I personally don't think non-current raids should stop awarding VP.Keep in mind that at launch a raid is tuned for a group wearing the previous tier's gear. For example 10 toons in full ilvl 232 epics should do just fine for the first 4 ICC-10 bosses. There isn't really a reason to give VP to players running previous tier raids. Any group in full 232s could kill a few ICC bosses and start accumulating gear/frosts, though more slowly than the folks who clear the place in two lockouts.How about a method similar to the current arena model. Using T13 as an example: Get T13 for full VP cost, T12 at discounted VP cost, and T11 at JP cost.Keeping the currencies separate creates a scenario in which if you have the current tier's gear on, you must have been in current tier raids. While I don't really care, I am inclined to think that the "hardcore club" who wants epic gear to be EPIC whould go into convulsions if this was not the case. Arena is not really as much about progression as PvE the only reason PvP gear scales at all is to prevent raiders from coming in and dominating. Gear is not really the important factor in keeping the "bads" (like me) out of the arena, fear of total humiliation is pretty effectively keeping us out ;-)
I personally don't think non-current raids should stop awarding VP.Keep in mind that at launch a raid is tuned for a group wearing the previous tier's gear. For example 10 toons in full ilvl 232 epics should do just fine for the first 4 ICC-10 bosses. There isn't really a reason to give VP to players running previous tier raids. Any group in full 232s could kill a few ICC bosses and start accumulating gear/frosts, though more slowly than the folks who clear the place in two lockouts.Agreed, but assume for a second that potentially not everyone in the raid is full-232, or that they're having issues for other reasons. I'm not suggesting that they should not even have to do the current raid, but allowing non-current tiers (maybe not 2-3 tiers back, however) to continue to drop raid emblems could help save time if it's a fresher toon (character switch due to guild needs, perhaps) or if you're very unlucky with drops (yay still have my reg-HoR shield.)It should drop noticeably fewer Points than the current raid, yet award points more quickly than your daily heroics. When you consider that it is, indeed (with a very long time frame) to attain all frost gear purely from heroics, it's not completely unreasonable that a person with enough initiative could run, for the sake of comparison, Ulduar or ToC to continue to acquire drops that they need, and be awarded a fair amount of VP in the process.
sorry... the more I read about this expansion ... the more it turns my stomach people want loot yes... but I will be honest with you.... I would rather have my loot and NOT spend a freaking lifetime getting it... .. making the gear crap like the pvp point system is by far the lamest thing ever. honestly could care less if I get flamed for this ... I only made a account to voice my opinion.I been playing for almost 4 years and I had quit for a bit cause all the elitist asshats in BC meaning if you were not in one of the top tier guilds. you got nothing ...went nowhere... "yeah blizz let's go back to them days" NOT.. then WOTLK came out ... I don't care what you people say.. you all loved getting gear the easier the better just look at the idiots skipping boss's in heroics people wanna play a game not have a second job.yet, that is just where Blizzard is taking this back to BC Elitist crap.. well.. I wont have to worry about it... and before you start ripping on me ... go check out youtube and forums on other wow sites... I am not alone in this... they are shooting themselves in the foot for a quick buck. screw em. I'm done =) /rant off
Um. You clearly don't understand the new emblem system. It works exactly as it does. Right now. Except instead of introducing a new type of emblem every patch, it downgrades your raid emblems and puts the previous Tier onto the lower points-system.
yes I do understand it ..what I am saying and I guess you did not understand me... why try and reinvent the wheel ? the badge system works fine.. and I cannot pinpoint one thing in particular that sets me off more... it is mostly all of it I think. I dont like the idea of fricking points for kills I like 2 see something... and badges do that for me.it was like having currency...now we just have "points" yay... I can see it now... instead of whats you lame GS ... it will be how many points you have /sigh one of the reasons I don't really pvp anymore as well. I can understand change.... I have seen it many times here in the game but, what I dislike is whole game changing events the skill tree, the skills, gear the list can go on and on... how can they make it so everybody is on level play ground gear wise then turn around and say... "well.... nvm were going back to the elitist crap from BC" meh...
Um again. The point system seems to me to be identical to the badge system, only Blizz won't have to implement a new vendor every time more gear comes out and have a half dozen unused badges floating around. People will be unlikely to be asking about your Justice points, just as they don't tend to ask about how many Triumph Badges you have on you.Plus it means less demand for descriptors. We won't be sitting at level 100 with useless Badges of Justice, Heroism, Valor, Conquest, Triumph, Frost, Fire, Earth, Wind, Water, Achievement, Accolade, Determination, Endurance, Temerity, Mettle, Spunk, Élan, Chutzpa, and Bloody-mindedness...(Sonuva, I finally got my last Badge of Chutzpa!, Give me an hour exchanging and I'll turn them in for Badges of Heroism to get some old school BoA gear!)Badges or Emblems are like the gold dollars of the US, rather pointless to try to keep minting when everyone uses a credit card. Cat's just giving your characters direct deposit.
I'm not sure how I really feel about this. I'm still getting my ass beat in ICC and in a couple months when I'm level 81 I won't even being doing ICC anymore even though ICC25 will still be harder than the Cat Heroics I'll be doing? I guess I would have had to been there durring the switch from BC to WoTLK to understand how the progression from one expansion to another works/feels.
like I thought... this is really the wrong place to try and get anybody to understand where I am coming from. lol seems to be a pro blizzard cant do anything wrong forum =DI need 2 find a blizz constantly fooks up forum =D
So you understand that it will work identically to the way it does now...you're upset because it's points instead of emblems? You know it will look the same in your currency tab, except with higher numbers?I'm sorry, but...it kind of just sounds like you're complaining for the sake of it. It's basically zero change from how it is now.
To the person who said that WotlK raids will be harder than Cata dungeons;Very, very not true.Because guess what?In Cataclysm, the higher your level and the mobs you choose to kill, the higher the damage output.Their damage is being increased by 200% at...level...something.Essentially,There will no longer be the 'omg ur gaiz take 4evR on dis dunjinz, i just want mai BADGEZ k? god u gaiz r so slow /ragequit CUZ UR LAEM.'Since In a dungeon, there are elites. And elities have dramatically increased healthpools and damage tables. With Cata, every mob in existence is getting a whopping damage bonus. Making it nigh impossible to solo quests, group quests, and dungeons will have to be run at a relaxed pace.What with the uh...dramatic pressure put on someone to be both patient and intelligent.
so what will the convershion prices be for wrath gear? As I'm not planning on getting Cat till I finnish ICC and get my Shadowmorn.
hehe, I read your posts and think of ee cummings. Very good for poetry, not very good for making an argument though.We aren't a "Blizzard is God and therefore must not be spoken ill of" forum, we just don't understand why you seem to be dead-set against a system, that works exactly as the current one does now. The only difference is there will only be two main vendors with changing vendor lists instead of our current five vendors and the degradation of emblems in order to buy items with lower level points.JP/VP are just as arbitrary as EoF, EoT, EoC, EoV, EoH, and BoJ. Hell, they're just as arbitrary as Honor/Arena Points and gold, silver, and copper.It makes more sense to me that Orgrimmar/Stormwind/whoever has a bounty on these bosses and awards you this currency to buy items from a special quartermaster, than the emblem system, especially when bosses used to physically drop the emblems. "Points" is a word. It's still a currency.Also, if you want a "blizz constantly fooks up" forum. Try the O-Boards.Also:These forums are English only. This also means you need to keep up a certain standard of grammar and spelling—we know not everyone around here is a native English speaker, but if your post is unreadable it will be deleted.This isn't a free pass for people to be grammar Nazis, but I take it to mean that a certain amount of effort is expected on the poster to try and use proper grammar.
So you understand that it will work identically to the way it does now...you're upset because it's points instead of emblems? You know it will look the same in your currency tab, except with higher numbers?I'm sorry, but...it kind of just sounds like you're complaining for the sake of it. It's basically zero change from how it is now.Varaconn, that is not true. not at all. you must have missed something reading about it.or just over looked it.it was not just the points I was upset about.."quote"It’s important to note that once you outgrow content, by leveling past it by a predetermined amount, you’ll no longer gain points. The ‘outgrown’ level for end-game Wrath of the Lich King content is likely to be level 81so what incentive at all would you have too help lower guild mates out. except a repair bill. like now icc 10 and icc 25 I really don't need anything except 25 man wrist from rott bloodsunders bracers but I still get badges. now according to this I wont get jp or w/e saying sorry your 81 now just go help them for the sake of helping them that is not cool.sorry if all you saw from me was "badges" like I stated there is much that is not good IMO ... I state IMO because that is all it is ... my opinion. if you like what they are doing great. I hold nothing bad with people that like this. why because it is their opinion.
Uh...what?Badges of Justice would be just as useless to 85s as no JP.Emblems of Triumph would be just as useless to 85s as no JP.Emblems of Frost would be just as useless to 85s as no JP.There is no way Blizzard would let 85s ROFL-stomp lower dungeons/raids to get gear that's good for them.so what incentive at all would you have too help lower guild mates out. except a repair bill. like now icc 10 and icc 25 I really don't need anything except 25 man wrist from rott bloodsunders bracers but I still get badges. now according to this I wont get jp or w/e saying sorry your 81 now just go help them for the sake of helping them that is not cool.This is just...wrong. First of all, in 4.0.1 you'll be saved to bosses. You won't be able to do 12/12 ICC twice a week, but if you could you'd still get points for both. Second, if you are doing Wrath content at Cataclysm levels, you are doing it horribly, horribly wrong. The gear you get from the first quests is, from what I hear, at worst, equivalent to ICC gear. Third, if you need "gear money" as an incentive to help someone, you aren't really their friend.
so what incentive at all would you have too help lower guild mates out. except a repair bill. You never said a thing about incentives in your previous posts, so I didn't overlook anything, you just didn't mention it. I'll just go with it anyway, however...Your analogy isn't appropriate. Right now, you go do ICC25 because you need bracers, but you also get badges. You say that, with the new system, in this situation you wouldn't get points. This is incorrect. You will still continue to get points. They only time you will stop getting points from ICC is when you hit (presumably) level 81 and move on past WoTLK content. Then, by assumption, you'll stop getting points from Cataclysm raids once you're level 86.What incentive do you have to help low-level friends, right now? If you do BC instances, yes you get a badge of Justice, but technically, that badge serves no purpose for you. So what difference does it make if you get a (near) useless badge, or nothing? I appreciate the more "discussing" tone this post had. Don't take it the wrong way, I'm not trying to belittle you or shoot you off because I'm "a Blizzard fanboy, they can do no wrong." I genuinely think you've misunderstood the intricacies and limits of the system, and I'm trying to demonstrate how it works, so that you don't dislike something for no reason.
I personally don't think non-current raids should stop awarding VP.this^... and then some:Award should depend on amount of effort spent to obtain it. It is really that simple. It makes the game more enjoyable.Currently, why should I run ToC10 (relatively hard) when I can get lvl 245 pieces by doing numbingly easy Heroic 5-mans.Why does a much more difficult content award much less than stupidly easy content?Are cata heroics gonna be as hard as cata raids? Please Blizz, do not make older tier raids useless again.
Byte1;In all fairness,I was entirely and thoroughly convinced you were trolling.What with the 'must find blizzard does nothing but eff up forum' comment.You left us with nothing else to think.And, don't trolls also make accounts simply for the sake of comments that are both horribly spelled, poorly articulated, and an unintelligible mass of 'this right here sucks ass, let's all insult it, without any real functioning reasons as to why!'? Point made.Simply because you chose to, switch from 'noobspeak' to proper english it does not excuse or dismiss your previous posts.Which were the only reason I chose to reply/Disagreeing with Blizzard is one thing.But a very obvious attempt at troll is another.Feel free to disagree, Byte1. But if you do not wish to be viewed as a comment-troll, please take the time to, or at least attempt to spell your words properly. And at the very least...give a decent and functioning reason as to why you feel so strongly.
like I thought... this is really the wrong place to try and get anybody to understand where I am coming from. lol seems to be a pro blizzard cant do anything wrong forum =DI need 2 find a blizz constantly fooks up forum =DAfter reading everything else you posted..Yeah. Sounds like trolling. You're getting other people to argue against you.You know what you're doing. Don't lie.If you don't like it, cool. Make a forum and talk there. Keep this place clean.
Im guessing valor items are going to sky rocket in price? Or they staying the same?
Emblem of Valor items? Not really sure sense Emblems of Valor are becoming gold.