I think people are underestimating how much just separating the lockouts will do. If you don't have to choose between one or the other, then the fastest way to gear is to do both.
I guess this is a test. If it can help 25 man guilds in KR, they will hopefully bring it to US/EU realms in the future.I just don't understand why they don't just go ahead and test it everywhere... for the time being, any KR Heroic Boss Kill won't mean anything in the World First race.
please god, not a return of Wrath style raiding, i really don't want to have to pug 25 mans to stay competitive again.
Not a too bad idea. in essence it gives 25 man guilds a 3rd roll on gear. Not too bad of an incentive for guilds trying to catch up before new content and allows more flexibility in getting ppl geared for secondary specs etc.
I say do it everywhere, making 10 and 25 man the same difficulty is near impossible imho. As quite possibly part of the last 25 man horde raiding guild on my server, this would be a great boost for us. However, I think those who optimize for the best, to be the best, will follow whatever rules/system the devs make. I still want to know who they were making happy with the same lockout idea. In a guild of 40-60 active members everyone hated it or was neutral. No one was overjoyed about it.
What the hell are they thinking...
Thinking about it, I think the same lockout idea was an attempt to make everyone happy. A noble but foolish attempt, in the end most people most people will complain and then the same exact people will complain that the compromise blizzard came up makes them mad too. To keep the game running this long, I trust they will make the right decision to keep the game going, even though it may make some people unhappy.
Now raiders will have to run every raid twice weekly in order to gear up.Blizzard bringing the daily grind to raids? Fastest way to kill your userbase. Force everyone to go 'hardcore' and spend all day playing this game. Don't feel like it? Well in the time you weren't grinding something, someone else got 10 more ilvls and is going to replace you in the raid. Bbye.I can't even argue against this @#$% anymore. When their whole point is to insist people play their game all day, and you'd like to have the option not to, it's... gah.
15 man would be way more viable
@ VigoorShafted in legendaries by length fo time it takes in 25 vs 10? I always hate that terrible argument. in fact, in firelands, it was MORE efficent to make legendaries in 2 10 mans than it was to work on 1 at a time in 25 man. You miss the point that the ratio of players being greater in 25 man means it'ss upposed to be fater, but they don't usually make it 2.5x faster they make it like 2x faster. We completed staffs for most of our casters in 10 man mode despite being 25 raiders because it meant doing WEEKS less of firelands.so tell me, you think it's a problem if a 10 man with only 5 maybe 6 dps takes just as long as a 25 man with 17-19 dps to make staffs or daggers or whatever? getting a staff in a 10 man was a much bigger dps increase for the RAID than it was for a single staff in 25 man. It's all logistics and if you don't see the larger picture and instead only look ag the INDIVUAL gain then you don't know much about raiding.
I dont know what the perfect raid situation would be, I like both 25 and 10 man for various results, 10's are great with my guild, but 25 can be fun with server pugs. I have to say that it is rough for me to see them giving the gold farming regions of the world benefits like this though as it is widely agreed that there are issues with the raid situation (tell me being able to hit two raids a week is not beneficial) that they wont provide to us. I have seen a number of threads in English, since I cant read Korean, mentioning how dissapointed people are with the raid situation, (so much so that apparently Blizz decided they needed to change stuff), but they choose not to change our situation. Seems wrong to me. Just my opinion.
I don't see why people want this to happen. Most people complain that they HAVE to do LFR and normal raids to stay competitive...Yet you want to do LFR, 10 AND 25 to stay competitive?Double standards, the WoW community is full of them.
I've always felt that they should be separate. You should be able to do both and we always enjoyed doing that. Having a slight advantage for 25-man just makes sense. It takes more work to run a 25-man, it takes more recruitment time and there are a lot more people to manage and count on to show up than 10-man. Our guild has always been 25-man and right this moment we're struggling with maintaining 25-people. So much so that we've considered switching to 10-man permanently even though it's not our desired raid size.I truly hope they return to the previous ways...
why the hell just KR? i say all or none
They need to just end this nonsense and knock all raiding down to 15. There are very vocal people on both sides, and no matter what Blizzard does with this situation, they will have 20-30% of all raiders hating it.If they make this change, expect to see just as vocal of people saying ´omg, I am forced to do the same raid 3 times every week to be competitive´. You are also going to have a crapload of 10 man guilds (ie that Norwegian guild) that cannot fill a competitive 25 man team that will complain. The problem now is that if you want to be a competitive 10 man guild, you are going to have to pug in up to 15 extra people.Blizzard´s mistake in BC was creating this mess instead of just reducing it down to one size and end all the drama. When you have a choice, one size is always going to be prefered, but people are going to be forced to do the other size unless they share a lockout. I really think this is either a bug, or only half the story and something else will be changed at the same time. Just way too much drama will come from 10 man guilds who get beat for server firsts by 25 man guilds doing 10 mans.
This is pretty terrible, I have no wish to see my nice 10-man guild tear itself apart trying to get enough players to go 25.
I'm glad that this, like the shorter lockouts, is unlikely to be implemented in the States. I vastly prefer 10 to 25, and I agree with the folks who point out that there seems to be a bit more room for any individual's error in 25. No reason to make 10-gear inferior and put pressure on teams to try to run a 25 as well.
This is pretty terrible, I have no wish to see my nice 10-man guild tear itself apart trying to get enough players to go 25.It wouldn't be necessary, though 25-man guilds will be able to gear twice as fast as normal.I'm sure they'll think of some ways to balance this out, but while there are problems with separating the lockout, I think I prefer it given logic like "more is good" and so on.
I'm curious at the choice to put this on KR realms first. It's not surprising when a foreign company introduces new things outside of the US first, but to see a US-based company do it is strange. I wonder what the team is getting at. It's not like the US community hasn't been vocal about this issue. Perhaps it shows some dichotomy between the playerbase of countries. Is the US playerbase considered "casual" compared to other countries? If so, I feel strange that the team would feed into that by treating us as casuals. Perhaps they're treating KR like a less important testing ground where it doesn't matter as much if something doesn't work? Maybe another reason. But I see this as strange.
I see it as a good thing if it goes through, always pushed prog in 10 mans but if we could run 25 man as well could get less geared people up to par more easily and have several groups progressing in 10m at the same time.