This site makes extensive use of JavaScript.
Please enable JavaScript in your browser.
Live
PTR
10.2.7
PTR
10.2.6
Beta
3.1 2H Frost DPS build & rotation
Post Reply
Return to board index
Post by
Victarious
My apologies if someone has already thought of this. I didn't do an exhaustive search, but I browse the forums daily and haven't seen it before.
Spec:
http://ptr.wowhead.com/?talent=jfVMzZG0xxAbckf0VostfM
13/51/7 spec that I have seen before. Epidemic is needed, as you'll see.
I'm too lazy to link it, but you need the new Glyph of Disease that everyone's been talking about. For those not in the know, it causes your Pestilence ability to refresh disease durations on your primary target.
While this isn't a great option for Blood Knights, with their sexy new Death Strike and ghoul, it's great for Frost, since we don't care so much about the blood runes anyway. Using this glyph lets us stop using Icy Touch and Plague Strike, saving those runes for sweet sweet Obliterate.
So, we come to a rotation like this:
Start off with PS > IT > OB > BS > Pestilence. While it seems a bit redundant to use Pest right after we've diseased our mob, it sets that strike as the start of the 21-second disease timer. This lets us roll into our next step, which is:
OB > OB > OB
Just thinking about it gives me pleasure. Of course, we'll dump our Frost Strikes in after each trip through the rune bar. Okay, next time up we hit 'em with:
OB > OB > BS > Pestilence
and we're off and running. The beauty of it all is that since we're not using Icy Touch and Plague strike to spread diseases, we can hit 5 Oblits every two times through the rune bar. Of course, in AOE situations we can also Howling Blast, which is why I kept it in my build. Using Pestilence anyway will put diseases on all the mobs, which will make this a pretty good AOE build in addition to what might be a sick single-target DPS build.
DK isn't my main, so there might be some things I'm overlooking. And again, sorry if someone already brought this up and I missed it. But I feel like it could be a really great build and rotation, and I would love to hear opinions from some veteran DKs.
Post by
334662
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Victarious
Thanks for the feedback. I'm curious about Howling Blast and the new Razorice runeforging enchant; ever since it got moved to the end of the tree and the cooldown extended, I've been wondering if it might become more powerful than Oblit when fully Frost specced. I doubt it, but the change to Razorice (which I had no idea about) makes me wonder. I had a similar idea a few days ago, using the new Howling Blast glyph to cause Frost Fever and then working a similar rotation to the one I posted above, but using two Blood Strikes when your Blood runes come off CD, as opposed to a BS and a Pestilence. I don't know, I'll probably try both once the patch drops. In all likelihood a more conventional rotation will work better, but I figure it's worth a shot.
One thing:
"great for Frost, since we don't care so much about the blood runes anyway"
-Essentially false as we do use Blood Strikes to fuel Death Runes in most cases as it allows for extra Obliterates in cycle as well as continued dps, whereas Pestilence does not deal damage but spreads diseases in 3.1 but there's no reason to double Pestilence.
Understood, but the whole point of my rotation is that Pestilence will, according to the PTR talent calc, also proc a Death Rune thanks to Blood of the North, which allows for extra Obliterates. I'm not sure what you mean about doubling Pestilence, either; the rotation (after the initial PS-IT-OB-BS-Pest) is OB > OB > OB, OB > OB > BS > Pest. I figure with the changes in 3.1 which (I believe) improve the effectiveness of having both diseases up when using Oblit, this would result in a net gain of DPS. I agree that the two points in Vicious Strikes are useless, but you need them for Epidemic, which gives you 21 second diseases, so once your diseases are up, you never have to reapply. Hopefully that makes sense.
Post by
334662
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Victarious
Crazy, I knew you'd lose out on Rime procs but I had no idea IT was such a big part of Frost DPS. Thanks for the info.
Post by
334662
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Victarious
BUMPZOR~
So
mmo-champion's talent calculator
is saying now that Rime procs off of Obliterate, and NOT Icy Touch as per the previous. Should this change make it to live, I'm now thinking this build is way more viable. The thought also occurs to me to take
Glyph of Howling Blast
as opposed to the disease glyph, and roll with a single-disease build, subbing in a second Blood Strike in my rotation where pestilence used to be. Any comments would be appreciated!
EDIT: Thought about it some more while I worked (um, I mean, I was focused on work?) and I'm more and more liking Glyphing HB and running with the following:
HB (which causes Frost Fever) > OB > BS > BS > dump
OB > OB > OB > dump
OB > OB > BS > BS > dump
OB > OB > OB > dump
and on into infinity. That way you don't need to worry about keeping your rotation super tight; you can unleash 3 or 4 Frost Strikes between cycles and still refresh Frost Fever whenevr needed. You'll hit a ton of HBs and FSs to capitalize on the new Razorice, and still hit an obscene number of Obliterates.
So, any thoughts on that would be appreciated.
Post by
Victarious
Oh, also. Since this new build doesn't use Blood Plague or need Epidemic, a
17/51/3
spec is much better suited to the task. As long as you hit HB once every 15 seconds, you're golden.
Post by
Aazed
BUMPZOR~
So
mmo-champion's talent calculator
is saying now that Rime procs off of Obliterate, and NOT Icy Touch as per the previous. Should this change make it to live, I'm now thinking this build is way more viable. The thought also occurs to me to take
Glyph of Howling Blast
as opposed to the disease glyph, and roll with a single-disease build, subbing in a second Blood Strike in my rotation where pestilence used to be. Any comments would be appreciated!
EDIT: Thought about it some more while I worked (um, I mean, I was focused on work?) and I'm more and more liking Glyphing HB and running with the following:
HB (which causes Frost Fever) > OB > BS > BS > dump
OB > OB > OB > dump
OB > OB > BS > BS > dump
OB > OB > OB > dump
and on into infinity. That way you don't need to worry about keeping your rotation super tight; you can unleash 3 or 4 Frost Strikes between cycles and still refresh Frost Fever whenevr needed. You'll hit a ton of HBs and FSs to capitalize on the new Razorice, and still hit an obscene number of Obliterates.
So, any thoughts on that would be appreciated.
Since Blood is getting hit by the nerf-bat, I'm considering going for this exact spec. Luckily, Malygos and Sapphiron won't be as raided as they are now, so Frost should be quite viable in Ulduar.
Post by
334662
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Victarious
I see what you're saying with the weaving of Frost Strikes, makes a lot of sense. One question I did have, and this is probably going to make me sound like a n00b-extrordinaire, but was about Icy Touch crit chance. Because I keep going over the talent calc, and there's a lot of talents to increase Oblit's crit chance, and not as much that *I* can see for IT. Is it a set bonus thing, or are you on a different build? I wish I were big (which is to say, 80 and raiding) so I could get firsthand knowledge, but from what I can put together, Oblit's crit chance is higher. Not that you still wouldn't use Icy Touch if the damage is comparable. I get what you're saying, and it makes sense, you'll do more damage. I guess, at the end of the day, I mark out for the big huge OB strikes. My cross to bear :)
Oh, also. Do you think Fallen Crusader might benefit this spec more, or is Razorice too good on the PTR right now? My thought was that between OB and BS, this rotation does also do a lot of physical damage.
Post by
334662
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Victarious
BUT, as fas as IT's ability to slow attach speed and proc Icy Talons, it's actually the Frost Fever doing that, and so if you DO glyph Howling Blast, you get your FF from there and IT's stock falls a point. But again, yeah, if the damage is comparable it makes sense to weave it in.
I was also thinking of doing closer to a "standard" Frost 2H rotation. If you're recommending to sub out 1 OB every other time for two ITs, what we could do is use Blood Tap and then:
IT > BS > OB > OB > dump
BS > IT > OB > OB > dump
ad infinitum, with Frost Strikes weaved in as you said before. This spreads out the ITs a little more, and has the added benefit of keeping Frost Fever up WITHOUT glyphing HB, so you can glyph IT, giving more RP. More I think about it, this does seem optimal. I'm definitely going to TRY an IT-less rotation, though, in dungeons and eventually raids once the patch drops, just for fun and to see if it's somewhat viable.
EDIT: Oh, snap. Just saw
this
on the PTR site. How does it stack up to either Awareness or Frozen Conscience? Because -- and not to show a pro-Oblit bias or anything :) -- I feel like you'll be doing more OBs and FSs than ITs, which means you might want this over Frozen Conscience, which, again, lowers IT's stock a bit. Not saying you STILL wouldn't weave it into your build; just curious on opinions.
Post by
334662
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Victarious
Wow, okay. I thought I understood before, but clearly not. But I get it now. You don't just weave FS in to capitalize on KM and keep flow steady; you use it every time it's up, so you should never be RP capped, and that's why RP generation is such a big deal. I probably should have understood a while back, but for whatever reason it all just clicked into place.
I'm still thinking Vengeful Heart might be the way to go, regardless of presence, though clearly you would know better than I. But as you said, it will require testing. But with Glacier Rot, Black Ice, Killing Machine, and so on, Frost Strike gets a LOT of bonus damage, so I might think buffing it as much as possible would be optimal. It also depends how often you're using it in comparison to Oblit, but I know that even without the Glyph of IT I'm not hurting for RP, and with it and working IT into my rotation I would think I could fire off a lot of them, possibly making it worthwhile.
Lynri, thanks for all your advice, I definitely feel I understand the class and spec much better now. I'm psyched for 3.1 (and to level the @#$% up) so I can actually test this stuff out. If anyone else has any opinions or thoughts, please, by all means share with the rest of the class.
Post by
143748
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
309174
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
Victarious
Spec:
http://ptr.wowhead.com/?talent=jfVMzZG0xxAbckf0VostfM
13/51/7 spec that I have seen before. Epidemic is needed, as you'll see.
Vic, you do not need Epidemic because you would be using glyph of HB to refresh FF. Drop the 2 points in Epi and Vicious Strike and put them all in Dark Conviction.
Indeed. Earlier in the thread I was considering a different build -- this was a few days ago, before the change to Rime, and before I was aware of a lot of the things going on in the PTR. I'm definitely going for a 17/51/3 with the points allocated as you said. But thanks! Also, cool to hear some test numbers, especially from someone working a completely IT-free rotation, which is where my mind went right away. I'd love to hear your results from a 2-disease test or any other variations you come up with.
Post by
334662
This post was from a user who has deleted their account.
Post by
rudebear
Crazy, I knew you'd lose out on Rime procs but I had no idea IT was such a big part of Frost DPS. Thanks for the info.
Rime's been changed to proc through OB according to the PTR talent tree...
Post Reply
You are not logged in. Please
log in
to post a reply or
register
if you don't already have an account.