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Leveling demo lock/low level pvp

Post by Bucknastycow

My main is a moonkin, but as I prefer pvp and don't like healing, I'm leveling a lock since they usually have at least one viable pvp dps spec and I recently took an interest in demonology. anyway, my lock is level 22 atm and I'm trying to have fun while leveling because I enjoy low lvl bgs. I have no heirlooms but I've been doing pretty well with my dungeon blues. However, I'm new to the warlock class and could use some advice about demo pvp at lower levels (and a bit of advice on pve rotation would be nice too).

http://www.wowhead.com/talent#IZcr is my spec right now. I know it's a bit early for spec to matter too much as there aren't too many powerful options at the moment, but I was a bit unsure about the points in demonic rebirth. I took them instead of master summoner or mana feed because in bgs I usually don't live long enough to oom unless i'm being healed in which case i can life tap anyway. I didn't take demonic aegis because my self-healing doesn't seem to be much of a factor yet. I was considering demonic embrace, but my hp is still so low that it doesn't provide much of an increase.

also, what do you think are the best glyphs to get at lvl 25 for demo pvp? I was thinking maybe legion strike or corruption for prime.

should i be using bane of doom in bgs and if so in what situation should i use it instead of boa?

also, what would you be using your soulburns on? Drain life is one of my few ways of healing so far, but even soulburned its quite weak. I've been using my shards for rezzing my felguard and for the searing pain autocrits, even though they don't hit very hard. should i use soul burn + healthstone?

what is the highest priority dot? I have been using boa first on people usually, but corruption seems to do damage faster initially. I often try to nuke with shadowbolt when I have the chance, because it's the hardest hitting spell I have, but it's quite a long cast to pull off in pvp. Is it worth it to nuke with searing pain outside of the guaranteed crits, because of the shorter cast time? Which is faster dps, sb or sp spam?

Do you have any strategies on putting out some good burst? I feel that i do damage pretty fast when all dots are up and fg is hitting, but it's nothing to the burst some other classes can put out at this level.

any suggestions on beating hunters? the twinks just blow me up so there's not much of a chance unless they're distracted, but i might have a shot against the ones without heirlooms or much skill. I usually try to hang out of range or los and send my fg in on them. when my fg is on him i run into range and dot him. then i start taking damage fast and i try to get a fear off, which happens sometimes. how much should i be fearing?

when does the felguard get axe toss? I wish the spellbook would show the spells he'll get later on.

also, can I get a macro pet attack to corruption or immolation or something? any tips on controlling, using the demon? Should I always health funnel when he's getting attacked?

should i be trying to drain health at all or is that a waste of time until higher levels? can someone describe the demo playstyle? How much should I be dotting and running, or multi-dotting, versus trying to nuke. Of course in wsg its often most useful to fear people all over the place.

also, when am gonna see some nice big numbers? (i know i'm not gonna see ret pally or rogue or war crits, but are there any brackets in which demos can burst ppl down real quick? The thing i miss about playing melee is all the 2/3 shots) Maybe when my felguard gets felstorm or w/e its called.

overall I'm enjoying the spec so far. I like playing the more unusual specs, and I feel like demo is one of the more interesting specs out there (and I'm hoping it is a good deal stronger than the moonkin at 85)

sorry for the rediculous list of questions, but in general any tips on low lvl demo pvp and on how we fare in the various brackets would be great

Post by Grindalwald

I'd recommend reading the stickies before posting threads. I'm sure most of your questions will be answered there. There are also multiple threads on the same basic topic, read those as well. If you have detailed questions, feel free to make a thread accordingly.

Post by Bucknastycow

umm really? there's not a single warlock pvp sticky. and certainly not anything that focuses on pvping at lower level brackets. what i want is spec/glyph/strategy tips for demo lock pvp... i don't feel like it's the most unreasonable request. now i'm sure some of the things i asked i could find if i went on a wild goose chase, but those are just details of the kind of information that would be helpful.

How about if someone simply characterized the demo pvp playstyle at lower levels, and maybe compared it to aff/destro? Wait, what are these forums for again?

Post by Bucknastycow

having looked at the leveling faq, it is out of date. I won't have incinerate for a long time.

also, the database says the felguard gets axe toss at 20 which doesn't appear to be true

finally, i have looked at all the recent demo threads and they do not have the information i'm looking for.

Post by Shellfish

If you're focusing on pvp more than pve (which tbh pve specs don't really matter that much in lower lvls than pvp specs), then I'd recommend taking 3/3 in Demonic Embrace. Also taking Demonic Rebirth is a very good decision since the felguard will be doing much of your damage. He shouldn't be dying more than once every 2 mns anyway. As for when to use soulburn thats a situational decision. If youre getting trained by a hunter Id recommend using it with a healthstone to buy a little more time for your felguard to kill him. In bgs its also safe to always use bane of doom even on people just passing (rogues especially, its worse for them than hunters mark). As for help with hunter twinks, thats just the life of low level pvp (hunters are so op early on). especially as a clothie.

As for your macro for a dot and petattack

#showtooltip corruption
/cast corruption
/petattack

That should do the trick, but beware, if there are multiple people It would be best to not use it. You want to be dotting people up while your felguard consistently attacks your main target. Until you get hand of gul'dan the playstyle will be more like destruction with a stronger pet. Thats when you'll start seeing bigger numbers as well. It roots the target and increases the pets crit chance. Hand of gul'dan + Felstorm will help you burn people fast. All in all I'd say pvp as demo is very hard early on. Your dots don't do a ton of damage and you don't really have much time to cast anything. A lot of questions, hope i could help a little. lol

Post by Bucknastycow

hey thanks for your response it was quite helpful. quîckben is 27 now :)
i ended up macroing /petattack to immolate because while questing my felguard grabs aggro by the time the cast finishes, this has made my life 100x easier. in pvp when i'm dotting i'm usually on the run so i dot ppl up with corruption/bane and use the macro to switch my felguard's target as needed.

does anyone know when i get axe toss? the extra peel will help a lot.

is it worth it in bgs to break out the succubus at times for the cc? i'm hesitant because i love my felguard

for glyphs i'm using felguard, soul link, and health funnel. i am considering switching to corruption but i think the extra legion strike damage ends up giving me more pressure

it is a little tough to get solo kills, and it is a little sad that my hardest hitting ability is a bane of doom crit, but all the dot ticks + felguard dmg adds up quick. of course it's nothing compared to aimed shot/ambush/templars verdict but I feel moderately threatening (not like playing spriest at low levels)

is it worth it using soulburn for the searing fire crits? is it worth it using searing fire at all? also, i take it that it's usually a better use of soulburns to use them for healthstone rather than drain life? more than anything staying alive is the biggest problem. i'm a goblin so the rocket jump often helps me get off a fear and run away ;)

it is kind of annoying that a prot pally's exorcism hits harder than a shadowbolt crit.

Post by Grindalwald

Haven't paid attention to these forums in a while, the stickies are usually kept up to date, pve ones anyway. A good pvp guide that is regularly updated is hard to find really.

A Demonology faq.
Probably some useful info for you here.
The pvp spec I use.

Couldn't find any good pvp guides for 4.0 or better. Find a good pvp lock in your guild and ask for some pointers. Hope any of this helped.

Post by civgw

does anyone know when i get axe toss? the extra peel will help a lot.

You get it at level 20.

Look at the Pet tab - bottom of the Spellbook - to find your Pet's abilities.

You will still be a lower level than I was when I found out.

Post by Bucknastycow

actually we get the fg charge at 20 and axe toss at 30. strangely, they wouldn't let me put it on my bar so i could bind it... i had to make a macro for it

my lock is 42 now :) loving hand of guldan.

i stil feel like i struggle to put out as much damage as other classes, although when i get a chance to cast away without people beating on me i quickly catch up.

for example, in an eye of the storm my damage done was middle of the pack, until I had an epic 1v1 inside the mage tower with a resto shaman which took forever. it seemed i wouldn't get out enough pressure to take him down, but i was ooming him. eventually a bane of doom crit lined up with a hand of guldan and he dropped like a sack of bricks. i checked the ranks after that and I was in the top two in damage done.

similarly, if i'm getting heals or theres a big battle going on (everyone's distracted) i can do a ton of damage.

anyway, if my damage is competent but underwhelming, the cc is amazing. I've never played a class that felt like I could completely shut someone down for a good amount of time, in between fear, deathcoil, axe toss, hand of guldan root (get the stun too if all works out)

a couple times I have felt like it would be useful to break out the ^&*! to charm somebody, but I had trouble figuring out the right way to use the ability in conjunction with the invisibility, or how the ai on the succubus works. how useful is the demonic empowerment vanish for getting off the charm?

i'm dutifully leveling up my herbalism for lifebloom. i macro'd lifeblood to soulburn and shadowbolt, but i think it might be better to macro it to hog

Post by Bucknastycow

oh another thing... hunters are still hard but getting easier. pallies are tough to take down but I can usually beat them if I save trinket for their stun. fighting warriors is lots of fun, because I can often solo them without them touching me.

overall right now, the class that I'm most threatened by is enhancement shamans. I have to work on baiting the wind shear with a fire spell because they always interrupt my fear and when they get on me I blow up in 2 seconds. ferals are pretty scary too when they get the jump.

It's sad to say (because my main is a boomkin), but whenever I see a moonkin I think "Oooh i'm gonna kill that!" and immediately put curse of tongues on it because I know that they're instantly gimped with that debuff.

also, for once, I don't crap my pants when I see a mage ;)

Post by Grindalwald

actually we get the fg charge at 20 and axe toss at 30. strangely, they wouldn't let me put it on my bar so i could bind it... i had to make a macro for it

anyway, if my damage is competent but underwhelming, the cc is amazing. I've never played a class that felt like I could completely shut someone down for a good amount of time, in between fear, deathcoil, axe toss, hand of guldan root (get the stun too if all works out)

All pet abilities will have to macroed to bind, you cant place a pet skill on your bars. A good macro to make is some thinglike
/cast Pursuit
/cast Spell Lock
/cast Whiplash
/cast Sacrifice
Depending on the demon it casts whatever spell. I use this one then have the rest of the demon skills macroed separately.

Hunters are pretty nasty up until lvl cap, invincible if twinked even a little. Get in thier face, and stay there as much as possible, cant hurt you in melee range.Boomkins are cake as lock generally, they have no answer for healthy doses of fear. Pallies can be tough if skilled, but generally have to out gear you to stand a chance, way out gear you.

Enhance is op untill 60, always have been. Warriors are the easiest class to beat if they aren't skilled. Can't remember but i don't think they get get battle charge till 38, untill then they suck at pvp. warriors are the most gear and skill dependent class in game. A good warrior is almost as bad to a lock as a good rogue. Mages can pwn locks, with luck. The battles are usually close.

Post by Bucknastycow

does anyone find it useful to use drain life as demo ever? It's one of my few ways to heal myself but the healing is pretty weak regardless, although it's not negligible.

Post by Grindalwald

does anyone find it useful to use drain life as demo ever? It's one of my few ways to heal myself but the healing is pretty weak regardless, although it's not negligible.

I would say no. Maybe in emergencies when you have to have some hp, any hp, now. I wouldn't try to use it with any regularity. Bandages and Soul Harvest will mean hp isn't a problem if managed right, and your felguard will keep aggro well enough you shouldn't take a whole lot of damage. Health Funnel should probably be used more than Drain Life.

Post by Bucknastycow

woohoo finally got metamorphosis, it's awesome. the first time i did a bg after getting it i had over double the damage of the second highest player. also, did alterac valley.... the aoe capabilities are insane.

anyway, what would you recommend doing when i pop meta immo aura and leap into a crowd of allies (to reap the most benefit from the extra sp)? Should I run around dotting people or should I try to nuke as much as possible?

Post by Grindalwald

I personally use meta for two things: when I get jumped by a hard hitting physical damage class and killing healers. You can get high damage by using immo aura in crowds but everyone likes to target the giant purple demon, use it wisely not suicidally. I'd say its most important for the bg to try and nuke the healers, you can keep a healer locked down from pretty good chunks of time, enough to kill it or let one or two of dps' die.

Leveling demo lock/low level pvp

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