise Motes of Harmony and herbs for potions is nice but not as nice as having more and more frequent spawns. Offering alternative ways to Herbalism of obtaining Alchemy ingredients (e.g. fishing up Azshara's Veil) fills the same function as our Farmville clone and does it without a faction reputation grind that's exacerbated by adding multiple faction members. In short, we could have done very nicely without Farmville and having it required for cooking. The same ends could have easily been accomplished by creating a short (2-3 quest) daily chain at multiple points in the Valley of the Four Winds that rewarded us with a basket of ingredients such as pink turnips from Farmer X, carrots from Farmer Y, etc. Would that be more time consuming than fighting off hawks, vermin and various forms of weeds on as many as 10 or 12 plots while harvesting and planting crops? I'd bet it would be a wash.Halfhill and Sunsong Ranch are not so much a hub as a black hole. They are a chore rather than a game for those of us who feed our raid parties and a chore much more onerous than fishing up Lavascale Catfish ever was. Farmville has caused cooking to spin out of control in Pandaria. I hope it can be saved in a future expansion.
I appreciate the candidness of the interviewer, but strongly disagree. I would not have felt like dailies were mandatory IF I didn't need to finish them to learn recipes like the imperial silk bag or other enchants. Most of the rewards are gear and vanity items but when you include recipes that you can ONLY get from grinding dailies that MAKES it mandatory. If they had kept it all gear and vanity then I would buy his argument.Hit the nail on the head right there.I wasn't grinding rep for gear or vanity items... I was grinding rep for patterns and recipes that our guild needed for raiding (enchants specifically but also crafting gear for those key support positions to get us off to a less shakey start in raids). So yeah, it may not have been "intended" that dailies be an arduous grind, but that's what they were/are.
With this kind of daily questing system they manage to turn a game into a "job" Thank god i have one to be honest; so i dont need another especially at nights after i get home tired.I never though id stop playing wow but i simly dont want to anymore so im kinda lost in mist :) Doing the same think everyday = daily quest =slow and painfull way of death to a mmo imo It was supposed to be made with friends not other way around.Man even the opposite factions dont bother to kill each other to just get it over with .( gang parties excluded)Its wrong what is happening to the game and they will understand it soon hope not too late...The spell effects have became too tiring for melee toons i think too :)
He need a new job if you ask me. Welcome to Mist of Dailys!I would love to see people like you vanish off of the game.
Personally, I'm glad they got rid of the 25 daily limit. That allowed me to grind rep with all the factions, that I could, in the same day without having to choose one faction over the other as the Golden Lotus used up 10+ dailys if you took all the dailys from them you could. It took me almost two months to get revered with most of the factions doing that, but I'd probably still be grinding rep for most of the factions if I could only do 25 dailys per day. I did the grind mainly for the enchants and patterns the factions had. I'm also buying the VP pieces from them, but the enchants and patterns have no counterpart within any dungeons or raids. What made the dailys so much of a grind was the combination of low rep gains from the dailys for some factions and having to grind your way to revered with the Golden Lotus before even attempting to raise your rep with the Shado-Pan and the August Celestials. That just meant I knew that once I got revered with the Golden Lotus, I still had weeks to months to get to revered with the Shado-Pan and August celestials.Thankfully I'm down to just grinding rep for the Shado-Pan and the Dominance Offensive.
I see they mentioned the Warlock-specific quests, and wondered if they're gonna do this for other classes aswell? I would love if the end-reward would be an item with, say 2 charges, that copies a legendary item and makes it into an epic, thus making it transmogable. Something else that's pretty epic would be nice aswell... Anyway, if they're gonna really make a questline for an awesome item in the end, I feel they should make the quests actually difficult, meaning that you'd have to combine PvE damage with PvP cunning. Secondly, the start of the questline should be a BoP item, thus not being able to access by everyone, and let it be a drop from (even though I havn't tried it yet) the last opponent in the Brawler's Guild. Make it a chain that requires time to master, and skill to overcome attacks. Basically, make people die repeatedly...
It's not being bad at maths that is the case for most people. For me, I grinded the reputation for several weeks in suspension because I felt it necessary - that I had to grind hopelessly for better gear, as it was the only way to improve your gear substantially at launch. And not to talk about reputation needs. Revered with Golden Lotus to unlock several other factions, that means even more grinding!Now, this is of course a personal mindset. I stopped doing dailies permanently a couple of weeks ago, and i feel that starting doing them again is pointless as too many weeks have passed. :PNot to be rude, but that is what I meant by math skills. You can ONLY earn 1000 VP per week... so if you quested through DW, then you already had an item available and needed to wait 2 weeks to earn the VP to buy it. You then had those two weeks and another week to get Golden Lotus to honored to buy the GL honored item.. So basically, after three weeks of playing, you had 3000 VP, Klaxxi (already at honored) and only had to get GL to honored.If you had ONLY done GL every day, you would have had them easily to revered in those 3 weeks, which opens up another 3000 VP or items to buy ( that you don´t have the vp for anyway).I promise, if you quested through DW 84-85, and only did GL dailies, you would have had penty of items available to buy.. and would have been starved for VP. Once you had GL to Revered, then you pick either SP or AC.. again, only doing 1 faction per day you would never have enough VP to buy the things available.
2. People with bad math skills.Average math skills telling me that doing anything is pointless. For example I have 2 casters 90 (priest and warlock) and scribe DK level 80. It seems I need those BoA staves for my casters from inscription, for that I should level DK and grind hard BoP mats like several months. Those casters will be AFK all this time, they can get already better in time when staves will be ready. Having 11 alts I'm sure staves will be ready somewhere near 6.0 patch. Same problems with everything.
Am I the only one who's not really jazzed about having more story confined to scenarios? I've ony done a few scenarios, and it's basically BAM in there with some teenagers who killkillkillkillkill, don't read anything, don't stop and think of the story just killkillkill get my lewt and leave the party. Sure you can repeat them but so what? Okay, I'm one of those weirdos who like to sit back and read the quests and think about the story. I went back when I was level 80 and did the quests to open the AQ gates for no reason other than to just slowly absorb the story of it. I think if it's story it should be solo content because how can you enjoy it when everybody doesn't want to go the same speed?