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Is LFD/LFR making worse future players?

Post by Arganonbob

Someone asked in trade where a good place to find silk was other than eastern plaguelands so I popped over here looked it up and suggested to him/her to try running dungeons for that level like scarlet monastery or ulduman.
To my disbelief he replied with "I don't think that will work I'm 81 and those are low level dungeons." I thought I was being trolled but was patient and explained how you can run to any dungeon and walk in and the LFD tool is for stuff at your level. He acted surprised and asked where the dungeon was so I explained and left him to his adventures. Later he /w me again saying that he didnt get much silk and got killed by a level 90 deathguard.
When these features were released I was all in since I'm a casual player with just my two younger brothers that I play with consistently. It was a pain to find full groups and get to a dungeon but I learned my way around the map and understood from the quests why we were killing these bosses.
Now I'm not saying remove LFR/LFD or anything like that. I'm saying I am astounded by what I witnessed and really hope its not going to become the norm. I knew these would dumb down the process but I never ever thought it would have such an impact on people truly new to the game. Honestly I really hope I was being messed with.

Post by Adamsm

Has nothing to do with them; there are a lot of players who don't know about sites like this one to help them navigate the world.

Post by Nynaeve

The only way I see LFD/LFR being a deterrent towards making new players "good" players is the whole absolute silence no one talking and "GOGOGOGOGOGO" mentalities. They only serve to scare new players, making them less likely to ask questions or attempt to contribute to strategies.
If we don't start helping people out, as a community, and leading them to helpful sites, explaining things, or god forbid asking if everyone is ready and/or explaining strats, we will be only making this game (and the community) worse for ourselves.
Just my 2 copper.

Post by Jkpman

I knew these would dumb down the process but I never ever thought it would have such an impact on people truly new to the game. Honestly I really hope I was being messed with.

Many of us played without LFG, so it's easy to condemn those who have never known a time when you were forced to make it to the entrance on foot.

I recall myself doing some pretty dumb/noobish things back when I started, It's part of the learning curve.
The player base back then were just as unhelpful, with the same number of people genuinely willing to help with questions.

The only thing that does surprise me somewhat is how few people bother to use Google when they are stuck with something.

Has nothing to do with them; there are a lot of players who don't know about sites like this one to help them navigate the world.

And again they could spend a few mins on Google and be hard pushed not to discover Wowhead or Throtbot or at the very least a site that links to either.
Again I don't see why they wouldn't, You'd go to Google if you wanted to know anything else.

Post by pikeyboy

Well, all you can do is what you did. Finding dungeons can be time consuming, and sometimes an absolute pain, especially if you have to run there instead of flying. Blackrock. I hated that. Falling off the chain bridge time after time... Finding the entrance to Kharazan... Scarlet Monastery is fairly hard to find, and takes a while to get to. However, once you've found it, it's easy. You just need the attention span to run for a few minutes. So he got killed by a 90 Deathguard? Next time be aware of the aggro range. That's how we all learn.

Post by Arganonbob

I'm definitely not condemning new people for being new. I have been that clueless person a lot in my time with this game.
My post was more of a gut reaction than anything. Reading it over again I can see that maybe I'm a little to removed from the first time experience to remember how easy it is to miss things in such a large environment.
However, I do feel like the game as a whole doesn't do as good a job of explaining itself now and has lost some of the feeling of achievement. For example I started playing in WoLTK just before ulduar release. I wasn't really a competent player till after Icecrown released. My brother and I were ecstatic that we were able to get geared/skilled enough to get past the airship in a trade pug. Our stated goal to each other was to participate in endgame content at level and we succeeded in that which felt great. Now I've done all the LFR and seen all the story but I don't feel like I've done anything. My gear is maxed out for the level of play I choose to do and I don't expect better gear without putting in the time/work for normal+ raiding.
In short I've seen more content than I ever could have dreamed of before LFD/LFR but it has not been nearly as exciting or enjoyable as it was to get 1/3 of the way through Icecrown at level. Having said that though I'd never go back to that time without the access these tools give.

Post by Ferrair

i think LFR just makes players who do lower dps than they should feel like its normal.

most people also dont know their class, and thanks to the 90 boost, its worse.

i got a lot of flak as a fresh 90 doing LFR pulling 40-50k dps. but that generally improved and im now doing 130k on average with 531 ilvl. could be better i think, but i generally dont care anymore since anything above 100k is considered good nowadays.

with the boosted 90s and LFR, doing 50k dps is the norm now, even with 500 ilvl, wtf? gemming/reforging, what are these even for, people dont even use them now.

i know its just LFR but it should be a "lesson" on how to gear, mechanics to a fight etc. etc.

not wear crap gear to get ilvl up and tunnel boss....

Post by Adamsm

not wear crap gear to get ilvl up and tunnel boss....

Why not? That's existed since Gearscore after all.

Post by Zakkhar

Bad players arent created by anything. Bad players just exist.
LFR just gives them a place to express themselves.

Post by Maurvyn

I think ultimately what we see is a microcosm of just people.
In game or out of game, some people will take it upon themselves to research and learn and do things for themselves or figure things out.
Some people you can spoon feed information, attach it to a baseball bat and beat it into their skulls, and they still won't comprehend.

Post by Axehilt

Well unless you flawlessly did the rotation of every char you ever played and never once ran into a mob much higher level than you, it doesn't sound like this guy is doing anything you didn't do while learning the game.

LFD/LFR eliminates an unnecessary and shallow inconvenience. That's the main purpose and it does it well. Being forced to manually create groups and walk there didn't make you a better player, it was just a waste of time. I'd much rather games be about dense decision-making than big empty timesinks.

The only legit criticism against LFD/LFR is that they bypass the typical socializing (talking with people to form a group) that happened which (even though it wasn't by much) was enough to reduce some of the bickering in groups.

Post by Yezea

Bypassing already easy Boss mechanics to grant loot to players not even able to read a guide, or maintain to stay focussed for longer than 30 seconds on evading ground abilitys - thats LFR how i see it atm.

Is LFD/LFR making worse future players?

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