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PTR
10.2.7
PTR
10.2.6
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Prot specc 4.0
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Post by
Varaconn
Yeah, CS will be your single-target HP generator, HoTR will be your AoE threat generator. HoTR hits like a wet noodle single-target now, so it's required.
That reminds me, I need to get out my DPS sword. I completely forgot about the way HoTR and CS scale with weapon damage and not DPS, the way HoTR used to.
Post by
299264
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
Even if it's weapon damage, it's probably
normalized
.
Post by
Varaconn
Actually, an amendment to my note about CS vs. HOTR. Apparently there's some concern over at MT that HoTR is currently hitting harder, even single target, than CS. This may be a per-weapon thing, or heavily dependent on current AP (Through vengeance) but it sounds like a bug. No matter what weapon/AP you haven, CS should be hitting harder single-target than HoTR.
Post by
blademeld
I don't have an active account, so I can't tell you.
But CS is a physical attack, whereas HotR has a Holy component, that might be part of it.
Post by
Raleandris
I don't know about CS being weaker than HotR. As far as I've seen in some raids the past couple of days, CS is the better single target ability, as is intuitive.
As far as actually tanking goes, it's a huge breath of fresh air. The rotation is completely different, and actually has a proc to look for! So far, I've got a couple of ideas on single target / aoe rotations / glyph setups.
Single Target:
This rotation focuses on as much HP as possible, by placing Crusader Strike at the very top of the priority list. Comes out to something like:
Crusader Strike (sub-3 HP) > Judgement (for Judgements of the Just) > 3 HP Shield of the Righteous > Avenger's Shield > Judgement > Hammer of Wrath > Consecration > Holy Wrath
You will want to glyph Focused Shield for single target encounters. This glyph will do
wonders
for your threat and DPS.
AoE Trash pack:
Hammer of the Righteous is very strong, I personally have it glyphed as well, and it ends up doing pretty well. I wouldn't say it was nerfed per se, just that it was changed to be more suited to AoE.
Hammer of the Righteous (no matter your HP) > Avenger's Shield > Consecration > Shield of the Righteous > Judgment > Hammer of Wrath > Holy Wrath
Depending on how long the trash pack lasts, you can just drop Consecration and spam HotR and Avenger's Shield (Grand Crusader procs quite a bit). And fill the gaps with Shield of the Righteous and Judgement for block and mana. When we get Inquisition, that should be the better way to spend holy power over ShotR.
Burn Target within a trash pack:
If you have a target that needs to be burned down in a trash pack, you'll probably need a bit more threat on it, so I would suggest using harder hitting single target abilities and spending your holy power a bit more aggressively:
HotR (sub-3 HP) > Avenger's Shield > Shield of the Righteous (3 HP) > Judgement > Consecration > Hammer of Wrath > Holy Wrath
Edit: As far as specs go, I'm personally rocking
This 0/33/3 build
. It doesn't have Divine Sacrifice (I'm not progression raiding currently), but if you want to pick it up, I'd suggest taking the point required out of Reckoning. I also haven't read
any
theorycrafting about paladins in 4.0.1, so take what I say with a grain of salt. I do however think, that for the most part, I'm roughly correct.
Post by
blademeld
So is it worth to spend
2 talent points
to have a 30% of it not consuming holy power if it's an oh %^&* button?
Is it worth it to spend
2 talent points
to increase it by 60%, create a protective shield and have it cause holy shield?
I was not taking much damage at all and the healers were having easy jobs. So in non progression content, I wonder how useful it is to spec into those 2 talents.
Also I saw some paladins with
Improved Judgement
but I don't really understand that. What's the use of that?
I don't think I really need
Divine Guardian
that much.
I think that might better than a chance of Word of Glory not consuming holy power (just seems lackluster to me).
Subjective, it gives you a 30% chance to use Word of Glory twice in a row.
Subjective, I write in my FAQ that you only need 1 point to get the protective shield (from what I read in the tooltips).
Probably not that important.
You get to hit your targets faster.
Divine Guardian is a Raid utility tool, I would take it in all cases, but in the end, it's up for you to decide if you want that tool.
Sounds reasonable.
Post by
Phototropic
The spec I've gone for at level 80 is this:
http://www.wowhead.com/talent#sMZGrhcRzdRMuc
The
2/2 Eternal Glory
I have found to proc very often indeed and, whilst mucking around with my guild's Holy Pala, managed to pull off 6 WoG's in a row... Quite an awesome thing, that.
The reason I've gone for
2/3 PotI
is so that I could ease our healer's job whilst he's still relearning the ropes, so to speak... With only the 2 points, I get healed for anywhere between 2.5k and 5k crit.
The only time I've had threat issue was when a Deathknight *in PoS normal* decided to give me 1/2 a second to generate enough threat so he could start his 10k dps rotation... He died 5 times, still didn't learn and so he left.
For the moment, I haven't got
Divine Guardian
as I haven't really done anything that will warrant the raid wall, asside from VoA10 on Toravan, though I was too busy trying to get the other tank to taunt from me and lowering my own threat enough so I didn't reach 7 stacks (again) to worry about the raid's health. I might end up dropping 1 point in
GbtL
if you still keep the, rather lack-luster, shield and stick it into the raid wall at some point in the future.
When we can level up, I might drop Eternal Glory altogether as Inquisition will likely become my best friend... Pick up Hallowed Ground instead, maybe?
How's reckoning working, anyone?
Edit = staying up too late previous night playing ¬_¬
Post by
Varaconn
Improved Judgements won't get you to your target faster unless you have Long Arm of the Law. I mean, you'll get that Judgement in on the way back, but realistically, the difference it makes would be negligible. I could see it helping with a mob slipping through to a healer from initial aggro, but I'm thinking a lot of people are probably taking it because of habit, not even checking what it does.
Doesn't Protector of the Innocent only affect heals that you cast?
Post by
93865
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
144586
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Phototropic
Doesn't Protector of the Innocent only affect heals that you cast?
Yeah, does indeed.. What I meant was that I was using WoG as an AoE threat ability for the huge pulls and, with the extra little heal on myself, it just helped the healer out a little bit whilst he was still working things out himself :)
As for Aestu's post... Woh, ignoring the opening statement, this one I actually found interesting and useful. Well done you, sir.
I had a feeling that Reckoning would still be pretty crappy, even with RF now affecting non-holy damage... But with it now being proc'd from chance on block and whether or not it has an ICD (no mention of 'can only happen once every x') it's surely not as useless as it once was?
Post by
144586
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
pezz
No EfaE, Aetsu? I understand your point about survivability > threat, but surely a point there is marginally better then a slightly shorter stun CD.
Post by
93865
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Dragonzero
oook, i have been throught 24hrs(redbull ftw lol) to figure out the rotation. im getting really close to get better rotation.
So here is for the single and trashs
Single> CS, WoG, CS, Judgement, CS, ShoR, | CS, Con/HW/AS, CS, Judgement, CS, ShoR
............{.......................2-3 HP......................} {.........................3 HP.........................}
AoE> HotR, WoG, HotR, Judgement, HotR, ShoR, | HoTR, Con/HW/AS, HotR, Judgement, HotR, ShoR
.........{...........................2-3 HP..........................} {............................3 HP..............................}
First
throw AS for the pull then do the rotation plus watch for AS proc by Grand Crusader then use it anywhere in the rotation. What u see here is "CS, WoG" and it is a starter to active the holy shield. There only need 1 time each fight for WoG after out of combat because u will do ShoR that refresh the holy shield during the fight. At the end of that rotation do 3 HP rotation all the way unit the mobs dead.
I hope it the right one or a little mess up.
Edited: When HP didn't consume after clear trash then keep it for next trashs then throw WoG to active HS :)
Post by
322291
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
blademeld
Yea, I think I'm going to go Tank/Tank on my paladin and stick with Holy/Ret on my second one.
Threat/AoE and Survivability/Single target, considering I probably won't play this year.
Post by
Varaconn
It'd be really cool if, given the new CHOOSE YOUR TREE system, we could shuffle a couple points around within our selected tree, using a reagent. No complete specialization change, but a re-ordering of talents. Make it an expensive vendor reagent. I'd stock up.
Post by
SlowSide
I've been using this for the past few days.
IMO it's kind of a toss up point wise between GbtL and EfaE, Both are gimmicky in different ways.
IE Dropping 6k damage for a 6k heal/bubble and all the issues that go with that.
OR a passive 40% chance to reflect a portion of magic damage at the caster.
GbtL takes more setup and sacrifice, such as you must be topped off for full effect, and should wait until just before a big hit. While usually predictable it means delaying the use of HP, and "wasting" charges in some cases. For example if you know a big hit will be in 10 seconds and have 3 HP now do you SotR, then WoG w/ 2 stacks, or wait and use WoG at 3 stacks while losing out on the 2 HP you could have gained? Or do you try to push for 3 stacks on WoG since it'll be right on the line and risk missing the chance completely because of a few hundred ms of lag?
I'm sure at 85 it may be useful, but at 80 I'd rather spend points elsewhere if possible. Once things are challenging again & healer mana starts mattering a lot. From what I've seen healer mana still tends to be a non issue at 80.
A 6k self heal / bubble doesn't seem worth the points since the chance of dieing in current content is so low and we have several other defensive CD's, for me helping shave 10 seconds off a boss fight from EfaE and using SotR constantly seems more beneficial.
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